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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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copy and paste the url (where it says http etc etc) at the top

dx

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Laura, now you've taken the immediate steps to defend the claim, it would be a very good idea to read this short thread  https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/406892-highview-parking-anpr-pcn-claimform-urban-exchange-manchester-claim-dismissed/#comments

 

You will learn all the steps of the court procedure from now on.  You'll be forewarned about what is to come.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

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little tip....STOP wasting your time surfing the internet .....you DONT need too.

use our enhanced google searchbox ONLY.

stick to CAG info else you'll be away with the fairies when we dont need you to be.....

 

 

dx

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 8 months later...

A letter was sent by the Court but not received then another letter came in the last couple of weeks saying needed to answer to directions, filled it in sent back to Court said did the defendant agree to Alternative Dispute Resolution and not heard anything since

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you mean you failed to watch mcol and missed DQ N180 filing?

so you've now done this: 


https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/347310-legal-n180-directions-questionnaire-small-claims-track/#comment-5088148


3 copies

yes to mediation (unless you filed our Statute Barred Defence OR this is a claim for a Private Parking Ticket)

1 wit you

Suitability for determination without a hearing? no (that the issues are so complex they need to be argued orally')

the rest is obv

1 to the court

1 to their sols (omit phone/sig/email) if no sols send to claimant

1 for your file

you should not be disappearing for +7 mts, doing something and thinking you've got it right.

always update us on every step whatever it is in/out

dx

 

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Not heard anything for months so wasn`t able to update had Pneumonia been very unwell, this has been the last thing on my mind, as did think after all the advice on here that the claimant would throw the towel in.

My apologies for not updating.

MCOL cannot do anything or look on it as it would not accept password etc so everything done by post unfortunately.

Sent copy to their solicitor and kept one for myself, had to give phone number for mediation no idea when that is meant to happen.

A General Form of Judgement N24 form came saying we had failed to file the directions Questionnaire and had 7 days to do so as of 12th October 2023. (Failed to file the original directions questionnaire has nothing was ever received)

Emailed the questionnaire and sent a hard copy to CCBC.

The form filled in was a N180 Directions Questionnaire (small claims track)

It has been over a month and not heard anything else from the Court or Mediation

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ah yea so you sent to the sols but not the court. understand now. oops!

you should of said NO to mediation anyway ...did you?

so the sols now have your phone number and email too opps twice.

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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I never sent anything to the solicitors concerning the latest things from the Court I just looked at the paper work I have.

I am not the defendant only the parent I have no qualms over Solicitors  having my home number or my hotmail email, my phone does not accept unknown callers.

 

Sadly I did tick to agreeing to mediation.

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Laura,

sorry to hear about health problems, but please try to liaise with the forum from now on, the Directions Questionnaire/N180 is just a simple form and all the confusion and nearly losing the case by default could easily have been avoided.

I have no idea of how you get out of doing mediation.  Hopefully one of the others will be on soon to help.

 

 

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

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if the mediation service ring simply refuse mediation.. end of.

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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I thought the Courts expect you to look like you are trying to be reasonable hence the mediation? if we refuse the mediation what will happen then?

Yes the N180 was easy to fill in but the first one sent was never received with caused the problems as soon as we did receive one we responded and sent it by email and a hard copy too

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not for private parking speculative invoices

you have nothing to mediate over, you are not paying even a reduced invoice sum.


https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/347310-legal-n180-directions-questionnaire-small-claims-track/#comment-5088148


3 copies

yes to mediation (unless you filed our Statute Barred Defence OR this is a claim for a Private Parking Ticket)

1 wit you

Suitability for determination without a hearing? no (that the issues are so complex they need to be argued orally')

the rest is obv

1 to the court

1 to their sols (omit phone/sig/email) if no sols send to claimant

1 for your file

......................

once you refuse mediation the claim will, if the claimant wants too, proceed to allocation at your local stated court.

you seriously should not be disappearing for such long periods and not reading up.

even before your issues you could have started that, you've been here long enough to know CAG is predominantly self help

there are 100's of pcn claimform threads here to read ...20+ each week, get familiar with how things work, whats next, what to do and not and how to respond..but NEVER do anything without checking here FIRST.

dx

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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48 minutes ago, Laura Cooke said:

I thought the Courts expect you to look like you are trying to be reasonable hence the mediation? if we refuse the mediation what will happen then?

