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    • Please see my comments in orange within your post.
    • no i meant the email from parcel2go which email address did they send it from and who signed it off (whos name is at the bottom)
    • I understand confusion with this thread.  I tried to keep threads separate because there have been so many angles.    But a team member merged them all.  This is why it's hard to keep track. This forum exists to help little people fight injustice - however big or small.  Im here to try get a decent resolution. Not to give in to the ' big boys'. My "matter' became complicated 'matters' simply because a lender refused to sell a property. What can I say?  I'll try in a nutshell to give an overview: There's a long lease property. I originally bought it short lease with a s.146 on it from original freeholder.  I had no concerns. So lender should have been able to sell a well-maintained lovely long lease property.  The property was great. The issue is not the property.  Economy, sdlt increases, elections, brexit, covid, interest hikes etc didn't help.  The issue is simple - the lender wanted to keep it.   House or Flat? Before repo I offered to clear my loan.  I was a bit short and lender refused.  They said (recorded) they thought the property was worth much more and they were happy to keep accruing interest (in their benefit) until it reached a point where they felt they could repo and still easily quickly sell to get their £s back.  This was a mistake.  The market was (and is) tough.   2y later the lender ceo bid the same sum to buy the property for himself. He'd rejected higher offers in the intervening period whilst accruing interest. Lenders have a legal obligation to sell the property for the best price they can get. If they feel the offer is low they won't sell it, because it's likely the borrower will say the same. I had the property under offer to a fantastic niche buyer but lender rushed to repo and buyer got spooked and walked.  It had taken a long time to find such a lucrative buyer.  A sale which would have resulted in £s and another asset for me. Post repo lender had 1 offer immediately.  But dragged out the process for >1y - allegedly trying to get other offers. But disclosure shows there was only one valid buyer. Again, points as above. Lender appointed receiver (after 4 months) - simply to try acquire the freehold.  He used his powers as receiver to use me, as leaseholder, to serve notice on freeholders.  Legally that failed. Meanwhile lender failed to secure property - and squatters got in (3 times).  And they failed to maintain it.  So freeholders served a dilapidations notice (external) - on me as leaseholder (cc-ed to lender).   (That's how it works legally) Why serve a delapidations notice? If it's in the terms of the lease to maintain the property to a good standard, then serve an S146 notice instead as it's a clear breach of the lease. I don't own the freehold.  But I am a trustee and have to do right by the freeholders.  This is where matters got/ get complicated.  And probably lose most caggers.   Lawyers got involved for the freeholders to firstly void the receiver enfranchisement notice. Secondly, to serve the dilapidations notice.  The lack of maintenance was in breach of lease and had to be served to protect fh asset. Enfranchisement isn't something that can be "voided", it's in the Leasehold Reform Act 1967 that leaseholders have the right to buy the freehold of the property. It's normal, whether it is a "normal" leaseholder or a repossession with a leasehold house, to claim this right of enfranchisement and sell the property with said rights attached and the purchase price of the freehold included in the final completion price. That's likely what the mortgage provider wished to do. The lender did no repairs. They said a buyer would undertake them. Which was probably correct. If they had sold. After 1y lender finally agreed to sell to the 1st offeror and contracts went with lawyers.  Within 1 month lender reneged.  Lender tried to suggest buyer walked. Evidence shows he/ his lawyers continued trying to exchange (cash) for 4 months.  Evidence shows lender and receiver strategy had been to renege and for ceo to take control.   I still think that's their plan. Redact and scan said evidence up for others to look at? Lender then stupidly chose to pretty much bulldoze the property.  Other stuff was going on in the background. After repo I was in touch by phone and email and lender knew post got to me.   Despite this, after about 10 months (before and then during covid), they deliberately sent SDs and eventually a B petition to an incorrect address and an obscure small court.  They never served me properly.  (In hindsight I understand they hoped to get a backdoor B - so they could keep the property that way.)  Eventually the random court told them to email me by way of service.  At this point their ruse to make me B failed.  I got a lawyer (friend paid). The B petition was struck out. They’d failed to include the property as an asset. They were in breach of insolvency rules. So this is dealt with then. Simultaneously the receiver again appointed lawyers to act on my behalf as leaseholder. This time to serve notice on the freeholders for a lease extension.  He had hoped to try and vary the strict lease. Evidence shows the already long length of lease wasn't an issue.  The lender obviously hoped to get round their lack of permission to do works (which they were already doing) by hoping to remove the strict clauses that prevent leaseholder doing alterations.  You wouldn't vary a lease through a lease extension. You'd need a Deed of Variation for that. This may be done at the same time but the lease has already been extended once and that's all they have a right to. The extension created a new legal angle for me to deal with.  I had to act as trustee for freeholders against me as leaseholder/ the receiver.  Inconsistencies and incompetence by receiver lawyers dragged this out 3y.  It still isn't properly resolved. The lease has already been extended once so they have no right to another extension. It seems pretty easy to just get the lawyer to say no and stick by those terms as the law is on your side there. Meanwhile - going back to the the works the lender undertook. The works were consciously in breach of lease.  The lender hadn't remedied the breaches listed in the dilapidations notice.  They destroyed the property.  The trustees compiled all evidence.  The freeholders lawyers then served a forfeiture notice. This notice started a different legal battle. I was acting for the freeholders against what the lender had done on my behalf as leaseholder.  This legal battle took 3y to resolve. Again, order them to revert it as they didn't have permission to do the works, or else serve an S146 notice for breach of the lease. The simple exit would have been for lender to sell. A simple agreement to remedy the breaches and recompense the freeholders in compensation - and there's have been clean title to sell.  That option was proposed to them.   This happened by way of mediation for all parties 2y ago.  A resolution option was put forward and in principle agreed.  But immediately after the lender lawyers failed to engage.  A hard lesson to learn - mediation cannot be referred to in court. It's considered w/o prejudice. The steps they took have made no difference to their ability to sell the property.  Almost 3y since they finished works they still haven't sold. ** ** I followed up some leads myself.  A qualified cash buyer offered me a substantial sum.  The lender and receiver both refused it.   I found another offer in disclosure.  6 months later someone had apparently offered a substantial sum via an agent.  The receiver again rejected it.  The problem of course was that the agent had inflated the market price to get the business. But no-one was or is ever going to offer their list price.  Yet the receiver wanted/wants to hold out for the list price.  Which means 1y later not only has it not sold - disclosure shows few viewings and zero interest.  It's transparently over-priced.  And tarnished. For those asking why I don't give up - I couldn't/ can't.  Firstly I have fiduciary duties as a trustee. Secondly, legal advice indicates I (as leaseholder) could succeed with a large compensation claim v the lender.  Also - I started a claim v my old lawyer and the firm immediately reimbursed some £s. That was encouraging.  And a sign to continue.  So I'm going for compensation.  I had finance in place (via friend) to do a deal and take the property back off the lender - and that lawyer messed up bad.   He should have done a deal.  Instead further years have been wasted.   Maybe I only get back my lost savings - but that will be a result.   If I can add some kind of complaint/ claim v the receiver's conscious impropriety I will do so.   I have been left with nothing - so fighting for something is worth it. The lender wants to talk re a form of settlement.  Similar to my proposal 2y ago.  I have a pretty clear idea of what that means to me.  This is exactly why I do not give up.  And why I continue to ask for snippets of advice/ pointers on cag.  
    • It was all my own work based on my previous emails to P2G which Bank has seen.
    • I was referring to #415 where you wrote "I was forced to try to sell - and couldn't." . And nearer the start in #79 .. "I couldn't sell.  I had an incredibly valuable asset. Huge equity.  But the interest accrued / the property market suffered and I couldn't find a buyer even at a level just to clear the debt." In #194 you said you'd tried to sell for four years.  The reason for these points is that a lot of the claims against for example your surveyor, solicitor, broker, the lender and now the receiver are mainly founded in a belief that they should have been able to do something but did not. Things that might seem self evident to you but not necessarily to others. Pressing these claims may well need a bit more hard evidence, rather than an appeal to common sense. Can you show evidence of similar properties, with similar freehold issues, selling readily? And solid reasons why the lender should have been able to sell when you couldn't.
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Cabot re lloyds credit card -Illegible agreement - comments please!


