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  1. Hello All, This is my first thread at this forum, so I'm sorry if I missed some rules. I'm not a native speaker, but live in UK, so my apologise for any grammar or spelling mistakes. I have received Parking Charge Notice from Euro Car Parks. I will try to answer question posted by "silverfox1961" to explain what happened and what I did. 1 Date of the infringement On 1st July 2017 I parked at Solent Retail Park in Havant to go with my wife for shopping. We were there few times before, but never noticed any information that there is a maximum stay time. because I am not from Havant I cannot check right now what is the allowed parking time, but I assumed it is 2 hours. From the letter I received I see that I exceeded this time by 45 minutes. They are asking me now for £90 or £50 if paid in 14 days. 2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] Letter was issued on 12th July. 3 Date received Because I leased the car form my company letter from ECP was sent first to them and then I got an email and printed version on 14th July (I think my company received it at the same day). 4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [y/n?] Yes. 5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? Document encloses only pictures of car's registration plates. 6 Have you appealed? {y/n?] post up you appeal] Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up No, I have not appeal yet. 7 Who is the parking company? Euro Car Parks 8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Solent Retail Park - Havant -Car Park 2 4-7 Solent Retail Park Solent Road Hampshire PO9 1ND 9. For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under. There are two official bodies, the BPA and the IAS. ECP is a member of BPA. 10. If you have received any other correspondence, please mention it her. No other correspondence. I will be very grateful for help, what should I do now. I can attach pdf of a letter from ECP if needed. Regards Lukasz
  2. Hi Just before christmas received a letter from Euro Car Parts Stating that wife had parked on Kay St Bolton car park without attatching a paid ticket on the window i phoned them stating i have never parked on this car and do not intend on parking here ever never spoke to such rude people. after 10 minutes of arguing with a sarcastic person down the phone i was told to appeal which i havent i instead sent an email to their CEO office also a person who doesnt reply to his emails he receives. They claim my wife parked there between 13:47 and 15:00 and didnt display a paid ticket on the window she has told me she has not been in this car park and cut through just to avoid the build up of traffic on the same road but she never parked there or stopped in this car park sent their ceo a nice email politely asking for the CCTV images of her entering the car park, parking up the car and walking off without paying for a ticket and also at 15:00 an image of her getting back into the car and driving away just as exepected no reply off him sent the same email twice. Today another letter comes through saying the 40 pound discount has passed and i now owe them £100 to be paid in 28 days or they will instruct a debt collector. This company sounds like an utter joke What steps shall i take now as they refuse to email me back. im just disgusted at how they think they can obtain my details through my registration and my address
  3. Hi Everyone, Hopefully someone will be able to help me with this. I recently received a Parking Charge Notice for parking in a bay which, to anyone with an ounce of brain, will seem fine parking. But the Patrol Officer woke up on the wrong side of the bed on the day so issued me with a PCN. I appealed the PCN on their website using the online facility, but they sent me a rejection letter. The appeal letter I sent was based on 2 arguments: The alleged contravention did not occur Quite simply, the parking attendant got it wrong and the vehicle was not parked inappropriately at the time the ticket was issued. The Patrol Officer alleges that the vehicle was ‘Not parked correctly within the markings of the bay or space’. I can assure you, as evident from the pictures below, that the vehicle was indeed parked within the markings. Please see attached photos of the vehicle from various angles, as proof of my claim. Absence of ‘No Parking’ Markings The signage around the parking site clearly indicate the terms & conditions of ‘No Parking’ locations as being marked with Red/Yellow lines or hatched markings – none of which were present in the bay I parked. I am now preparing to contest this on IAS website. Please review the pictures below and let me know whether I am in the wrong or what is the best route/wording to contest this PCN. Your help will be greatly appreciated. Thank you Regards Nak Apologies for the below links - the forum wont allow me to post links or pictures directly. h t t p s://i.imgur.com/88VLlOJ.jpg h t t p s://i.imgur.com/rTNRl3d.jpg h t t p s://i.imgur.com/uFwPz9C.jpg h t t p s://i.imgur.com/OFzS8rf.jpg This is their response to my appeal. Thank you for your appeal received on 30/03/2017 regarding the Parking Charge Notice referred to above. We have reviewed your appeal and in doing so, we took into account the representations that you made in support of your appeal