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    • no i meant the email from parcel2go which email address did they send it from and who signed it off (whos name is at the bottom)
    • I understand confusion with this thread.  I tried to keep threads separate because there have been so many angles.    But a team member merged them all.  This is why it's hard to keep track. This forum exists to help little people fight injustice - however big or small.  Im here to try get a decent resolution. Not to give in to the ' big boys'. My "matter' became complicated 'matters' simply because a lender refused to sell a property. What can I say?  I'll try in a nutshell to give an overview: There's a long lease property. I originally bought it short lease with a s.146 on it from original freeholder.  I had no concerns. So lender should have been able to sell a well-maintained lovely long lease property.  The property was great. The issue is not the property.  Economy, sdlt increases, elections, brexit, covid, interest hikes etc didn't help.  The issue is simple - the lender wanted to keep it.    Before repo I offered to clear my loan.  I was a bit short and lender refused.  They said (recorded) they thought the property was worth much more and they were happy to keep accruing interest (in their benefit) until it reached a point where they felt they could repo and still easily quickly sell to get their £s back.  This was a mistake.  The market was (and is) tough.   2y later the lender ceo bid the same sum to buy the property for himself. He'd rejected higher offers in the intervening period whilst accruing interest. I had the property under offer to a fantastic niche buyer but lender rushed to repo and buyer got spooked and walked.  It had taken a long time to find such a lucrative buyer.  A sale which would have resulted in £s and another asset for me. Post repo lender had 1 offer immediately.  But dragged out the process for >1y - allegedly trying to get other offers. But disclosure shows there was only one valid buyer. Lender appointed receiver (after 4 months) - simply to try acquire the freehold.  He used his powers as receiver to use me, as leaseholder, to serve notice on freeholders.  Legally that failed. Meanwhile lender failed to secure property - and squatters got in (3 times).  And they failed to maintain it.  So freeholders served a dilapidations notice (external) - on me as leaseholder (cc-ed to lender).   (That's how it works legally) I don't own the freehold.  But I am a trustee and have to do right by the freeholders.  This is where matters got/ get complicated.  And probably lose most caggers.   Lawyers got involved for the freeholders to firstly void the receiver enfranchisement notice. Secondly, to serve the dilapidations notice.  The lack of maintenance was in breach of lease and had to be served to protect fh asset. The lender did no repairs. They said a buyer would undertake them. Which was probably correct. If they had sold. After 1y lender finally agreed to sell to the 1st offeror and contracts went with lawyers.  Within 1 month lender reneged.  Lender tried to suggest buyer walked. Evidence shows he/ his lawyers continued trying to exchange (cash) for 4 months.  Evidence shows lender and receiver strategy had been to renege and for ceo to take control.   I still think that's their plan. Lender then stupidly chose to pretty much bulldoze the property.  Other stuff was going on in the background. After repo I was in touch by phone and email and lender knew post got to me.   Despite this, after about 10 months (before and then during covid), they deliberately sent SDs and eventually a B petition to an incorrect address and an obscure small court.  They never served me properly.  (In hindsight I understand they hoped to get a backdoor B - so they could keep the property that way.)  Eventually the random court told them to email me by way of service.  At this point their ruse to make me B failed.  I got a lawyer (friend paid). The B petition was struck out. They’d failed to include the property as an asset. They were in breach of insolvency rules. Simultaneously the receiver again appointed lawyers to act on my behalf as leaseholder. This time to serve notice on the freeholders for a lease extension.  He had hoped to try and vary the strict lease. Evidence shows the already long length of lease wasn't an issue.  The lender obviously hoped to get round their lack of permission to do works (which they were already doing) by hoping to remove the strict clauses that prevent leaseholder doing alterations.   