CCJ & Further Hearing- now Order to attend Court for questioning

[HCEOs]

old bill, it really comes down to whether it is financially viable for the creditor. Many creditors that provide bulk instruction will usually monitor the 'costs v recoveries' on a quarterly basis. It is clear that it is a viable solution (the figures add up) as these bulk clients continue to use HCEOs as their preferred method of enforcement.

 

Most bulk issuers will have also carried out their own due diligence on the debtor as it suits nobody to continually instruct HCEOs where no recovery is possible, especially with the old abortive fee increasing to £75 and now triggered at compliance stage (sending of the 7 day letter).

 

My point was really aimed at the litigant in person who thinks that an HCEO is a miracle worker and complains to all and sundry when the debt cannot be collected. Not to mention refusing to pay the abortive fee.

[old bill]

From N1 claims I have seen, the abuse of the legal process by some water companies is obvious. I had three people come to me with County Court summonses for water bill arrears of similar amounts, but with different solicitor's costs amounts. It was blindingly obvious the water company involved was doing it to involve HCEOs and push the defendants into further debt. When the three claims were shown to court staff and they rang the water company to ask what was going on, the water company claimed the solicitor's fees they were claiming were "errors" and solicitor's fees of £300, £400 and £500, respectively, suddenly reduced to £70 on each of the three summonses. It's this sort of abuse that ready does need to be jumped on.

[HCEOs]

I am aware of one water company doing this and from memory they were exposed here on CAG and had their wrists severely slapped by the courts. Whilst this is clearly wrong I'm sure the main objective was recovery by using an HCEO rather than pushing the debtor further into debt. I'm not aware of anything similar by any other utility or bulk issuer of cases and genuinely believe (maybe naively) that this was a one off.

[old bill]

Regrettably, it is not uncommon. What action individual courts take is very much down to the staff at each court; the staff at some courts are better than the staff at other courts for spotting this sort of abuse and nipping it in the bud. Obviously, if a debt is substantial or the debtor is a corporation, I can understand HCEOs getting involved, but most of those the abuse is practised with are residential customers on low incomes.

[HCEOs]

I presume you are talking about a utility company including it's legals expenses as part of the claim as the execution costs for solicitors are set at £51.75 and cannot be increased.

 

Do you have any proof that this is still going on? I would have thought that all of these claims are done electronically through Northampton CCMCC, therefore not giving the court staff an opportunity to view the claim itself.

[wonkeydonkey]

old bill, it really comes down to whether it is financially viable for the creditor. Many creditors that provide bulk instruction will usually monitor the 'costs v recoveries' on a quarterly basis. It is clear that it is a viable solution (the figures add up) as these bulk clients continue to use HCEOs as their preferred method of enforcement.

 

Most bulk issuers will have also carried out their own due diligence on the debtor as it suits nobody to continually instruct HCEOs where no recovery is possible, especially with the old abortive fee increasing to £75 and now triggered at compliance stage (sending of the 7 day letter).

My point was really aimed at the litigant in person who thinks that an HCEO is a miracle worker and complains to all and sundry when the debt cannot be collected. Not to mention refusing to pay the abortive fee.

 

Having been in the position of a litigant in person with the end result going my way, I had to instruct an HCEO. I was fortunate in my choice as I was given guidance by them. I went in with eyes wide open to there being no guarantee monies owed to me would be recovered but not everyone reads the 'instructions' that comes with the goods so I can imagine you will get all sorts thrown at you if you don't come home with the Turkey.

[old bill]

I presume you are talking about a utility company including it's legals expenses as part of the claim as the execution costs for solicitors are set at £51.75 and cannot be increased.

 

Do you have any proof that this is still going on? I would have thought that all of these claims are done electronically through Northampton CCMCC, therefore not giving the court staff an opportunity to view the claim itself.

 

The claims referred were prior to money claims being centralised at Northampton. I have yet to see any claims that have been processed by Northampton since centralisation. If solicitor's costs have now been fixed at the sum you quote, that is good news and for that bit of information I thank you.

[HCEOs]

Solicitors fees for issuing a writ have been fixed at £51.75 for as long as I can remember. These are fees added to the Writ under execution costs making them £111.75. They form part of the actual writ itself rather than fees added by the HCEO.

 

CPR Part 45: Where a writ of control as defined in rule 83.1(2)(k) is issued against any party = £51.75

 

These fees are not for legal work undertaken pre-Writ though so if a legal department are still adding fees for this pre-Judgment they would still remain. The obvious question is whether these fees for legal work are allowable in a claim. My feeling is that they are probably in the small print of T&Cs of the creditor.

[debsdarlo]

I have a CCJ for £7,159 - January 2014

I apply for redetermination hearing - March 2014 and offer £10 a month ( single parent on benefits) - and also inform Judge I have an old Touring Caravan 1999 I could try and sell - my only asset as car on finance and house mortgage.- Other party not happy with £10 a month.

 

 

I am given until June to sell caravan - go back to court in June - other party lives in Wales me in North East so telephone hearing for them - I am billed a further £84for their costs.

Caravan has not sold at this stage - so told to advertise everywhere and pay £20 a month until further notice.