as well as evidence which was submitted by the parking attendant. We reached the decision that in this instance, the Parking Charge was issued correctly for the following reason The terms and conditions of use of the car park are clearly stated on the signs prominently displayed around the car park, these include vehicles must park within marked bays and and not park in such a way as to cause obstruction to others. According to our records your vehicle was incorrectly parked, we have no option but to reject this appeal. The signs are prominently displayed in and around the site and are obvious to any person who enters the site. It is incumbent upon motorists to read them. If they choose to ignore them then they submit to the terms nonetheless. We are therefore unable to cancel the Parking Charge Notice as it was issued correctly. We have now extended the discounted payment period by 14 days to allow you time to pay the discounted settlement amount. Please now make payment of £60 to reach us by 18/04/2017 or £100 to reach us by 02/05/2017. We must advise you that once the discounted settlement rate passes it will not be offered again. If you believe this decision is incorrect, you are entitled to appeal to the Independent Appeals Service (IAS). If you believe this decision is incorrect, you are entitled to appeal to the Independent Appeals Service (IAS). The Independent Appeals Service provides an Alternative Dispute Resolution scheme for disputes of this type. As you have complied with our internal appeals procedure you may use, and we will engage with, the IAS Standard Appeals Service providing you lodge an appeal to them within 21 days of this rejection. In order to appeal, you will need your parking charge number, your vehicle registration and the date the charge was originally issued. However, if you choose this option your Parking Charge will automatically increase to £100. Please visit for full details. Payments can be made by cheque or postal order made payable to Euro Parking Services Ltd. Please ensure you write your Parking Charge Notice number clearly on the reverse. Please do not send cash through the post. Payment can be made using a debit or credit card. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- After appealing to IAS using the advice above, I have had my appeal challenged by Euro Parking Services; my initial appeal to IAS and their response is below. (Sorry about the picture links, I still can't post links here) My appeal The alleged contravention did not occur. The parking attendant got it wrong as the vehicle was not parked inappropriately at the time the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) was issued. The attendant alleges that the vehicle was 'Not parked correctly within the markings of the bay or space'. I can assure you, as evident from the pictures attached, that the vehicle was indeed parked within the markings. The non-parking bays are clearly marked with hatched markings around the carpark; please refer to Aerial view of the carpark for hatched areas. If the bay was a non-parking location, it should have been clearly marked with hatched markings to indicate so. My evidence - In addition to the pictures in my first post, I uploaded the aerial view with the hatched markings. h t t p s://i.imgur.com/3r9T3sm.jpg Euro Parking Services The operator made their Prima Facie Case on 17/04/2017 16:08:38. The Operator Reported That... The appellant was the driver. The appellant was the keeper. The operator is seeking keeper liability in accordance with PoFA.. The ticket was issued on 28/03/2017. The charge is based in Contract. The Operator Made The Following Comments... The contravention at issue here is that the Appellant’s car was "Not parked correctly within the markings of the bay or space". This is in reference to our terms and conditions which are clearly and prominently displayed at the car park in question. The specific term of the contract that the Appellant was in breach of states that; "Vehicles must be parked wholly WITHIN the confines of a MARKED bay or space". It cannot be said that the Appellant's vehicle was parked WITHIN the confines of a MARKED bay or space when the space they parked their car in was not “marked” as such. Photographic evidence of the Appellant's car we have submitted clearly shows corroborates our argument that it was not parked in a marked bay or space. I have taken note of what the Appellant says that "there are no hatched markings on the ground" presumably of the bay he/she parked in. For avoidance of doubt, it cannot be said that the Appellant parked within the confines of a marked bay or space, within the definition given and graphically illustrated in our signage prominently displayed in this car park. Further, we have included photographs showing marked bays. These show specifically white lines on both sides of a marked bay. The Appellant is deemed to have accepted our terms when they parked their car on this site, especially as they admit that they saw the our signage. Clearly, they had not complied with our terms and conditions in parking their car in a place not marked as a bay or space. We submit therefore that the Parking Charge Notice was correctly issued and that we submit that the Appeal should be dismissed. EPC Evidence - h t t p s://i.imgur.com/CP6Z6Xk.jpg h t t p s://i.imgur.com/3ktLWCe.png h t t p s://i.imgur.com/czzwvL1.png h t t p s://i.imgur.com/Bh88Ekf.png h t t p s://i.imgur.com/LXCLFYa.png h t t p s://i.imgur.com/WBolzMo.png I am now not sure what to do next as IAS website suggest the following 2 options. 