senequier
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Hello anyone out there who knows what's what re CCAs and DCAs etc

- will cut short a long story,

 

 

an original creditor defaulted me 2/3 years ago on a credit card debt,

on assigning the account to a DCA, registered amount owing at £0.

 

DCA wrote demanding payment of original debt and I replied giving reason I believed debt to be unenforceable - DCA replied saying would look into this and usually required 4 months to do so.

 

At end of 4 months, I noticed DCA had 'updated' the default, with original amount said to be due, without notifying me, this being some 5/6 weeks ago - still have had no reply from DCA

 

 

- is this in accordance with any of the various terms of credit card acts etc?

- or should I have been written to prior to default being updated

 

 

- I did read somewhere you could only be defaulted once per debt-

 

More than grateful for any comments on this - thanks in advance.

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they will update the Default with their name BUT the original date/amount stays the same they are now the new owner,

 

Unenforceable is no in court (if correct) but the factual situation i.e. monies owed stands for 6 years on a CRA report, just means if only if pre 2007 then the enforceable/unenforceable question comes into play i.e. actual signed agreements etc

:mad2::-x:jaw::sad:
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Hi senequier and Welcome to CAG

 

I have moved your thread to the appropriate forum...please continue to post to your thread here.

 

Regards

 

Andy

We could do with some help from you.

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DCA's are powerless, and they're definitely NOT bailiffs.