Nothing in this type of claim that's why our instructions on completing the DQ states quite clearly no to mediation

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHER

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group - The National Consumer Service

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I'm sorry Andyorch, I don't think that it is clearly stated not to agree to mediation

For 'newbies' the first words are 'YES to nediation. Yes it does add a caviate but this can be lost in the plethora of information.' I have long thought that DX should create two templates, one being specific to Parking issues, clearly stating 'NO to mediation', thus avoiding an error which is increasingly common. I note that dx has highlighted the section in red in his above post, this was not highlighted in his previous posts

It is easy for regulars to forget how confusing it can be for those new to CAG to digest the nuances, when filling in forms that they have never before faced.

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  • I agree 1

My time as a Police Officer and subsequently time working within the Motor Trade gives me certain insights into the problems that consumers may encounter.

I have no legal qualifications.

If you have found my post helpful, please enhance my reputation by clicking on the Heart. Thank you

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the op is not a newbie.

don't ever remember anyone else here misreading or not reading up and saying yes on a PCN Claimform.

we regularly remind people throughout threads to read up and then they already know what to do without our prompting.

if they aint here we cant.

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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I find it difficult to navigate the site

I find things by accident as you have seen from my posts

I do not even know how to post documents up,

I could not even set up the MCOL hence everything I send on behalf of my son is sent by post,

I admit I am as dim as they come using the internet I can only do the basics.

I have been on here a fair few years but I am no wiser for it

I wish things came to me naturally, perhaps your valuable time would be better served on many on here that are able to be educated.

I think people of a near pension age do not fair well understanding the internet.

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then ASK 

members can't help you when you are not here for months for whatever reason as they are not aware you need help and you go off and act upon your own 'thoughts'. if you can do that you are capable of asking here before you make these mistakes.

now im a wee bit confused upon this email address used, i would have assumed , when you are acting or taking actions upon your son's behalf, like filing the dq n180, that you are using HIS details....so where does your email ad come into this? i hope you didn't use that on the DQ n180 to the court and the Claimant?

if you did, it exposes a very big danger here. 

there are deadline in the impending court claim whereby important documents like witness statements must be exchanged by a date set by the court.

if the opposition have an email address 'for the defendant' what they will do is file a load of old BS and fake claims/documents 1 min before a court deadline, that will remove your son's legal right to say 'hang on a minute' .......

so whats the story @Laura Cooke

 

 

.

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Mediation have emailed this afternoon stating they wish to talk to my son next week 20th December between 9.30 and 12.30,  if we did acknowledge to accept the mediation my son would not be able to deal with them due to his mental health it would have to be me or his carer. The email states, please read the following statements mediation is only available if you can answer yeas to all 3.

(1) I am willing to negotiate on the amount of the claim and I will consider a compromise.

(2) I have enough information about the claim to enter into negotiations and do not require any further evidence from the other party before starting mediation

(3) I`m available for the entire time slot on the date of my appointment.

If we let them know we cannot go ahead what will be the outcome of cancelling the mediation? as doubt any Court case could be won without any proof payment was made on the day. It was and help was given to an elderly lady too who did not know how to enter her registration.

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I simply do not know what to do hence why I am asking here, my son does not want to pay anything when a ticket was purchased however I assume then the case would go to Court and without proof of payment surely this case cannot be won and then I assume the payment will have escalated. 

My view and this might be incorrect is to do the mediation and to try and negotiate a smaller payment?

My son cannot believe this is still dragging on and wants an end to it has this is not helping his mental health

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On 20/11/2023 at 23:47, dx100uk said:

yes to mediation (unless you filed our Statute Barred Defence OR this is a claim for a Private Parking Ticket)

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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