1) SUBMIT YOUR RESPONSE - You can respond to the evidence by making any representations that you consider to be relevant as to the lawfulness of the charge any by uploading any extra photographs or other evidence that you may have. After you submit your response, and the operator doesn't provide any more information you will not have the ability to add to or amend your submission. If the operator provides more information or evidence you will then have another chance to respond. You have until 24/04/2017 23:59 to submit your response if this is the route you wish to take. - OR - 2) REFER THE CASE STRAIGHT TO ARBITRATION - If you think you do not need to add any more information or evidence, for example if you consider that the information provided is not capable of showing that you are, on the face of it, responsible for the parking charge, then you may choose this option. Neither party will have the opportunity of making more representations and the Adjudicator will decide, on the balance of probabilities, whether you are liable for the parking charge. I only have till midnight today to make a decision. I would appreciate your response. Thank you
  4. received notice to keeper from euro car parks (its my husbands but he wont be home till tomorrow night ) I've scanned it but no idea how to put it on here or remove his personal information (but I am trying) it says failure to adhere to signage on site it also says the driver has failed to pay the notice amount within the time specified so its increased to £90 we haven't had any other letters from them and nothing left on the car can you tell me what I do next please thanks Scan0029.pdf
  5. Hi Guys, Another case of NTK for over 3 hour stay at Bishop Centre Taplow from Euro Car parks. I received letter in the post to registered keeper with photo of my number plate at entering and leaving times. Unfortunately my partner did exceed the 3hr free parking time stay there. But done bit of shopping there which would be visible on the bank statement. I am preparing appeal to the ECP in hope they will cancel their invoice. Can you suggest any more legal wording I could add to the below draft? Dear Euro Car Parks As keeper of the vehicle, registration XXXX XXX, I have received your invoice number xxxxxx. The driver at the time tells me that they did substantial shopping at several shops in Bishop Centre and that they are therefore not liable to pay you any money. Please find attached redacted bank statement with charges from Tesco and TK Maxx confirming they were legitimate customers and to substantiate their length of stay on site. I kindly ask you to allow this appeal on above mentioned grounds. Should you decide to reject this appeal, please issue me with a valid POPLA code. At POPLA I shall be requesting breakdown of the genuine pre estimate of loss that you charge must represent. Since it was a free car park and not filled to 75% percent at the time there was no loss. Look forward to hearing from you, Registered Keeper
  6. I was driving in Hungary last summer and paid to drive on the motorway like i did the year before, i then received a letter from Euro Carparks EPC stating that i had been fine £54 but it was not clear what it was for t hey sent me picture photos, I tried to telephone them put after several attempts gave up because no one answered i email them and they took a couple for weeks to reply they said I had not paid the correct toll for my vehicle, I paid the fine and then received a letter stating that it had gone up to £185. because i had paid the fine i ignored one month late I get another letter stating that I had paid no fine and owed £185 and that it had to be paid by the 28th March, I emailed them and sent a recorded letter as advised to do by CAB. and again I waited a week until I received an email stating that I now owe £127. and I quote on this email it said ''Please note that any further communication which does not contain new pertinent information or evidence will not be entertained or replied to. Where do I stand do I pay it and put it down to experience or where do I stand if i don't pay it.
  7. Hi all We have received two PCN's from a Euro Car Park - members of BPA demanding payment of £100 each for both mine and my husband's cars. The date issued is 17/12/2016. I cannot recall the full details of the incident so I am relying on their evidence to advise me - however it looks to be very lacking in detail with simply an images of my number plate twice with text underneath it alleging the time of entry and exit. Now this does not seem sufficient to me but you tell me.... Is there advise on the best route of action to take as this is the first letter from them i want to deal with the matter asap but do not want to pay. is there a thread on here that i might've missed that talks about what to do Many thanks Tam
  8. Can any knowledgeable Cagger tell me if it is possible to initiate a chargeback on a Euro bank transfer from a UK bank account to one in the Euro zone? This is because of a retail transaction that went pear shaped and the seller is refusing to communicate.
