When does the Statute Barred clock start ticking?

[fkofilee]

When a claim form is issued, the SB clock stops. Should you successfully defend and no judgement is gained / made either by way of judge or Tomlin order, It is my understanding that the clock unpauses and continues.

Please see your PM that I sent you , this is important.

[maggie60]

I had mistakenly and very optimistically believed that the six years ran until a judgement was made which would buy me a few more months.

 

It makes complete sense that it would stop as soon as the summons was issued.

 

The question of when the six years starts is really confusing. The Limitations Act says it starts from the cause of action. Some sources (including the CSA) say this is the last payment. The worst possible interpretation is the default date. In our case the difference between the two dates varies between 5 weeks and 5 months.

 

This is the only creditor threatening action at the moment and I realise I need to bite the bullet and send them a CCA request or the letter Fletch suggested (now removed) and see what they can come up with. If they can prove everything it will be difficult to play ping pong with them for too long and I will need to negotiate with them. The debt will disappear from my credit file when the default expires in January, as will all of my other debts.

 

Fletch - I thought the letter was very good, but it obviously contained something that warranted it's removal. Could you be kind enough to PM me a copy when you have time.

 

Thanks,

 

Sara

[unclebulgaria67]

The date SB will run from in your case will be about 3 months after your late payment. With credit cards, i believe the standard terms are for a default notice to be issued about 60 days after a missed payment. So if you missed paying a statement in September 2010, you need to look at the account terms/conditions which state when a default notice will be issued.

 

My guess is that the default notice was issued in November 2010 and you did not pay it. The actual default should have been in December 2010, but the card company have not applied it until January 2011.

 

Send the CCA request off and see whether they can supply it. It might take them a few months or they might come back saying they can't provide it.

 

The CCA is your statutory request and helps you, if they tried to take to court.

 

CAG will remove template letters from elsewhere, as this site has its own library. If Fletch thinks the library could benefit from having another letter, they should contact admin.

[dx100uk]

that letter was neither CCA nor CPR complaint

basically address possible changes that might happen

 

 

how about you scan me this letter sara

and i'll send you a cag email address

as i'm 99% sure its a std threat-o-gram

 

 

and kicking the nest would be stupid

[Old Cogger]

had a letter which said Will in para 1 then in para 4 IF/May - heard nothing since

[NoneProvided]

Sara, please see my recent experience with a DCA, I believe you may be going through a similar experience.

 

 

I can't link it here, but I replied to it today, so it should stay on the first page for a while.

[maggie60]

DX, I will PM you this evening with scanned letter. Have to earn some money now.

 

Thanks,

 

Sara

 

Hi NoneProvided, yours is a very similar case - just finished reading it.

 

Like you I have ones that with drop off this year and preparing for an onslaught of correspondence before then. This one had a chequered payment history. In 2010, I made a payments on the 10th of every month until May then nothing until 17th August. They did not default this until January and this is the newest default on my file.

 

Just two quick questions.

 

1. We have made 5 CCA requests over the last eight years - three directly to the OC and got the CCA, but the two to DCAs who had purchased the debt returned nothing. One of these was the DCA in this thread. What are the chances of this happening again, or is it unusual for this to happen, would they buy a debt without the original CCA?

 

2. What is the legal situation if they cannot supply the CCA, don't they have to have a CCA in order to raise the summons?

[renegadeimp]

Why have you made so many requests for a CCA? 1 request . Thats it. If they dont reply and theyre stupid enough to try court, you use it as part of your defence. The fact you keep sending CCA's has marked you as gullible. And in regards to the CCA you got from the OC, was it fully compliant? AS if it was, the DCA's would have easily gotten it. Even a reconstituted agreement.

 

I know youre scared, but you should really name the DCA so we can tell you for sure if theyll do anything, if theyre litigous, or if they actually are able to get paperwork. Trying to keep everything secret is like having a problem with your car, ringing up a garage instead of taking the car to them, then saying fix it, while the mechanic goes... umm ok. I cant even see it let alone fix it.

[maggie60]

Gullible? Moi? 5 CCA requests to five DIFFERENT creditors - not the same one. DOH!!!!

 

 

Enjoyed the car analogy, but I KNOW they're ligitious!!! OH received a summons from them last year, sent a CCA request and they replied they were out of time.

[renegadeimp]

You dont need to send any other CCA requests to the new DCA's. The first one failed, so you just throw it into a dispute citing the original DCA.

 

Youre choice of course, but its strange not naming the DCA since they cant track you down here.

[dx100uk]

DX, I will PM you this evening with scanned letter. Have to earn some money now.

 

Thanks,

 

Sara

 

 

Just two quick questions.

 

1. We have made 5 CCA requests over the last eight years

- three directly to the OC and got the CCA,

but the two to DCAs who had purchased the debt returned nothing.

One of these was the DCA in this thread.

What are the chances of this happening again, or is it unusual for this to happen, would they buy a debt without the original CCA?

 

2. What is the legal situation if they cannot supply the CCA, don't they have to have a CCA in order to raise the summons?

 

 

these debts are passed around on what we call phishing list

they call them debt portfolios.

all it is , is a simple spreadsheet

with one line for each debt.

there no paperwork passed around

nor are they required to have it

before either sending threat-o-grams

nor

start court proceedings

 

 

all most DCA's [debt buyers] are after is a non contested rubberstamped default judgement where nothing is checked.

9/10 if once a claimform arrives the debtor selects 'defend all' and fire off CCA/CPR, we normally see this stays or kills the claim.

[maggie60]

You dont need to send any other CCA requests to the new DCA's. The first one failed, so you just throw it into a dispute citing the original DCA.

 

 

As I said "OH received a summons from them last year, sent a CCA Request and they replied they were out of time."

