PCM windscreen PCN - residential parking - Brentford Lock, Middlesex

[Homer67]

Tell your friend to block the number that they used to text her from, that way they will get an undeliverable report on the text message.

[ajjm]

Good idea, will do, thanks 

[ajjm]

Another letter, uploading for completeness of the thread - I know we don't need to act at this stage. 

 

Parking Gladstones Jan 21 (2).pdf

[dx100uk]

thread tidied pdf rotated and placed above.

 

you are safe to ignore that

 

dx

 

[ajjm]

Thanks

[ajjm]

Well, they are certainly persistent. Attached is a letter received by all 3 of us. It is entitled 'letter before claim' so unsure whether we are still taking the correct course of action to ignore or if we now need to respond. Your advice, as always, gratefully received

Parking Gladstones Feb 21.pdf

[FTMDave]

This time you need to reply - with a snotty letter ridiculing their claim. 

[ajjm]

Any tips?

[honeybee13]

Scroll up this screen to the red strip and the white Search box on the right hand side. If you search for 'snotty letter' you should find examples from other parking threads.

 

HB

[ajjm]

Thanks, have been working on this today, researching and reading.

 

Obviously, each case and relevant law is slightly different.

I have looked back over the early advice I received about the particulars of this situation and am wondering if I need to see a copy of any agreement between the landowner (rather than the management co) and the parking co.

 

Should I ask for this in this letter or is this for further down the line? 

 

I attach a first draft (not yet discussed with my 2 friends who may also have some input) in the hope that you will be able to advise.

 

I haven't made it too rude as my husband is the registered keeper and will have to sign the letter!  

 

 

Edited February 17, 2021 by FTMDave
DOCX file removed. OP has reposted contents in text below

[dx100uk]

docx files have all you info in file/properties/info hidden last post

 

simply post it as plain copy/paste text here.

 

 

[ajjm]

Oops sorry and thanks for that. Letter in plain text:

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

I refer to your letter threatening court proceedings in relation to PCN number…..

I am writing to inform you that I have no intention of paying this ridiculous made-up sum of money for allegedly breaking some imaginary contract/T&Cs with your client.

We all know that these are speculative invoices which you use to prey on vulnerable people who know no better. However, I’m sure that we can both agree that a judge will know better. The charge requested morphed from £100 in one letter to £160 in the next. Another blunder adding this £60 admin fee. I suggest that you look at DDJ Harvey’s judgement at Lewes County Court on 05/02/2020 (Claim number F0HM9E9Z). He was not very happy with these made-up amounts, was he?

 

If you were a bona fide law firm, rather than a debt collection agency posing as one, you would know that your client has no right to demand any payment from me.

 

As a busy NHS employee, you can imagine that I have better and more important things to do right now than deal with your threatening letters. It is a shame that you couldn’t obtain employment that might make you feel good about yourself.

 

Your client can either stop this foolishness now or else I look forward to receiving compensation by way of an unreasonable costs order under CPR 27.14. Of course, as no charge was ever due, under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 they had no right to obtain my details (as the registered keeper) from the DVLA. Should you persist with your threats I will also apply for damages for a breach of GDPR for accessing my details without reasonable cause. This payment will go a long way to fund a much-needed holiday after such a difficult year.

The parking company have no authority to enforce their conditions and therefore the threats to sue are at best empty and at worst harassment and abuse.

I trust that you will desist with these letters rather than waste further time, money and trees.

 I look forward to receiving confirmation that you will be dropping this matter forthwith.

 

Yours etc

 

My 2 friends will need to personalise theirs slightly - one of them the registered keeper of the car (who wasn't the driver) is a serious lawyer so I think that will probably scare them off. The other can also hold her own! I will post anything they share with me here as there will need to be slight tweaks to each letter, although the body will remain similar.

 

Your comments much appreciated, as always

 

AJJM

 

[FTMDave]

The letter is great - you've certainly been reading up!

 

Three tweaks. Write at the start "Dear Will & John" (these are the two charlatans who run Gladstones).

 

Cut out the last paragraph. They'll never acknowledge they're wrong and you don't want to continue correspondance, you want them to go away.

 

Write at the bottom "COPIED TO PCM (UK) LIMITED: YOU DON'T WANT TO BE GLADSTONED!" (this is a quote from the Parking Prankster's blog, it means Gladstones are well known for egging on their clients to start hopeless court cases, after all it's still £££££ for Gladdys. Let PCM know that a court case will only end up creating a hefty hole in their wallet).

 

Don't worry about PCM's contract for the moment, that's for later if they are stupid enough to continue.

 

Just musing now... Gladstones are nasty pieces of work, but they're not stupid. If they get three identical letters about the same parking company, same car park, same day and time of day, that they may try to combine the cases in some way to reduce costs and make money. I may be over thinking it but maybe as you say vary the letters and send them off with a week between them.

[dx100uk]

i would advice your friends not to add very much more than what you have, which, IMHO, is bordering on to much detail upon how you might defend the claim.

 

don't give away details of 'what' might be the contents of your witness statement, after filing a generic defence, should this ever get to court. as pointed to above will/john are not amateurs and will use hints against you later.

[ajjm]

Thanks have made the relevant amendments suggested by FTMDave. Dx100uk -  do you suggest I delete the following from the letter? 

 

they had no right to obtain my details (as the registered keeper) from the DVLA. Should you persist with your threats I will also apply for damages for a breach of GDPR for accessing my details without reasonable cause.

[brassnecked]

I would get rid of that a GDPR claim is something to hit them with once their case gets chucked out

[ajjm]

Ar you suggesting I delete all reference to GDPR keep  a brief reference to it?

How about this?

