Taking eBay to court - Money Claim Online

[JeremyHarris]

I have called ebay customer services many times, sent messages via ebay, contacted live help many times & also written to VERO. All I wanted from them is info as to why my listings were removed & my account restricted. They keep on replying via scripted messages that they have received a takedown notice & legally have to act upon that. I asked them for a copy of the take-down notice & they shut me down stating for data protection they cannot provide me with these details even though this concerns me. Its like talking to a brick wall talking to ebay customer services. No help at all. Yet they keep on sticking to the story of receiving a take-down notice. First time they said it was Apple inc & I contacted Apple. For some luck they replied as they dont communicate with small sellers like me. On the reply it stated that it was not Apple inc who sent the takedown notice. I forwarded this message to VERO & ebay & they still say that they cannot act on my e-mail. They want Apple to contact ebay directly & say that they did not send the notice & to remove my selling restriction. I contact Apple & they say that they cannot send a notice for something that they did not instigate in the first place. I am stuck in the middle without any income due to no fault of mine.

[nicpicot]

Ji jeremy. Did you ever write a formal complaint to ebay or call them to see what is going on? I ask this because your info makes me think you havent yet, and are just thinking the worst. Ebay cant delist you simply on the words of another seller. They would need to investigate first.

 

Ok ebay seem to be a law unto themselves. However the contract is normally between someone in uk and ebay in luxembourg. I am about to issue court proceedings against ebay sarl as I feel they have misled me and I want my money back. UI wish the uk government would take them to task as well. How can ebay pay no tax in the uk goods bought and sold here should create a tax liability on ebay should it not? They boast of millions of sales and turnover and pay no tax!?

Edited January 6, 2014 by honeybee13
Pejorative terms.

[ericsbrother]

Ebay has a UK registered address so that is where you serve your documents.

Try doing a SAR and tell you particularly want the data regarding your activity between the relevant dates. They will try and hide a lot of the self-incriminating stuff but you would then need to demand it again with other people's details redacted. If they dont comply take it to the ICO. Long winded but if you dont getting anything from a small claims court will be nigh on impossible as you wont have the evidence.

[jfhall82]

I think some people here have a dangerous misunderstanding on the law. You may have been treated unfairly, been penalised etc but eBay is a private site. You have no LEGAL right to use it and eBay can terminate anyone's access without reason just because they want to. They can be unfair, disproportionate and infuriating and there is nothing you can do about it - they make and change the rules.

 

With the exception of those suffering a fraud/deception as per the OP, people in the midst of court action on the basis of unfair treatment/withdrawal/curtailment of services really need to get some sound legal advice before going any further.

Unfair doesn't necessarily mean illegal and you will need to have a legal basis for your claim.

[BusterJack]

I am interested in taking eBay to court for breaking the law.

 

The law/laws in this case are those detailed in The Fraud Act 2006 : -

 

legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/35/contents

 

For example :-

 

4 : Fraud by abuse of position

 

(1)A person is in breach of this section if he—

 

(a)occupies a position in which he is expected to safeguard, or not to act against, the financial interests of another person,

 

(b)dishonestly abuses that position, and

 

©intends, by means of the abuse of that position—

 

(i)to make a gain for himself or another, or

 

(ii)to cause loss to another or to expose another to a risk of loss.

 

(2)A person may be regarded as having abused his position even though his conduct consisted of an omission rather than an act.

 

I am not a victim of fraud personally, but I know a lot of people who have been. I am a [problem]buster on eBay and my primary objective is to get fraudulent listings removed from eBay as quickly as possible. Over the last ten months I have found and reported nearly 7,000 separate and unique fraud attempts (mainly the work of an organised crime syndicate based in Romania and run by Nicolae Popescu).

 

On the one hand, I protect people from falling victim to [problem]s by getting the listings deleted; in this way a high percentage of the [problem] attempts fail. But inevitably some of the attempts will be successful, and when they are, they can cause serious financial harm. Most of the [problem]s involve vehicles of some kind - cars, vans, campervans, tractors, diggers, motorbikes and so on - anything with wheels basically. Sometimes boats, sometimes agricultural machinery and small/heavy plant. The average loss for a victim is typically £7000.

 

A few days ago the BBC ran a short feature on The One Show and Inside Out with the aim of drawing attention to the risks of buying vehicles online. Their own story mainly featured Nigerian fraudsters operating out of Norway (which was a new combination to me!) but the basic concept was very familiar; the bank was usually a branch of Barclays in the UK where the 'buyer' was told to transfer funds for 'safe keeping' while the vehicle is delivered and inspected. I am more than familiar with the money transfer methodology, having carried out numerous '[problem]-baiting' stings in order to report mule accounts to the bank, the police or the inappropriately named ActionFraud. But the TV feature had nothing new to say other than the basic mantra "touch the metal first" - never pay anything until you have seen and touched the vehicle in the flesh.