 

 

Different debt, different debtor!!!!

[fletch70]

Sara

Sorry for my silence but it seems that for some reason my email notifications had stopped.

 

 

As for the SB debate, its a long and oft discussed position but as far as I am aware , only when an account has been defaulted and is say in a repayment plan can you say that the limitations clock starts from the date of last payment. IF you look at all the debt advice charities they will tell you that it is complicated and varied , much depends on the wording of the contract /agreement. Although as 'helpfully' pointed out by DX, the BMW v Hart case was for what he simplistically called a hire purchase agreement , the contract in that case specified when the cause of action accrued which was when the creditor accepted the contract had ended. In that case it was many months after payments stopped.

 

For credit cards and loans there has , again as far as I know, been no legal precedent set for when the COA accrues however there does have to be at a very minimum some cause which would be a missed payment. In my Cap One account it sets out some timelines before they would issue a default notice which was if I remember 30 days after the date of the first missed payment, so in that case it would be a minimum of two months.

 

With regard to sending out CCA request, when I first took my debts under my control I sent 21 CCA requests and 4 1/2 years on some have sent me unenforeceable agreements, some have written saying no agreement and hence unenforceable , some messed me around for a while and now I only have 2 who occasionally chase me . One of those had reached a LBA status before the CCA requests was sent so I would not say I have been marked as gullible.

 

A S77-79 request is a powerful tool and providing you can evidence that a request was sent and received , one should be all that is needed. On a couple of occassions, debts of mine have been sold when the previous owner had failed to comply with my request , a quick letter saying

 

On xxxxxx i sent a S77-79 request to company y , to date they have failed to provide the required documentation

 

Once that has been sent, the accounts have gone quiet , in some cases I even got an apology, in the case of lowells I even got a £50 credit to my account which they may try to pretend is a payment but I have a draw full of letters to prove otherwise.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Andyorch
edited

[maggie60]

A S77-79 request is a powerful tool and providing you can evidence that a request was sent and received , one should be all that is needed.

 

Fletch, someone yesterday was under the impression we were repeatedly sending off CCA requests to the same clowns for the same debts. All the requests were related to different debts.

 

Aside from that misunderstanding, thank you for your clear and helpful explanations. I had already decided to send a CCA request and your post confirms this as the best course of action.

 

Many thanks,

 

Sara

[maggie60]

On our credit file all ours debts except Mint (default expires in 2 weeks) are with DCAs.

 

 

The Mint ones default date is around 6 weeks after the last payment while the DCA-owned debts are 4 to 5 months after the last payments. Is the default date on file submitted by the current owner of the debt and does it have to be qualified by them, or it is taken from the OC's default?

[maggie60]

Hi,

 

I recently took out a 30-day free trial on Experian's credit expert.

 

When I first checked 14 days ago I had around 4 defaults totalling around 27k all expiring by next January.

 

The newest one was due to expire in February, based on default date plus six years.

 

However, this one has now disappeared and the total outstanding has now dropped by 12k.

 

This is for a Barclaycard debt.

 

Is this a temporary malfunction with CreditExpert and it will be back tomorrow? It will probably still be lurking over on Equifax.

[unclebulgaria67]

Probably in process of being sold to a debt buyer for a DCA to chase. The original creditor deletes and new debtor owner adds their details.

 

If it does not reappear soon, i suspect you will get a letter advising of assignment to new owner.

[martin2006]

It will no doubt be as UncleB suggests, beware tho that the debt buyer, when registering the account with the CRA's, that it continues to have the same date of default, Barclaycard notoriously do this when a debt is around 5 years old and the new owner adds a new date, thus trashing your file for a further 6 years, keep your eye on it

[Guest]

and, on checking cra, the cra will prob give the respective creditors a nudge...?

[maggie60]

That would seem to make most sense.

 

If the new owner does adjust the date (can they really do this?) who do I contact, the CRA or DCA? If the latter isn't that acknowledging the debt and kicking off another six years?

[unclebulgaria67]

That would seem to make most sense.

 

If the new owner does adjust the date (can they really do this?) who do I contact, the CRA or DCA? If the latter isn't that acknowledging the debt and kicking off another six years?

 

They can't amend the date. They will know the default date, as it will be given to them. If they change the date, that is against the data protection act, as well as possibly breaking other laws.

 

You should have a history feature on the CRA record, so you can print off the record and notify the CRA if the new debt owner deliberately enters a wrong date.

[maggie60]

My husband had an HSBC credit card and the last payment to them was on 10 May 2010.

 

He received a default notice dated 10 July 2010 according to his credit file, so this is due to drop off in 77 days time.

 

However, he did make a number of small payments to HSBC Recoveries up until May 2011.

 

So my question is will this become statutory barred when the default notice expires or two months after the last payment?

 

It is coming up to the point of selling the debt on.

 

Many thanks for any help.

[fkofilee]

No clear answer however it can be up to 3 months after the last payment was made. But once again no clear defined answer.

[maggie60]

It is confusing. as the last payment would normally precede the default notice.

[unclebulgaria67]

My husband had an HSBC credit card and the last payment to them was on 10 May 2010.

 

He received a default notice dated 10 July 2010 according to his credit file, so this is due to drop off in 77 days time.

 

However, he did make a number of small payments to HSBC Recoveries up until May 2011.

 

So my question is will this become statutory barred when the default notice expires or two months after the last payment?

 

It is coming up to the point of selling the debt on.

 

Many thanks for any help.

 

In your example, i would say it runs from the last date of payment to recoveries. Because it appears only token payments were made, the default was never resolved. The small payments to recoveries were a separate agreement towards the debt. In terms of the SB date, it makes logical sense that it runs from the last date of payment or or if there was a formal agreement in place for these payments, from the date payment was missed.