 

Who is the card with?

 

Have you reclaimed any of the penalty fees and charges that may have been added to the account?

 

Have you sent them a CCA request, in writing?

 

Stay OFF the phone, only deal with this in writing, if they ring, laugh and hang up.

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Thanks for reply Bazooka Boo

- original creditor passed this to various DCAs

- I asked last one for copy of CCA

,nothing was forthcoming,

and DCA then told me they were passing account back to OC

 

;OC sat on it for some time,

then wrote to say debt had been assigned to new DCA

(should I say who debt is with now - not sure,new to this);

 

I told new DCA, now owner of debt ,this was why I deemed it unenforceable (pre-2007 card) -

 

this is when they said they had a time scale of 4 months to look into matter

- at end of 4 months ,default updated, but nothing sent to me in writing, now 5/6 weeks after.

 

No penalty fees or charges were ever added ,for reasons unknown.

All best,S

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OC and present owner please

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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ok so lets resit this

 

cabot bought the debt

 

Lloyds defaulted it and sold it

when they did, it will show £0 as they've written it off

and reclaimed it against ins/tax .

 

the Buyer will inherit the defaulted date and can update it but not change it.

the balance is however still outstanding so they can report it and doesn't have to tell you anything

 

CCA request time me thinks.

 

when was the card taken out?

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Sit on your hands, withhold any payment you're currently making.

 

Have you evidence of sending the CCA request?

 

Which DCA did you request the CCA from?

 

Have you ever reclaimed all of royds fees/charges on this account?

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Thank you for that - card originally taken out Jan 2003 - I have pointed out to Cab some 5 months ago that no CCA was produced by a previous DCA acting on Lloyds' behalf,but I have had no reply to this.

 

- haven't made any payments since 2012

- have copy of letter dated May 2015 requesting copy of CCA from a previous DCA (Robinson Way) ,

 

reply from DCA same month saying they were requesting it,

followed by two more letters saying still requesting it,

before final letter saying simply they were handing account back to OC.

 

Have never claimed any fees/charges as it seems the last balance has stayed the same. Many thanks again,S

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Then, IMO, you should ignore anything that anyone sends you regarding this, until they have satisfied your request for the CCA then they're unable to take any legal action.

 

All though they like to push the limits of legislation they will undoubtedly continue to act with near impunity until such time it is pointed out to them.

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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One final thought (for now) Bazooka Boo

- if an OC has been unwilling/unable to produce a copy of a CCA for some 18 months

(I read somewhere these should be produced within 12/14 days),

 

and then produce one,

how can one be sure this has not simply been rehashed somehow?

 

Obviously,it must be pretty easy to reconstitute just about anything?

All best,S

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A reconstituted version will not contain your signature.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHER

 

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PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING

EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 

 

 

Any help I am able to give is from my own experience only. Should you have any doubt you should contact a qualified professional.

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If cabot have the debt, then something is definitley wrong with it. They rarely ever enforce legit debts.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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ha ha

 

will keep you informed as we go along....but,thank you renegadeimp!

 

Thank you,theoldrouge

- have just printed that off

- it's just that after,say,20 months,I would be mighty suspicious of whatever might be produced -

 

- have just re-read your link a bit more slowly,and it seems firms have amazing licence in reconstituting agreements

- a 'true copy' does not mean a true copy,

no signature required,

Ts and Cs just need to be those applicable at the time etc

 

 

- I read all the time of copies of CCAs not being produced on request, thereby rendering debts unenforceable, but if it's so easy to rehash an agreement

- or should I say reconstitute

why don't firms rehash more and enforce?

- any opinion?!

All best,S

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enforceability under the CCA is one thing

if a recon would stand up in court is another totally different animal.

 

esp when many of the parts of the recon were not 'what' the punter actually received

but what they found in old filing cabinets and typed on punters details to try and kid them.

 

a recon must be authentic, not a bodged up fake using cut n paste.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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If you have not ever received statutory notices headed “Notice of Default sums” which apparently should be sent at least once a year, how big a deal is it?

 

 

I assume it would not render a debt unenforceable

- if any such notices were sent in my case,

they would have been sent to a company who purported to have taken over my credit card debts (for a fee)

- this company ceased trading so the various card companies started to come back to me.

Any comment gratefully received.

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Notice of default sums

 

Section 12 of CCA 2006 applies to situations where a debtor or hirer under a regulated agreement incurs a default sum.

 

A creditor or owner must give the debtor or hirer a notice in the specified form when a default sum becomes payable as a consequence of a breach of the agreement.

 

This only applies where the default sum exceeds a specified amount.

 

Additionally, a creditor may only require a debtor to pay interest (in connection with a default sum) 28 days after the day the notice was given to the debtor. So if the creditor fails to give notice to the debtor then he cannot enforce the agreement until notice is given.

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