 

What the programme only hinted it rather than spelt out loud and clear was that once you've been [problem]med like this (responding to ads on eBay, AutoTrader etc etc) there is NO RECOURSE. You have lost your money, end of story. The bank won't accept responsibility, the police will just hold up their hands, and companies like eBay will say something like "You should have read the small print".

 

But I believe there IS a way of getting stolen money back.

 

I report [problem]s to eBay all day and every day, and I post the details on my Facebook page. It is my belief that if I report a [problem] eBay listing at, for example, 3pm on 19th February 2014, then from that moment onwards eBay are aware of it. They are aware that there is an attempt to commit fraud on their own website. Now, the Fraud Act 2006 is pretty unambiguous in its interpretation of a scenario such as this - that eBay will be guilty of "Fraud by Abuse of Position" because (and I quote) eBay "occupies a position in which [it] is expected to safeguard, or not to act against, the financial interests of another person".

 

I believe the law is clear and not in need of any adaptation to cope with these [problem]s. The problem is simply that there is almost no ENFORCEMENT of the law.

 

On average, eBay take about 6 hours to remove a [problem] listing from the time that it is reported. In my view that is much too long, and often [problem]s are not removed for several days. This, I contend, is FRAUD BY ABUSE OF POSITION.

 

According to the BBC, "thousands of people fall victim to online fraud each year". I have no data to offer anything more accurate with regard to online fraud in general, but as far as eBay is concerned (one of the biggest single hot-spots of fraud) I have evidence in the form of saved web-pages that demonstrate a very intense and concentrated programme of fraud on eBay UK. I have several thousand saved documents, and, just as importantly, I have the exact dates and times of each Fraud Report. Nearly 7,000 as of today's date. So if a victim approaches me with a tale of woe involving a [problem] on eBay, there's a good chance that I saw it before they did, and more to the point I REPORTED IT before they even saw it.

 

And that is where I believe eBay would or should be found culpable. Fraud by abuse of position, fraud by failing to safeguard the financial interests of another person.

 

The collective value of all the vehicle [problem]s on eBay alone is about £100 million a year; that is to say, if every listing found one victim, that's how much would be stolen. Of course in reality most [problem]s fail, but even if the figure is as high as 99% (which I doubt) that still leaves £1 million stolen from unsuspecting and admittedly gullible victims. I think this is a very conservative estimate.

 

I would like anyone who knows anyone who has fallen victim to a vehicle [problem] on eBay since April 2013 to post on this thread, as I *might* have valuable evidence that will prove that eBay were made aware of a [problem] before the [problem] actually took place - and therefore could have prevented it.

Edited February 19, 2014 by honeybee13
Asking for contact.

[dx100uk]

you might not too

 

if you are so confident

 

then post up your evidence.

 

dx

[BusterJack]

 

if you are so confident then post up your evidence.

 

That would use up rather a lot of space here as I have several thousand docs stored

 

I need details of the crime first. Then I can post just one - the matching one.

 

I need the eBay Item Number, approximate date of listing, and the time/date of the money transfer. Who the money was sent to is not relevant, it's the date and time that matters.

[raydetinu]

are not ebay based in Luxembourg? or USA?

would uk courts have any authority?

[emmagray82]

i have major issue with ebay myself. on the 7th i bought an ipod 160 gb on there it says seller refurb and hen had put loads of new parts. so i get it and it wont work it says corrupted and error message when plugged in it wont sycronise my music and keeps saying error message when i try to restore on my pc wont let me basically useless. and its been in box all this time almost three weeks. i have tried everything. the sellenrtold me downloaded new i tunes t which i have and tried it on other computer. problem is seller has been denying it was not working and saying i wot get refund he got a bit snotty when i opened a case he constantly blames it on my pc but t any issue so i know its not problem. its dragged on two weeks and i still haven't had a resolution. then earlier i got email from head office saying i should find someone to fix it and that made me very angry i spent all that money on it and i am supposed to just fix it but the way i see it i bought and it doesn't work why should i fix it. i bought it for it to work and it didn't at all. i have sent long email about sale of good acts and it not being fit for purpose. and that i should be entitled to a refund repair or replacement. my main issue is i feel i have been lied to because the seller said stuff in the description he said it was seller refurb and lots of new parts and i buy it for that reason and it doesn't work and i feel like the seller is laughing he gets my money and i get heap of junk i can't use. i have use ebay for years but i am really upset bout the whole thing i have to wait 48 hours for their verdict but if seller had accepted responsibility and said it was his fault in the first place it would have been sorted out quicker. any advice

[dx100uk]

start a new thread

 

dx

[rjsdavis]

are not ebay based in Luxembourg? or USA?

would uk courts have any authority?