The extension created a new legal angle for me to deal with.  I had to act as trustee for freeholders against me as leaseholder/ the receiver.  Inconsistencies and incompetence by receiver lawyers dragged this out 3y.  It still isn't properly resolved.  Meanwhile - going back to the the works the lender undertook. The works were consciously in breach of lease.  The lender hadn't remedied the breaches listed in the dilapidations notice.  They destroyed the property.  The trustees compiled all evidence.  The freeholders lawyers then served a forfeiture notice. This notice started a different legal battle. I was acting for the freeholders against what the lender had done on my behalf as leaseholder.  This legal battle took 3y to resolve. The simple exit would have been for lender to sell. A simple agreement to remedy the breaches and recompense the freeholders in compensation - and there's have been clean title to sell.  That option was proposed to them.   This happened by way of mediation for all parties 2y ago.  A resolution option was put forward and in principle agreed.  But immediately after the lender lawyers failed to engage.  A hard lesson to learn - mediation cannot be referred to in court. It's considered w/o prejudice. The steps they took have made no difference to their ability to sell the property.  Almost 3y since they finished works they still haven't sold. ** ** I followed up some leads myself.  A qualified cash buyer offered me a substantial sum.  The lender and receiver both refused it.   I found another offer in disclosure.  6 months later someone had apparently offered a substantial sum via an agent.  The receiver again rejected it.  The problem of course was that the agent had inflated the market price to get the business. But no-one was or is ever going to offer their list price.  Yet the receiver wanted/wants to hold out for the list price.  Which means 1y later not only has it not sold - disclosure shows few viewings and zero interest.  It's transparently over-priced.  And tarnished. For those asking why I don't give up - I couldn't/ can't.  Firstly I have fiduciary duties as a trustee. Secondly, legal advice indicates I (as leaseholder) could succeed with a large compensation claim v the lender.  Also - I started a claim v my old lawyer and the firm immediately reimbursed some £s. That was encouraging.  And a sign to continue.  So I'm going for compensation.  I had finance in place (via friend) to do a deal and take the property back off the lender - and that lawyer messed up bad.   He should have done a deal.  Instead further years have been wasted.   Maybe I only get back my lost savings - but that will be a result.   If I can add some kind of complaint/ claim v the receiver's conscious impropriety I will do so.   I have been left with nothing - so fighting for something is worth it. The lender wants to talk re a form of settlement.  Similar to my proposal 2y ago.  I have a pretty clear idea of what that means to me.  This is exactly why I do not give up.  And why I continue to ask for snippets of advice/ pointers on cag.  
    • It was all my own work based on my previous emails to P2G which Bank has seen.
    • I was referring to #415 where you wrote "I was forced to try to sell - and couldn't." . And nearer the start in #79 .. "I couldn't sell.  I had an incredibly valuable asset. Huge equity.  But the interest accrued / the property market suffered and I couldn't find a buyer even at a level just to clear the debt." In #194 you said you'd tried to sell for four years.  The reason for these points is that a lot of the claims against for example your surveyor, solicitor, broker, the lender and now the receiver are mainly founded in a belief that they should have been able to do something but did not. Things that might seem self evident to you but not necessarily to others. Pressing these claims may well need a bit more hard evidence, rather than an appeal to common sense. Can you show evidence of similar properties, with similar freehold issues, selling readily? And solid reasons why the lender should have been able to sell when you couldn't.
    • You can use a family's address.   The only caveat is for the final hearing you'd need to be there in person   HOWEVER i'd expect them to pay if its only £200 because costs of attending will be higher than that
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Deceived into renting, had a hellish experience and now landlord wants to sell