  9. Hi, I've received a PCN today from Euro Car Parks as my car was parked at their York store for 3 hours 31 minutes a few days ago, time limit is 3 hours. Yes, the car was there for that length of time, though I will not be stating here or anywhere else who was driving the car at the time (there are several people it could potentially be). The driver of the car did do shopping there during the visit, but did also do a few other things in and around the site of the car park during that time. I'm not sure yet if receipts are available to back this up, although 2 of the potential drivers share a "Morrisons More" loyalty card which will show purchases registered during that time period. The letter I have (as keeper) is "demanding" £85, or £50 if paid within 14 days. The letter shows 2 photographs of my registration plate, with typed text below stating the entry and exit times. I've searched the forum for similar Morrisons time period exceeded messages and most are old enough for me not to be sure if they contain the best current advice, so would be grateful if anyone here could give the best course of action I should take please. I have an address/email address for Morrisons head office customer services if I need to go down that route (any set text available for making the best case direct to Morrisons?). If its relevant, I've seen some messages here giving differing views on which associations Euro Car Parks belongs to. This letter clearly shows them claiming to be members of the BPA if that helps? Thanks in advance!
  10. Having sorted my wife's charge at Morrisons, now trying to do same with Sainsburys and Euro Car Parks. ECP sent the initial parking charge, "issued" 10th February, letter dated 16th February. Interesting thing was that there was no first name on the letter. There are two of us here at this address, my son and myself, so the person to whom it was addressed was ambiguous. In my view they had not written to me. A second letter, headed notice to keeper was dated 9th March. Again no first names, only surname. I then heard nothing until a letter from Debt Recovery Plus was received, dated 7th May. This letter was addressed to me, and headed *Notice of Intended Court Action" which of course it was not. they demanded £130, £60 more than the alleged original charge. This letter referred to a letter dated 14th April, which I had not received. Wording was curious - "If you are liable for this charge and do not pay the full amount...." and threatening to pass a file to the creditors solicitor with a recommendation to commence court action. I replied to this letter saying, I had not received a pcn, nor a notice to keeper, nor a notice of keeper liability. I disputed the "debt", said they had not complied with the BPA Code of Practice, told them I would be writing to the landowner, which I have, and telling them if I had no response within 14 days I would consider this an indication that the matter was closed. This prompted a written, rather than a form letter, explaining some tosh about the BPA Code of Practice, quoting Clause 22.7 (incorrectly) about challenges not being possible, referring to the pre-court action code of conduct (irrelevant at this stage) with a comment that they were trying to resolve the matter amicably (strange given that the tone of their other letters was anything but amicable) and mentioning Beavis vs Parking Eye as a "landmark Case" and alleging that they believe that similar conditions applied (I think not as I understand it). They finally said that they may not reply to any further correspondence if it didn't provide further "evidence" I am drafting a further response and will thank them for not writing further to me and tell them I won't be writing to them again. I have written to Sainsburys but cannot believe the response I have got. We were actually customers at the store and I submitted receipts to show this, we also used our nectar card. It was answered by their customer services "Careline" - more like "Don't Careline" - saying that they did own the car park, but "would not be able to overturn the charge" which I know to be not true. They did thank me for taking the time to contact them! There will be a follow up letter addressed personally to their CEO. Interested to receive any comments from anyone. How would my view that ECP have not written to me because they only used second names in the initial letters stand up? thanks
  11. I have received a letter from Euro car parks for overstaying in a car park. This was in Scotland but the company is an English based company do I have to pay this invoice?
  12. It seems my car overstayed in a free car at Morrisons and now have a "Parking Charge Notice" (PCN) yes this is what is called even though I am fully aware it is nothing more than a speculative invoice. Does this invalidate it if indeed it could be classed as valid in the first place The driver and party visited to do weekly shop - had a tea in the stores restaurant on the way in, then did the shop then decided to have a meal at the restaurant to save cooking dinner when they got back home. They had not realised that the time allowed had recently been reduced to 2 hours so by the time they exited they had been in the free carpark owned by Morrisons for nearly 3 hours. It is Euro Car Parks with a date of issue of the 27th Feb however they do give a from date of the 7th March.. .. it has only just arrived today (11th) In the past on the rare occasions I have received these I have just ignored the threratograms but I gather law may have changed. I was not the driver as what in my workshop with a client and I do not see why I should name the person who was driving - all the photos show is the number plate. The vehicle is insured for several drivers Looking on Google I can see a poster stating that the hours have been reduced to two hours but it is not in a position where it would be seen easily if driver is concentrating on the road ahead (as he or she should be) - if you need to look it is Morrisons store, and car park entrance is in Pegler way, Crawley West Sussex Advice please of how best to tackle this - i.e. play their game and get an appeal refusal and give them the cost of the POPLA route or just ignore them
  13. Issued today (again to 'er indoors), and altho there are 'mitigating circumstances' for her egregious lack of consideration for those less mobile, I don't wanna offer them at the moment for fear of appearing to excuse her reprehensible behaviour. It was a Morrisons car park, free to use for 2 hrs, and I'm the RK. I'm going to await the NTK as usual, but at this stage (at the risk of being a bit previous), just wanted to know the current position regarding disabled bays in private car parks, and the extent of driver ID disclosure required by law. So, 1. Is it still the case that disabled bays on private land are not legally enforceable (so presumably no locus standi?), and 2. When I get the NTK, am I obliged to tell them who the driver was at the time of the alleged infraction? If no to 2., then presumably my response to the NTK will be the usual 'please take the matter up with the driver, and I'm only giving you 3 guesses....... .....etc'?