 

 

In July I sell Caravan for £2,000 - my table & chairs for £300 and borrow £2,000 off my Mum - so pay £4,300 - I also paid £1,000 in April borrowed off my BF.- total paid - £5330

 

 

The other party are adding interest on at 8% so debt is still increasing -

 

 

I am fed up with going back to court it costs me more money and why wont the Judge make an order of a monthly amount? I felt he was very biased and even indicated to the other party that their could get a charging order and high court enforcement.

 

 

I have paid off a large chunk of the debt and with my Mum help can offer £50 a month for the remainder -

 

 

What are my chances when I go back in September to this been agreed to - then the other party cant take no further action.

I have asked for a different Judge - as this one attitude was alfull.

[fkofilee]

Did you do an I+E with the judge to prove what you can pay etc?

[debsdarlo]

Yes I did when I applied for redetermination hearing straight after I got CCJ within 14 days - problem is you see different judges - the one I saw in March had obviously read the paperwork and could clearly see I had no money. The Judge in June was dreadful and kept asking me for details until he finally looked at my paperwork and confirmed my income.

[The GodMother]

You could ask the courts to make a order where they cant add interest and they have to take off all they have added. The Judge might not do it but if u dont ask you dont get

[debsdarlo]

how do I go about this? do I need to complete another form?

[debsdarlo]

Right - got a CCJ against me for nearly £8,000 in Jan 2014

applied for Redetermination hearing to pay in instalments -single parent on benefits

 

 

I had an asset of 1997 old touring caravan I offered to try and sell -

 

 

went back to court twice March & June - and was told to sell caravan and pay £20 a month.

 

 

I was informed as debt was over 5k I would have to pay 8% interest on it so - to reduce to under 5k I did the following

 

 

£1,000 - paid in April 0 borrowed from Bf

£2,000 - sold caravan

£300 - sold table & chairs and some jewellery

£110 - made in monthly payments the past 4 months.

£2,000 - borrowed from my mother savings ( she a pensioner)

 

 

Have to go back to court soon - debt is just under £3k now and claimant solicitors are not happy to accept £20 a month - and are talking about high force action, charging orders,

 

 

I have made considerable effort to pay this and their is nothing further to be gained or sold - so how do I argue my case and get the Judge to agree a payment plan to avoid any further action.

 

 

These solicitors also represented my ex husband during our divorce a few yrs ago and lost the case to me so are pretty ruthless.

 

 

I am now currently a full time student at univ and will be for the next three years.

 

 

Any advice I would be most grateful

[goodatresearch]

What sort of debt was this? Statutory interest cannot be added to debts resulting to CCA 1974.

[debsdarlo]

it was a private civil case ( family member)

[AndyOrch]

Debs could you expand on the following ...why.....what have you received what has the claimant requested ?

 

" Have to go back to court soon - debt is just under £3k now and claimant solicitors are not happy to accept £20 a month - and are talking about high force action, charging orders,"

 

Regards

 

Andy

[debsdarlo]

my 2nd hearing in June give me more time to sell caravan and borrow money from mum

- the Judge put in the order

- sell caravan and pay £20 a month

 

 

however, claimant can restore matter back to court

- which they have advised me on Monday when I paid £50 their intend to do that.

 

 

I have increased the payment from £20 a month to £50

- don't know why I have to keep going back to court as other party just add on more costs

 

 

so I am confused as I have done what was requested and actually paid quite a big chunk off.

[Ganymede]

my 2nd hearing in June give me more time to sell caravan and borrow money from mum - the Judge put in the order - sell caravan and pay £20 a month however, claimant can restore matter back to court - which their have advised me on Monday when I paid £50 their intend to do that. I have increased the payment from £20 a month to £50 - don't know why I have to keep going back to court as other party just add on more costs so I am confused as I have done what was requested and actually paid quite a big chunk off.

Have you got a copy of the Court Order that you can scan and post on here please?

[debsdarlo]

got no scanner

 

 

will type what it says:

date 25th june 2014

 

 

1. the defendant debt shall be paid by instalments of £20 per month first payment to be made 28th july

2. The defendant do notify the claimants solicitors by the end of each month for the next 3 months, of the position in relation to sale of caravan.

3.Leave is given to the claimant to restore this matter after 3 months

4.The defendant do pay the claimants costs assessed at £84 to be added to judgement debt.

[AndyOrch]

Well you have increased the payments...done everything asked of you by the Court......not much more they can do .......nothing to restore.

 

Andy

[debsdarlo]

hi

 

I have read some threads but I saw something about new law came into effect 6th April

- my car is on finance and

 

 

I use it to drive to Universty ( 56 mile return trip daily) so its to my place of study.

 

 

Is it true that my car cant be touched or clamped.

[ploddertom]

You are going to have to give some more information as to the background to all this. Are you having hassles with a bailiff for Council Tax, Parking ticket etc? Or as you mention HCEO in your thread title is it to do with a CCJ that has now been transferred up?

[debsdarlo]

it is a CCJ - claimant is talking about HCEO - debt is now £3 k - was originally £8K - civil case - I am a single parent ( full time student) wont accept £20 a month.

[ploddertom]

Thanks for that.

 

How much was the original CCJ for?

Did you know about the debt?

Did you defend it?

Have you thought about applying for a Variation Order - Form N245?