work programme after 2 years

[sillygirl1]

After coming off the Work Programme after finding a job myself via an agency I had already done previous work for (long before the last bout of unemployment) all I have had is one email sent to my workplace manager asking various questions about me.

 

I've also had a brief phone call and that has been it.

 

No offer was made to me at the time of taking up the contract (which is for 6 months).

 

I am now battling with the local council myself over whether or not I qualify for housing benefit over the 6 week run on period, and the council tax issue is causing headaches. They cannot seem to realise the difference between gross and net pay, so one lot (the gross figure) means I do not get HB/CT and the net figure I do - so I have broken it down for them in the way they sent it to me and headed it FORMAL COMPLAINT!

 

I would advise people to check BEFORE claiming working tax credit that it does not wipe out any HB/CT..... it seems this government give it with one hand and take it back with another!

[san_d]

I tried for feedback on UJ and no-one bothered with it

 

The "request feedback" button does nothing. It's just a placebo.

 

I doubt that any application at all on the UJM reaches the employer's desk.

[Gay_guy1986]

I am due to finish my work programme in January 2014 and I am worried going back to the jobcentre judging by feedback from people on here

 

At the moment I go to jobcentre to sign on fortnight's however I have been told that when I finish next year I will have to sign on weekly and I could be going on a unpaid work placement as if I didn't agree then I could face been sanctioned

[physicsgraduate]

As far as I am aware they can't make you do unpaid work. Just make sure you stick to your JSA agreement to the last detail.

[kcspurs]

Hi i finnished the work program last week. my advisor who i only been with a month didnt even know i was due to finnish in june. Since i been on ingeus i have had 4 differnt advisors. it felt like they just palm you off when they think they have no chance of getting you a job lol Anyway somthing happend about a year ago and they seem to forget about me for about 4/5 months. then i got call and had to go back and see them........

 

i will say all the staff are very friendly. all my advisors are really nice. I did ask my last advisor saying i want to see my exit report but he didnt know anything about it then told me to ring head office as they write it...

 

since i been on the work program i been on a few workshops and enjoyed them. .

 

anyway my job center interview is this tuesday. ill let everyone know how i get on and try and get my exit report lol

[RebeccaPidgeon]

As far as I am aware they can't make you do unpaid work. Just make sure you stick to your JSA agreement to the last detail.

Currently, JCP may assign candidates to "Mandatory Work Activity"

http://www.dwp.gov.uk/supplying-dwp/what-we-buy/welfare-to-work-services/provider-guidance/

Customer Group

2.2 Customers who will benefit from participating in MWA are those for whom a work placement would provide the focus and discipline that is a key requirement of finding, securing and retaining employment.

 

2.3 Customers who are referred to MWA may have been out of work for some time; it is possible that some customers may never have worked. The skills, work experience, level of education, and attitude to work will vary greatly within the target group.

 

2.6 Jobcentre Plus personal advisers are able to refer a customer to MWA at any point in their claim. However, the majority of customers are unlikely to be referred until week 13. Customers are unlikely to be referred if they are participating in any other type of provision.

 

2.7 Customers who are part of joint claims to JSA will be eligible for MWA provision. Referrals will be made on an individual basis based on the suitability of the customer. Both members of a joint claim could be referred to MWA if suitable, however this would be treated as two referrals in the same way as if two separate individuals were referred.

 

2.8 MWA is mandatory for all customers who are referred. There is no voluntary access to MWA.

 

:

:

:

However.

3.13 It is not necessary (although it’s desirable wherever possible) for the placement to be in the same sector or type of work as the customer’s job goal, as MWA is designed to help the customer develop disciplines associated with employment. Customers cannot choose their placements.

 

3.15 Placements must be additional to any existing or expected vacancies. You must ensure that employers are not taking advantage of MWA as a source of labour at the expense of employing workers in the open labour market.

 

After the work Programme, candidates may be required to develop a "Universal Credit Agreement", within which "35 hours per week" of job search (or preparing to enter the Labour Market - assuming that candidates are not already adequately prepared) could be achieved through MWA.

Edited June 23, 2013 by RebeccaPidgeon
Additional Information Submitted

[labyrinth]

Surely this from the MWA own guidelines

 

18. Given the policy intent of MWA, the following claimants must not be

considered for referral to MWA:

 currently working (paid or voluntary)

 undertaking employment related study / training

 taking part in or recently completed* another employment measure

(contracted or non-contracted) aimed at helping them move closer to

the labour market

(* A claimant ‘dropping-out’ of an employment measure prematurely may, or

may not, indicate a lack of focus and discipline on their part; it is for Advisory

Teams to consider the merits of MWA referral on a case by case basis).

 

 

should stop wp returnees from being put on MWA because they have just completed another employment measure ie the work programme.

 

Also if we have a volunteer job we have grounds to argue if MWA is mentioned ?