  14. I have just recieved a parking notice for £70 for parking 14mins extra in a 2 hours free parking zone in the water front retail park in greenock, scotland. we had taken our grand children swimming then walked with them round the retail park we have been given 28 days to pay.. .we believe we were not more than 2 hours in the parking area, and my friends were parked for the same length of time and have not recieved a charge. we have no way of knowing if this company is genuine, as we were on holiday for a mid week break staying nearby in weymes bay. what are our rights and do we pay or not. the letter says if we pay straight away within 14 days the £70 is discounted to £40. is there a way too find out if this is legal in scotland. please any advice would help us.. ...thx
  15. Hi All, A month ago, I traded up an old car which had a personalised plate (Let's call it A12 OLD). The new one came with a standard one (XY65 NEW). It took about 5 days from the day I drove away the new car, to get the DVLA red tape sorted (documents received etc) so the garage could put A12 OLD on the new car. At the block of flats where I live is a car park, and each vehicle that "lives" there gets a permit, which bears the registration of the vehicle. It's managed by a company called Euro Parking Services Ltd. We put a note on the dashboard explaining the situation, and put the permit on the dashboard as always. But still, on the 3rd Day, we got a parking ticket. I've appealed this to the company (showing them the letter from the DVLA which explains that "A12 OLD can now be put on XY65 NEW") and they have rejected it. I have also gone through the IAS (Independent Appeals Service), and they have rejected the appeal. I've got all the documents since day 1, and I'll happily answer any questions. As an aside, the company's address is just up the road, is there any value in walking up there and having a face-to-face conversation with someone? Or should I just ignore it?
  16. Imagine some Eurocrat with his finger on the nuclear trigger. If the EU gets its way, it may soon be a possibility. There is a saying amongst diplomats that the EU is an economic giant but a military pigmy. This accusation stings the Europhiles so much that they have decided to address this and create a European Army. As if an army of bureaucrats wasn’t bad enough, now they want to have an actual army as well. Post Lisbon, the EU has harboured fantasies of being a militarised superpower able to project its ‘values’ throughout the world. It now oversees operations with 2,800 troops deployed. Many of these missions, conveniently, have a ‘dual purpose’. That is, that appear to be civilian-military co-operation when in actual fact they are heavily militarised and weaponised. They are also in some of the world’s most sensitive trouble spots like Kosovo and Gaza. British participation in an EU army was agreed at St Malo in 1998, where Tony Blair agreed in principle to an EU army. He did this because he was trying to be seen as a ‘good European’ in light of his desire to be a future EU president. Also, he believed that by agreeing to an EU Army, he could use that as a good will gesture to get France to agree to sweeping CAP reform, knowing that CAP was an unpopular scheme with the UK electorate. France (shockingly) did no such thing, but Blair had already committed. The German think-tank, the EU-funded Konrad Adenauer Foundation, has argued that Germany can get its Euro Army by a different tactic. Instead of going for a Euro Army at one fell swoop, it aims to create ‘islands of co-operation’. That is, to persuade smaller countries in Eastern and Central Europe too co-operate with Germany in creating smaller building blocks of a Euro Army which at a later date can be put together. Given Germany’s economic dominance of these countries, it can easily ‘persuade ‘them to co-operate. In mid-2012, the Foreign Ministers group of the Future of Europe Group produced a report. This is a group of 11 foreign ministers from important EU states, but not the UK. The report calls for the creation of a European Army, with a veiled threat to a UK veto in the Council. The report states it wishes to “introduce more majority decisions in the CFSP (Common Foreign and Security Policy) sphere or at least prevent one single member state from being able to obstruct initiatives”. Guess which member state they mean! Clearly the core EU states know how unpopular a Euro Army would be in Britain, so are making moves to render Britain’s opinion irrelevant. So much for our famed ‘influence ‘in the EU institutions. In October 2013, a spokesman for the British Foreign Service told the international security journal, Courcy’s Intelligence Brief, that “today there is in London a genuine desire and commitment to making CSDP (Common Security and Defence Policy) as effective as possible in supporting international security and protecting Britain’s and Europe’s borders from potential threats. We are now increasingly aware of the helpful role the EU can play in bringing to bear the common will of 28 of the world’s most advanced economies.” This suggests that amongst the Whitehall Mandarins there is a growing appetite to form a Euro Army. The successor to Baroness Ashton is Polish diplomat Radek Skorski. He has said that since America is no longer willing or interested in security crises at Europe’s borders, the EU has to militarise itself so as to deal with these crises. He argues that the EU’s Operation Atalanta against Somali piracy saw a drop in attacks of 70%. In actual fact, the drop was due to aggressive Russian, Chinese, Indian and American anti-piracy patrols. They have a slightly more simple method of dealing with armed pirates, and it doesn’t involve briefing them in detail on their human rights. This reminds me, when I think of the young men and women who died in the British Army. One source of comfort for the family members is that that died fighting for Queen and Country. Very few British mothers would be comforted knowing their loved one died for Herman Van Rompuy and the Single Market.