 

Yes, you have full recourse in UK courts for items that are listed (from a seller's perspective) or purchased (from a buyer's perspective) on the website ebay (dot) co (dot) uk - this includes items that are actually sourced from abroad, but have been listed for international sale and physically appear on the ebay.co.uk website.

 

You will have a much tougher job to issue proceedings if you were involved in a transaction that was listed only on eBay.com, or eBay.de for example as these are foreign websites with foreign defendants, and the only recourse you may have is from the protection offered by PayPal if used as the payment medium.

 

If you need to file a county court summons against eBay (UK) Ltd - their current registered details are:

 

EBAY (UK) LIMITED

5 NEW STREET SQUARE

LONDON

UNITED KINGDOM

EC4A 3TW

Company No. 03726028

Tel: 0208 605 3000

 

You can check that these details are still uptodate on the Companies House website. If you issue court proceedings against a UK company, it MUST be served upon their UK registered address, therefore, do not serve them at eBay's Richmond address which is merely an office and place of trading.

 

The current MD of eBay UK is Tanya Lawler: tanya (dot) lawler (at) ebay (dot) com - you might wish to serve any documents upon her electronically also for added belt and braces protection and evidence of service. This information is also correct as at the time of posting and will no doubt be subject to change over time!

 

For my money, I can see that the OP appears to have reached a settlement with eBay (UK) Ltd based on one of his later posts and it seems like he's been required to sign a non-disclosure agreement document as part of the settlement process. This is a very common way of larger companies trying to go through their own damage limitation process from a brand perspective.

 

I expect I will need to serve a summons on eBay (UK) Ltd in respect of a fraudulent "item not as described" case that was filed by a fraudulent buyer who abused the eBay buyer protection programme. Sadly, despite eBay not even following their own published ebay protection policy, they refuse to reverse their own error, which has made them party to an abuse of their own procedure and meant that they have subsequently stolen money from our PayPal account as a result.

 

A 14 day LBA (Letter Before Action) has just been served upon the MD electronically, hoping that this will prompt a reaction, but I suspect that their default legal position is to ignore all inbound comms and force people to actually issue against them and then negotiate later (if they feel there is a case) as they know that whilst most people will say "see you in court" in the heat of the moment, very few actually have the gumption and confidence to actually see it through and issue court proceedings.

 

If more of us who actually have a case against them issued against them, they might end up pulling their finger out and providing the sort of resolution service that eBay users across the globe deserve.

 

Unless I'm forced into signing an NDA, I will update with news/updates over the coming weeks - my ideal outcome is to prepare and distribute a "how to sue eBay" document that will assist many others to take action and not continue to be bullied by this appallingly obtuse organisation.

[rjsdavis]

Hi Famous Memorabilia,

 

Thank you for your post, I would like to email you directly regarding your case.

 

Ridiculous as it may be, we are unable to publically announce the result of ourclaim.

 

No, not ridiculous at all - assume that they forced you to sign an NDA as part of the settlement agreement! I would love to hear from you, but I need to have posted 30 times before I send you a PM. Any chance you could PM me please?

 

Many thanks

[BusterJack]

The current MD of eBay UK is Tanya Lawler: tanya (dot) lawler (at) ebay (dot) com

 

That made me smile

 

This information is also correct as at the time of posting and will no doubt be subject to change over time!

 

So did that :-D

[Pwll789]

Hi

I have a problem with ebay.

I purchased campervan from a fraudulant seller , i have been told that ebay knew this was a spoof seller but still didnt remove the item and allowed me to contact seller and buy vehicle.

any advice would be fab help

Thanks

Pwll789

[renegadeimp]

You need to start your own thread. Who told you that eBay knew.

[dx100uk]

start a new thread

[jstoge]

all interesting stuff and I want to make a claim against eBay, but the online Money Claim form needs a UK address and postcode ?

 

how do people get around this ?

[aburobert]

Look at Post 34 - do the Companies House search to make sure you have the most up to date details.

 

If you have a good case you will probably 'win' but eBay normally get you to sign a confidentiality agreement - in short a gagging clause so you cannot shout from the roof tops should you prevail.

[Breeze11]

Look at Post 34 - do the Companies House search to make sure you have the most up to date details.

 

If you have a good case you will probably 'win' but eBay normally get you to sign a confidentiality agreement - in short a gagging clause so you cannot shout from the roof tops should you prevail.

 

I know this is an old thread but given the current publicity re gagging clauses is it not about time those gagged by ebay simply ignored the order and revealed , certainly if there were enough the resultant publicity would prevent ebay from doing anything against them as It would be a corporate own goal .