[physicsgraduate]

After the work Programme, candidates may be required to develop a "Universal Credit Agreement", within which "35 hours per week" of job search (or preparing to enter the Labour Market - assuming that candidates are not already adequately prepared) could be achieved through MWA.

 

I'm already doing >35 hours per week on developing my graphics/web design skills, so that's me covered hopefully. My other tactic is to get a part time bar job. Not working f/t if all I'm doing is lining the pocket of some landlord just so I can continue living off Tesco's out of date shelf. It's pretty obvious to me that current rent prices and council tax are a great disincentive towards finding employment, as is possibly noise pollution from neighbours. 28% of people, according to a recent study, have trouble with noisy neighbours. It's not easy these days, I suppose it never has been but at least before you could get social housing more easily. I'm stuck in private sector leasing. The amount the council has paid for me to live here would have been enough to buy a house.

[RebeccaPidgeon]

Surely this from the MWA own guidelines

 

18. Given the policy intent of MWA, the following claimants must not be

considered for referral to MWA:

 currently working (paid or voluntary)

 undertaking employment related study / training

 taking part in or recently completed* another employment measure

(contracted or non-contracted) aimed at helping them move closer to

the labour market

(* A claimant ‘dropping-out’ of an employment measure prematurely may, or

may not, indicate a lack of focus and discipline on their part; it is for Advisory

Teams to consider the merits of MWA referral on a case by case basis).

 

 

should stop wp returnees from being put on MWA because they have just completed another employment measure ie the work programme.

 

Also if we have a volunteer job we have grounds to argue if MWA is mentioned ?

Absolutely.

 

However, even if you are unenthusiastic about working for an organisation for nothing, you could argue against any MWA on the basis that i) you already possess the behaviours and disciplines needed for work, ii) you already possess the skills, knowledge and experience for whatever jobs that you apply for. Of course, if MWA becomes a tangible proposition, you could justify that, on the basis of being subject to a defacto Contract of Employment, the employer would not only have to pay salary (at least NMW), but would also have to pay Tax and National Insurance - lest they be reported to HMRC in violation of Statute.

[Dom86]

Surely this from the MWA own guidelines

 

18. Given the policy intent of MWA, the following claimants must not be

considered for referral to MWA:

 currently working (paid or voluntary)

 undertaking employment related study / training

 taking part in or recently completed* another employment measure

(contracted or non-contracted) aimed at helping them move closer to

the labour market

(* A claimant ‘dropping-out’ of an employment measure prematurely may, or

may not, indicate a lack of focus and discipline on their part; it is for Advisory

Teams to consider the merits of MWA referral on a case by case basis).

 

 

should stop wp returnees from being put on MWA because they have just completed another employment measure ie the work programme.

 

Also if we have a volunteer job we have grounds to argue if MWA is mentioned ?

 

I cant find the guidelines or legislation containing the specific wording above. Can you post the link please?

 

If the above wording is still applicable, I should be ok, as I'm doing a Part-Time course at a University.

[Dom86]

^

 

None of the 'current' guidelines I can find on the DWP site, have wording like that posted by labyrinth.

Edited June 23, 2013 by Dom86

[Dom86]

MWA only seems to apply if you on the Work Programme, not if you are solely a Jobcentre customer?

Edited June 23, 2013 by Dom86

[RebeccaPidgeon]

MWA only seems to apply if you on the Work Programme, not if you are solely a Jobcentre customer?

MWA exists entirely separate to the Work Programme... although, from http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/pg-part-p.pdf , the contract may be held by the work programme provider

[ATTACH=CONFIG]44681[/ATTACH]

[Chester6]

Absolutely.

 

However, even if you are unenthusiastic about working for an organisation for nothing, you could argue against any MWA on the basis that i) you already possess the behaviours and disciplines needed for work, ii) you already possess the skills, knowledge and experience for whatever jobs that you apply for. Of course, if MWA becomes a tangible proposition, you could justify that, on the basis of being subject to a defacto Contract of Employment, the employer would not only have to pay salary (at least NMW), but would also have to pay Tax and National Insurance - lest they be reported to HMRC in violation of Statute.

 

They tend to claim if you are out of work for a period that you need a recent reference and should do forced labour

[RebeccaPidgeon]

They tend to claim if you are out of work for a period that you need a recent reference and should do forced labour

I will defer to your insight.... and am sure that a Welfare To Work Clerk will read this assertion from one of their scripts. However, for the life of me, I cannot think of any job that you can do which could either not be filled by either an existing employee, or which could be filled by recruiting someone from the open market, which is contrary to Sections 3.13 and 3.15 from the MWA Provider Guidance http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/pg-part-p.pdf

 

And, as for the reference, I am not sure whether any prospective employer would value any reference which was established through coerced working, where the candidate was never paid, and more than likely committed an offence by being an unwary party to Tax Evasion and Tax Fraud.