  17. Hi everyone, and before starting with my request I would like to thanks everyone for their times on helping on the forum. We received a PCN on the 4/03/15 (see doc attached) asking for £70 discounted by £40 if paid within 2 weeks. My wife didn't realised that she couldn't stay longer than 2h. I contacted sainsburys who told me that they were not responsible for the car park therefore I should contact ECP. Yesterday we received the Notice to Keeper dated 24/03/15 (see attached) asking for £70 with a £1.5 handing charge if paid online! My wife is 38 weeks pregnant and takes her time when shopping. To be honest she just didn't know! I find this, out of order to be charged £70 for over staying by one hour, specially when she parks there to mainly shop at Sainsburys! Can I fight this ticket? If so, is it ok to send this? Dear Euro Car Parks As keeper of the vehicle, registration XXXX XXX, I have received your invoice number xxxxxx. The driver at the time tells me that as a regular customer of sainsburys they never realised the 2h time limits as there isn't any barrier in that car park or clear sign when you drive in,and that they are therefore not liable to pay you any money. Therefore I ask that you allow this appeal on those grounds. If you reject this appeal, please issue me with a valid POPLAicon code. Yours Recorded Keeper.
  18. Hello, I have just received a "Notice to Keeper" from Euro Car Parks demanding payment of an £80 parking charge for overstaying my allotted time by 15 minutes in a private car park in Wish Street, Rye, on 28/05/2015. I did have a previous letter on 06/06/2015 requesting the Parking Charge, and, after reading many various posts on the board, decided to take the general advice given regarding 'speculative invoices', decided to ignore it. That was before I realised that the Law was changed in 2012 making the Registered Keeper ultimately liable for the charge, and that the "just ignore it" advice was in given in posts that preceded that date! I did overstay my limit, but I have reservations about the legality of their payment demand, as they have not substantiated the actual loss to the landowner, and they also impose various financial penalties for certain payment methods. I propose to reply to them stating that their demand is illegal for the following reasons:- 1. The charge is disproportionate and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss. The amount charged is not based upon any genuine pre-estimate of loss to the company or the landowner. According to the Unfair Consumer Contract Regulations, parking charges on private land must not exceed the cost to the landowner during the period the motorist is parked there. In this case, the £80 charge being demanded far exceeds the cost to the landowner of the vehicle overstaying the time paid for by 15 minutes. It is in fact disputable that any actual loss was incurred by the landowner, as there were many unoccupied spaces in the car park during the last twenty minutes that the vehicle was there. 2. Your stated Payment Options contain unlawful financial demands. The additional charges that you levy (£1.50 for payment online and £2.50 for paying by cheque) constitute an unconscionable act, thus rendering the formation of any contract that may have been made with your company null and void. Would any of you kind experts on these matters please comment on my proposed reply to them, and possibly suggest any improvements that I might make? As a newcomer to this forum, I would greatly appreciate any assistance regarding this matter. Thanks and regards
  19. Hi, Just received a parking charge notice from Euro car Parks for £80 or £40 reduced if paid in 14 days. Thing is, we were in the car park for exactly 2 hours to the minute, as evidenced from their entrance and exit photos. However, we did not buy a ticket at the time as on our way to the parking ticket machine we were given a valid parking ticket, which we innocently accepted, by another motorist as they were leaving the car park early. This ticket still had more than two hours on it. So, effectively we had displayed a valid parking ticket all the time we were in the car park. I am sure this has happened to others! Unfortunately, we disposed of the ticket when we left as, like normal people do, we believed we had parked legally and were within the time of the ticket. We did not get a ticket on the window from an attendant whilst there. However, the parking Charge Notice states that 'no valid pay and display/permit was purchased'. This PCN was received in the post and is dated 10 days after we commited the 'offence'. legally, as far as we are concerned, we displayed a valid car park ticket although we no longer have it as evidence. But we ourselves did not pay for it. We are thinking of appealing as surely it is up to them to prove we hadn't bought a ticket? Without returning to the car park I am not sure how they knew or whether it is a ticket machine where you have to put in your reg number. Also, I think we can appeal under the grounds of a disproportionate charge. Or shall I just pay up? still within the first 14 days so would be £40 not £80. Any advice gratefully accepted!