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Just to update this:

 

We have been told we will be served with a section 21 today so it doesn't give us two months notice and it looks like it's invalid! We were never given the gas safety, how to rent and EPC certificate. They sent them on the 18th October with a letter informing us the tenancy was ending. We also don't have smoke alarms on every floor of our home which I believe is another requirement?

 

So we understand that we cant be served with a section 8 until we're in 2 months rent arrears and the section 21 is now invalid. They want us out on 21st December. There's a bit of us that just wants to go and leave the mess behind however it seems like we're in a good position to negotiate now?

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It can’t be less than 2 months and does not mean they can turf you out at the end of the notice, they would then have to go to court. Get advise on how valid the notice. If it is invalid I would wait to go to court then they would have to serve another notice and another eight week wait.

 

As for negotiating, you tried that and you went from the end of January with that month free to having to be out on the 21st of December. Either he is not to be messed with or negotiation is not your strong point.

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It can’t be less than 2 months and does not mean they can turf you out at the end of the notice, they would then have to go to court. Get advise on how valid the notice. If it is invalid I would wait to go to court then they would have to serve another notice and another eight week wait.

 

As for negotiating, you tried that and you went from the end of January with that month free to having to be out on the 21st of December. Either he is not to be messed with or negotiation is not your strong point.

 

Thanks for your advice but I really don't understand why you keep being so negative towards me! You're not our landlord are you haha!? :p

 

It definitely is invalid. My point is, the notice cannot at any point be valid as we weren't given the gas safety certificate, the EPC certificate or the how to rent guide. The agency sent them last month with the end of tenancy letter. It is my understanding that they HAVE to be given to tenants prior to moving in. How can he apply for another possession order as he can't change the fact that this process wasn't followed?

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Which bit is negative, did you not have the offer on the table of leaving at the end of January and then you did something that made the landlord retract that offer and want you out...do you class that as being successful? I feel you may think that you are in some kind of position to negotiate. You were and then now you are not. The LL has served you with the required documents and that is all he is required to do BEFORE he serves you a section 21. It will not void one served after the required documents.

 

It is a shame you see my advice as being negative, I wish you well.

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Thanks for your advice but I really don't understand why you keep being so negative towards me! You're not our landlord are you haha!? :p

 

It definitely is invalid. My point is, the notice cannot at any point be valid as we weren't given the gas safety certificate, the EPC certificate or the how to rent guide. The agency sent them last month with the end of tenancy letter. It is my understanding that they HAVE to be given to tenants prior to moving in. How can he apply for another possession order as he can't change the fact that this process wasn't followed?

 

 

 

 

If your so convinced you right about the s21 or anything else, go to CAB or a solicitor get them to check and stop disagreeing with everyone on CAG and on another forum.

 

https://tinyurl.com/yae3zzry

 

 

....

Please use the quote system, So everyone will know what your referring too, thank you ...

 

 

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You can vacate T on last day of Fixed Term, without Notice.

Beyond that, you are req'd to give min 1 month NTQ to expire at end of next valid Rent period, and liable for rent until then.

LL can serve s8 for a discretionary g10 or 11, even if the Mandatory g8 (2 month rent owing) is not fulfilled.

Negotiate early Surrender with LL asap.

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  • 1 month later...

Hi

 

Just to update this, and ask advice on the next steps (hopefully I won't get shouted at again in here ;)

 

We didn't move out on the 21st December as we were unable to find anywhere right before Christmas. The landlady came to the house the day after the tenancy expired and screamed abuse at me, calling me a mad woman and a liar before trying to barge in to the house with her dogs, wow, merry Christmas haha. I get the feeling the agency may have made us promises without telling them, as she genuinely didn't seem to have any idea that there was a compensation offer made or that we had been offered to stay in January. Or, she's a very good liar.

 

The last we heard from the agency was us asking them to stick to their offer to help us find somewhere else to live, they didn't reply to that. Nor did anyone contact us to arrange moving out and handing over keys and the inspection. Its pretty amazing that the landlady turned up expecting us to be gone without a single conversation with her or the agency but hey ho.

 

So we've asked for a reference in return for us leaving ASAP but of course the landlord won't give us that. The agency have said they will give us a reference if we leave this weekend, which we can't do, and also that they 'are obliged to give an honest reference', I said fine, does that mean you will be honest about the reasons we have complained and have rent arrears.

 

We've been advised that the landlord is applying for an accelerated possession order, which we expected, we again offered to leave ASAP in return for a reference to save him paying the fee but apparently he's already started the process.