 

In addressing the issue of Conspiracy to perpetrate Tax Fraud, there may even be a case for HMRC to instigate a Criminal Investigation Party on both the employer and the Welfare To Work outfit coordinating the MWA.

 

HMRC Criminal Investigation Policy

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/prosecutions/crim-inv-policy.htm

Examples of the kind of circumstances in which HMRC will generally consider commencing a criminal, rather than civil investigations are:

 

• In cases of organised criminal gangs attacking the tax system or systematic frauds where losses represents a serious threat to the tax base, including conspiracy;
  

[Chester6]

It's their script and it's part of how all of the drones that I have been stuck with sell work experience

But you are right about employing someone

Edited June 30, 2013 by citizenB

[RebeccaPidgeon]

It's their script and it's part of how all of the drones that I have been stuck with sell work experience

But you are right about employing someone

Most people would succumb to the assertion offered by some Welfare To Work Clerk, particularly when they may suggest that, if they dont agree to the assertion, they may wield their baloneous power and cite the candidate for a Sanction Doubt.

Edited June 30, 2013 by citizenB

[blagmania]

I tried for feedback on UJ and no-one bothered with it

No great loss as even with applications where I could contact the person directly I still got no feedback of any use, one person didn't know anything about my job interview/application.

UJ is very useless for jobseeking it seems all too often

 

i had a feeling this will happen which will possibly force the dwp

to put pressure on the companies to give feed back,

and it will tie up companies even more

either this or companies will tell the dwp where to go

obviously if there were the jobs out there

this would not be a problem

but as there isn't, its a case of grinding the system down

so the system collapses under the weight of applications,

[blagmania]

the thing to do is accept it then

submit the employers details here via the boycott workfares name and shame page

the minute you are are out of the jobcentre

touchwood it

means that companies will be hit by negative publicity straight away

[Chester6]

Most people would succumb to the assertion offered by some Welfare To Work Clerk, particularly when they may suggest that, if they dont agree to the assertion, they may wield their baloneous power and cite the candidate for a Sanction Doubt.

 

I have done that before but I feel like I know more now

I am looking forwards to the lulz of the exit report

[RebeccaPidgeon]

I have done that before but I feel like I know more now

I am looking forwards to the lulz of the exit report

Before the Exit Report is produced, what you may want to do is insist on open and full disclosure by the Welfare To Work Company, and insist that they provide a copy of the information which is held on you....this would allow you to i) confirm that the information held pertains to you (and has not been mixed up with someone else), and ii) ensure that the information is accurate and not a slur on your name and character.

 

If the information contained is inaccurate, insist that it be corrected immediately, lest an official complaint be made to your MP and Information Commissioners Office.

[Lorise]

Can someone who has finished the WP tell me how they were told of their end date, I have rang the JC and they said it is up to Ingeus to tell me when I finish, yet my 104 weeks are up on 3rd July yet Ingeus have me down for a normal interview on the 15th July and not one of my many advisors (8 in total) have mentioned a end date yet.....getting worried people....thinking I am on a life sentence ha.

[osdset]

i had a feeling this will happen which will possibly force the dwp

to put pressure on the companies to give feed back,

and it will tie up companies even more

either this or companies will tell the dwp where to go

obviously if there were the jobs out there

this would not be a problem

but as there isn't, its a case of grinding the system down

so the system collapses under the weight of applications,

The DWP aren't in the position to put pressure on anyone other than claimants. Companies are under no obligation whatsoever to provide feedback on job applications.

[LongHairedLily]

I have my exit review tomorrow, however I also have two job interviews. One this Friday and another tbc. I received the email that I had been shortlisted for interview, they just need to set up a time/date. To tell Ingeus or not to tell???

[cubertf]

Can someone who has finished the WP tell me how they were told of their end date, I have rang the JC and they said it is up to Ingeus to tell me when I finish, yet my 104 weeks are up on 3rd July yet Ingeus have me down for a normal interview on the 15th July and not one of my many advisors (8 in total) have mentioned a end date yet.....getting worried people....thinking I am on a life sentence ha.

 

officially, with 2 weeks to go before your finish date, the DWP will notify your provider that you finish on a specific date. they then have 2 weeks to contact you, and finish you.

 

I attended for a regular appointment on a Tuesday, to be told when I was there, to go away, and come back on the Friday, where I would be part of a mass exit session.

 

at the session, between 20 and 25 leavers where there. 3 members of staff tried to get us to sign up for another 12 month - voluntary - scheme, funded by the local council. on raising the exit review, they knew nothing about it, and was told to get us to put out names, telephone number and email address on a piece of paper. we did, and I left - exit 'review' completed...that was 10 days ago, and I have a meeting with a DWP advisor a week on Thursday.