  20. Hi all, First time poster, I've seen some similar threads, but none quite match my situation so I thought best to check with your fine selves before acting. I may even have been informed slightly before action is required too. The vehicle is company car, and the notice I have a photocopy of has been sent to the Hire/Lease Co.. I assume once they inform ECP that my co. is in charge of the car, and they that I was the driver, then it's mine to fight... Anyway, our business is IT, I was working at one of the business on the Bishop Centre on 11th May, and they have clocks of me going in and then coming out 4.5hrs later. The free period is apparently 3hrs, and I was there for that time, working on the site. I had no idea this car park was a) anything but free or b) camera controlled, so wasn't expecting this. If I'm named as the driver, and this comes back to me, how do I respond? If I was unaware, I can't have entered into any contract, and therefore can't be in breach of it? Correct? All of the defences I've seen have based around either not being the driver, or having been a legitimate business user. I'm hoping that my company naming me as the driver, and that I wasn't a user of the business, will still give me a reasonable defence? The PCN mentions £75 due, but £45 within 14 days of that notice, stamped 20th May, which seems a little unfair unless they'll restamp when it's issued to me.
  21. On Saturday 25/4/15 my wife received a PCN for overstaying at the Morrisons car park in High Wycombe asking for a payment of £90 reduced to £50 if paid within 14 days. The 'offence' took place on 20/4/15 They have cameras that record entry and exit times and 'helpfully' provided pictures of her number plate. I did not have time to do anything on her behalf so pointed her in the direction of CAG where she did a fair bit of reading and research as she felt the penalty they are imposing is totally disproportionate particularly as she was in Morrisons spending a lot of money on groceries and then having lunch in their restaurant with friends - probably the reason for the overstay! (Women can gossip for any awfully long time it seems). she wants to respond with the following: "Dear Sir or Madam re: PCN number XXXXXX/XXXXXX I have received your parking invoice impersonating a 'parking ticket'. It is clear that your operation is some sort of 'parking space maximisation scheme' and your aim is clearly to maximise profits. I decline your invitation to pay or name the driver, neither of which are required of me as the keeper of the vehicle. This is my appeal and all liability to your company is denied on the following basis: A The amount is neither a genuine tariff/fee for parking, nor is it based upon any genuine pre-estimate of loss. B You are not the landowner and do not have locus standi. C Your signage was not sufficiently prominent nor clearly worded and consideration did not flow from both parties, so there was no contract. If you choose not to cancel this invoice you must issue a rejection letter in reply to my appeal, explaining: 1 The legal basis of your charge (i.e. breach, trespass or contractual fee). As keeper, I cannot be expected to guess the basis of your allegation. If you try to rely upon ParkingEye v Beavis at POPLA, I will point out that it was a flawed decision, it is not binding, and it is set for the Court of Appeal. There is clearly no commercial justification for this punitive charge and no case law to support it. 2 Proof of your locus standi to offer contracts to drivers at this site. 3 Your explanation of the consideration that you believe flowed from the driver, and from yourselves. 4 A copy of the signage site map and close-up pictures of the signs in situ at the time, taken at a comparable time of day in similar light conditions. 5 The means to make an appeal to POPLA or the IAS. Please note that I intend to claim my costs when I prevail. " She found this in a CAG posting and thinks this is her best response to the PCN. As I know very little about such matters could someone more experienced than me offer my wife advice as to whether sending this missive is the best course of action as the first salvo against these leeches? Many thanks to any responses whether positive or negative - or whether the best course of action is simply to cough up despite her great distaste is so doing. I have just read that the Beavis v Parking Eye case has been heard by the Court of Appeal. Does this now mean there is a precedent for these parking companies to charge what they like with impunity? Does my wife now have to delete the reference to this case or can it be stated it is going to the Supreme Court? Or just leave the statement as it is?