 

So we knew he'd take this course of action and we really just want to move on now but two questions 1) will we have to pay his court costs even though we have evidence of him offering to let us stay in January? And also, because we've offered to go to save him applying to court in return for a reference?

 

I can't believe after the hellish experience we've had as tenants, we're being treated like the bad guys to be honest. The list of issues is just insane 1) moved in to a filthy house which we had to pay to have professional cleaned, 2) the landlord let himself in twice, once whilst I was in the shower 3) 6 months of horrific noise 7 days a week, 4) offered compensation then this was revoked 5) offered help to find somewhere else to live by the agency which was revoked, 5) screamed at by the landlady 6) now court. 7) lied to about the length of tenancy and the house placed for sale when we took the house on the basis we could have it for 2 years. Honestly can't believe that the agency won't just do the right thing and accept that the landlord isn't always right, and actually look after their tenants instead of just the landlords.

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The agency doesn't get paid by tenants but by landlords.

Effectively they are LL agents and so they will always side with them, not the tenants.

Go through the motions, you should have enough time to find another place.

I have never seen an eviction order done and dusted in a week.

At best it would take a couple of months until you're kicked out.

From the sound of it, they gave you all required documents along with the notice, so section 21 would be valid.

Regarding the deposit not in the DPS, that's a different matter that you should either use as leverage or sue the LL which would be ordered to pay you 3 times the deposit.

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The agency doesn't get paid by tenants but by landlords.

Effectively they are LL agents and so they will always side with them, not the tenants.

Go through the motions, you should have enough time to find another place.

I have never seen an eviction order done and dusted in a week.

At best it would take a couple of months until you're kicked out.

From the sound of it, they gave you all required documents along with the notice, so section 21 would be valid.

Regarding the deposit not in the DPS, that's a different matter that you should either use as leverage or sue the LL which would be ordered to pay you 3 times the deposit.

 

Sorry the deposit is fine I think. The issues with the paperwork was them not giving us the correct stuff when we moved in, they only sent it with the section 21 which I thought would make it invalid? Also, given they told us we could stay until end of January on 8th November, doesn't that void the section 21 that was sent in October, and also give us a defence as to why we didn't move out on 21st December? We were still waiting for a response from the agent etc.

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Yes, that's what you would argue if it gets to court.

Section 21 notice is still valid, even if extended by mutual agreement like in this case.

Anyhow, you're still in the property, so stay put and find another place as soon as you can.

Let the LL know that you'll be out soon, maybe giving them a date would be best.

Regarding the LL walking into your home uninvited, that's a big no no.

If it happens again, call the police.

In the mean time, if I were you I would change the lock.

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Yes, that's what you would argue if it gets to court.

Section 21 notice is still valid, even if extended by mutual agreement like in this case.

Anyhow, you're still in the property, so stay put and find another place as soon as you can.

Let the LL know that you'll be out soon, maybe giving them a date would be best.

Regarding the LL walking into your home uninvited, that's a big no no.

If it happens again, call the police.

In the mean time, if I were you I would change the lock.

 

It's crossed our minds haha! Thanks for your help.

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...and also give us a defence as to why we didn't move out on 21st December?

 

You don't need a defence as to why you didn't move out on the 21st December, that was the deadline for the notice to seek possession. Now that deadline has passed, the landlord can apply to the court for a warrant of possession.

 

If that happens, you will receive an eviction notice and will have to move out by the date on the notice otherwise bailiffs can force entry to remove you from the premises.

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How many user names do you use

 

nicknock, nikkikitch and NickNack81 on another forum...

 

Yes a few as I've not been able to remember logins and changed computers. Why, is that an issue haha!?

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If you lose your log in details, you just need to contact admin rather than create a new account.

 

Site rules allow two IDs.

 

HB

 

Thanks, there was also an issue with privacy. One of the usernames was known by someone I was asking advice about so I created another.

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