Your client can either stop this foolishness now or else I look forward to receiving compensation by way of an unreasonable costs order under CPR 27.14 and  under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 . This payment will go a long way to fund a much-needed holiday after such a difficult year etc

[FTMDave]

Change that paragraph to - 

 

Your client can either stop this foolishness now or else I look forward to receiving compensation by way of an unreasonable costs order under CPR 27.14. This payment will go a long way to funding a much-needed holiday after such a difficult year.

 

- sometimes it's hard to get the balance right in snotty letters. On the one hand you need to show you know what you are talking about and would be big trouble in court, on the other hand as dx says you shouldn't play your hand too early. 

 

If no-one else has further suggestions this evening, invest in two 2nd class stamps tomorrow and send off the letters with free Certificates of Posting from the post office. 

 

Come back in a week with a draft of one of your friend's letters. 

[ajjm]

Thanks, so the letter now looks like this (I added the bit in capitals in an inspired moment (!) - what do you think?):

 

Dear Will & John,

 

I refer to your letter threatening court proceedings in relation to PCN number…..

 

I am writing to inform you that I have no intention of paying this ridiculous made-up sum of money for allegedly breaking some imaginary contract/T&Cs with your client.

 

We all know that these are speculative invoices which you use to prey on vulnerable people who know no better. However, I’m sure that we can both agree that a judge will know better. The charge requested morphed from £100 in one letter to £160 in the next. Another blunder adding this £60 admin fee. I suggest that you look at DDJ Harvey’s judgement at Lewes County Court on 05/02/2020 (Claim number F0HM9E9Z). He was not very happy with these made-up amounts, was he?

 

If you were a bona fide law firm, rather than a debt collection agency posing as one, you would know that your client has no right to demand any payment from me. YOUR PREVIOUS ACKNOWLEDGMENT THAT YOU TAKE YOUR FEE FROM PCM WITHOUT DUE DILIGENCE, REGARDLESS OF THE LIKELY OUTCOME IN COURT, MEANS THAT YOU ARE SCAMMING NOT ONLY VULNERABLE INDIVIDUALS BUT ALSO PCM THEMSELVES.

 

As a busy NHS employee, you can imagine that I have better and more important things to do right now than deal with your threatening letters. It is a shame that you couldn’t obtain employment that might make you feel good about yourself.

 

Your client can either stop this foolishness now or else I look forward to receiving compensation by way of an unreasonable costs order under CPR 27.14. This payment will go a long way to funding a much-needed holiday after such a difficult year.

 

The parking company have no authority to enforce their conditions and therefore the threats to sue are at best empty and at worst harassment and abuse.

 

I trust that you will desist with these letters rather than waste further time, money and trees.

 

Sincerely,

 

COPIEDTO PCM (UK) LIMITED: YOU DON’T WANT TO BE GLADSTONED! 

 

I will get this posted to them and PCM later today if you think the new section is OK and I don't receive any further suggested amendments. From my reading, the letter should not have a regular signature but the name should just be typed at the bottom. Is this correct?

The other letters will be posted here in due course.

Huge thanks!

AJJM

[ajjm]

Also, I plan to include the PCN number but not the ref on their LBC. Is this correct?

[brassnecked]

No will & John are a bona- fide law firm, so knock that bit out they are also referred to as the worst solicitors as in lose their clients moneywhen they advice a PPC to do court on flimsy rubbish POC & WS , and they lose, its referred to as being "Gladstoned".

[FTMDave]

Agree with BN, the letter was already fine, and there was already the bit at the bottom about being Gladstoned.

 

I would include both numbers, you want them to know which case you are ridiculing.

 

Yes, don't sign it.

 

Send it off today.  I was thinking that maybe the next letter next week should come from your lawyer friend, in a more formal style and just emphasising she/he is an expert in contract law without giving any other details.  That should "seperate" the letters, and keep Gladdys guessing but also show she/he too would be big trouble in court.

[ajjm]

Ok I clearly got carried away in the excitement! My friends' letters will be posted here when complete and will be posted with the timescale suggested. Have amended my letter which, for completeness of the thread, I post here:

Dear Will & John,

I refer to your letter (Ref xxxxxxx) threatening court proceedings in relation to PCN number xxxxxxx

I am writing to inform you that I have no intention of paying this ridiculous made-up sum of money for allegedly breaking some imaginary contract/T&Cs with your client.

We all know that these are speculative invoices which you use to prey on vulnerable people who know no better.

However, I’m sure that we can both agree that a judge will know better. The charge requested morphed from £100 in one letter to £160 in the next. Another blunder adding this £60 admin fee. I suggest that you look at DDJ Harvey’s judgement at Lewes County Court on 05/02/2020 (Claim number F0HM9E9Z). He was not very happy with these made-up amounts, was he? 

As a busy NHS employee, you can imagine that I have better and more important things to do right now than deal with your threatening letters. It is a shame that you couldn’t obtain employment that might make you feel good about yourself.

 

Your client can either stop this foolishness now or else I look forward to receiving compensation by way of an unreasonable costs order under CPR 27.14. This payment will go a long way to funding a much-needed holiday after such a difficult year.

The parking company have no authority to enforce their conditions and therefore the threats to sue are at best empty and at worst harassment and abuse.

I trust that you will desist with these letters rather than waste further time, money and trees.

 

 

Sincerely,

 

xxxxxxxx

 COPIED TO PCM (UK) LIMITED: YOU DON’T WANT TO BE GLADSTONED! 

 

What a lovely sunny day to cycle to the post office to get my proof of posting receipt!

Thanks to all

[FTMDave]

Remember one copy to Gladys, one to PCM. 

[ajjm]

Yup, copies posted to both. Just sorry I failed to think of potentially the best line I could have used before posting - "as a urologist, I see a lot of balls but this really takes some beating"...