  22. My husband has just got back to our car in Sainsbury's car park to find a Euro Car Parks PCN on the windscreen demanding £60 (or reduced fee of £30) for parking 'longer than the maximum period allowed'. The parking time limit is 2 hours free parking and he stayed for 2 hours 30 minutes. We're regular customers at the store but we don't have a receipt to prove we shopped there at the time stated. The supermarket is quite big with a cafe so 2 hrs isn't a particularly long time and it also situated next to a retail park where you could spend all afternoon shopping. The car parks have no clear defining line and seem to merge into one. The signs on one side do state however, that it is Sainsbury's car park and there is a 2 hour max limit but the rest of the writing isn't really that clear. I've had a look at other posts and info about similar incidents but the more I read the less sure I am about what to do! Please can anyone give me advice?
  23. Today I have received a letter from Euro Car Park stating that I have to pay £100 (£60 if paid within 14 days) because the car parked in Crown Street Car Park/Bolton They put the photos of the number plate and the in and out time. It was only 15 minutes. The other thing, My friend who used the car did not leave it. He stayed inside the car and then drove off It was on 23/01/15 afternoon time The letter says that: On the 23/01/15 you were the registered keeper of the vehicle: Or you have been named by the registered keeper as the driver when there was a breach of terms and conditions of parking. We are using cameras to capture images of vehicles entering and leaving the car park and calculate their length of stay. Signage on the car park clearly informs of the terms and conditions. The parking charge notice xxxxxxxxxx has been issued because the vehicle was parked at crown street - Bolton, Crown street, , Bolton, BL1 2RU. As no valid pay and display/permit was purchased this was in breach of the terms and conditions at this site. It then mentions Schedule 4 of the protection of freedoms act 2012. Please tell me what to do
  24. Hi all this is my tale of woe. Went to Bishop Centre Taplow. 21 Feb15 in the evening. Received yesterday (02Mar15) a parking charge notice from euro car parks. They were using cameras to capture entering and leaving times. My stay exceeded the 3 hr free parking time stay. I have been told according to the letter that under schedule 4 of the protections of freedoms Act 2012 they have the right to recover from the registered keeper so much that amount that remains unpaid. Needless to say I don't want to pay the £75 or even the 'considerate' 14 day discount of £45. There are signs in the car park which state the 3 hr free stay so do I really have any possibility of avoiding this? Any advice would be appreciated. kev
  25. On the 9th of November we parked on Euro Car Park located on Crown Street in Bolton, we forgot to pay the fee and on the 12th we received a letter: Parking Charge Notice amount due £100. Payment for the parking charge notice is due within 28 days from the 12/11/14 shown above if the parking charge notice is paid within 14 days from the date of this notice a prompt payment discounted amount of £60 is payable. Under that it states we were parked on Crown street car park from 16:55 to 18:23 on the 9/11/14 then says that: On the 9/11/14 you were the registered keeper of the vehicle: Or you have been named by the registered keeper as the driver when there was a breach of terms and conditions of parking. We are using cameras to capture images of vehicles entering and leaving the car park and calculate their length of stay. Signage on the car park clearly informs of the terms and conditions. The parking charge notice xxxxxxxxxx has been issued because the vehicle was parked at crown street - Bolton, Crown street, , Bolton, BL1 2RU. As no valid pay and display/permit was purchased this was in breach of the terms and conditions at this site. It then mentions Schedule 4 of the protection of freedoms act 2012. What should we do in relation to this? Elffin
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