Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • Well done. Are you able to tell us more about how it went on the day please? HB
    • when mediation call they will ask the same 3 questions that are in their email you had to accept it going forward. simply state 'i do not have enough information from the claimant to make an informed decision upon mediation so i refuse. end of problem.  
    • Food prices, including a $40 chicken, has stoked fury and calls for big foreign supermarket chains to come to Canada.View the full article
    • Which Court have you received the claim from ? Civil National Business CEntre Name of the Claimant ? Lowell Portfolio i Ltd How many defendant's  joint or self ? Self   Date of issue –  15 Feb 2024 Particulars of Claim What is the claim for – the reason they have issued the claim?  The claim is for the sum of £922 due by the Defendant under and agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 for a Capital One account with an account reference of [number with 16 digits] The Defendant failed to maintain contractual payments required by the agreement and a Default Notice was served under s.87(1) of the Consumer Credit ACt 1974 which has not been complied with. The debt was legally assigned to the claimant on 16-06-23, notice of which has been given to the defendant. The claim includes statutory interest under S.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at a rate of 8% per annum from the date of assignment to the date of the issue of these proceedings in the sum of £49.15 The Claimant claims the sum of £972 What is the total value of the claim? £1112 Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? I dont know the details of the PAPDC to know if it was pursuant to paragraph 3, but I did receive a Letter of Claim with a questionaire/form to fill. Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? No Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? Credit Card When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? no Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? Online Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Yes Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Assigned/purchaser Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? I was aware, I'm not certain I received a 'Notice of Assignment' from Capital One but may have been informed the account had been sold without such a title on the letter? Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? Yes Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? Not since the debt purchase, and not from Capital One. Why did you cease payments? I can't remember - it was the tail end of the pandemic and I may not have had enough income to keep up payments - I am self-employed and work in the event industry - at that time. I also had a bank account that didn't allow direct debits and may have just forgotten payments and became annoyed at fines for late payments. What was the date of your last payment? Appears to be 20/4/2022 Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? No Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? No Here is my Defence: Defence - 1. The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are vague and generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made. 2. Paragraph 1 is noted. I have in the past had an agreement with Capital One but do not recognise this specific account number or recollect any outstanding debt and have therefore requested clarification by way of a CPR 31.14 and section 78 request.. 3. Paragraph 2 is denied. I am unaware of having been served with a Default Notice pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act 1974. 4. Paragraph 3 is denied. I am unaware of any legal assignment or Notice of Assignment pursuant to the Law and Property Act 1925 Section 136(1) 5. The Defendant has sent a request by way of a section 78 pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act 1974, for a copy of the agreement, the Claimant has yet to comply and remains in default of said request. 6. A further request has been made via CPR 31.14 to the Claimants solicitor, requesting disclosure of documents on which the Claimant is basing their claim. The Claimant has not complied and to date nothing has been received. 7. It is therefore not accepted with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant and the Claimant is put to strict proof to: a) show how the Defendant has entered into an agreement and; b) show how the Claimant has reached the amount claimed for and; c) show the nature of the breach and evidence by way of a Default Notice pursuant to sec 88 CCA1974 d) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim 8. As per Civil Procedure 16.5 it is expected that the claimants prove the allegation that the money is owed 9. On the alternative, as the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of section 136 of the Law of Property Act and section 82A of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 10. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief. .................. Please note that I had to write a defence quite quickly as I hit the deadline. At the time of writing the defence, I hadn't been able to find correspondence from Capital One, but had since found default letter etc. I submitted CCA request and CPR 31.14. However, I didn't get any proof of postage or use registered post for the CPR (an oversight) but did with the CCA request. I received a pack which included a letter from Overdales, going over the defence I'd filed, as well as letters of Lowells and reprints of letters from Capital One. But I have no idea if this pack is in response to the CCA request or the CPR ! I would have expected two separate responses ... although I do know they are both the same company. Looking over the pack today, and looking through old emails .. I find some discrepancies in the Capital One default letters (notice of default and Claim of default). They are both dated *before* an email I have stating that a default can be avoided. The one single page of agreement sent (so not the full agreement) has a 16 digit number at the top in small print, next to 'Capital One' which corresponds to a number called 'PURN' printed at the top of each of the 10 pages of ins and outs of the account (they're not official statements, but a list of monthly goings) yet no mention anywhere on either of the account number. I cant really scan them at the moment - I can later tomorrow, but that will be after the mediation call I'm sure. I guess I may be on my own for this mediation ... I am not certain the CCA request has been satisfied .. or if the CPR has been . And then I appear to have evidence that the Default notices provided are fabricated ? Yet, I do have (elsewhere ... not at home) Default letters from Capital One I can check ..
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

Eviction for Benefit Fraud. Please Help.


inn0cence
style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 2843 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 217
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

I shall retire gracefully from this thread so as not to add to any furthur confusion by asking the same question 3 times with no answer..I wish you luck

 

 

L

  • Haha 1

Lillibelle

 

I only know what I know cos I know it,I only give advice,I'm not legally trained nor do I pretend to be.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry it has taken me so long to reply.

 

Thanks id6052 for your insight.

You have it pretty much sewn up.

The part about the HB claim is spot on.

Why the LA is tending to mess my friend about is beyond me. She has given them everything they have asked for.

The bit about how much evidence the BFraud ppl have. My friend is absolutely adamant that they dont have any evidence.

I don't know what to think. Maybe they don't have evidence that's why they are trying to mess her about for a bit. Till the appeal. I don't know anymore.

 

Why have they sent balifs to collect CT money when The case has not even been to the tribunal? Or courts I can't understand.

 

@45002. He was at her house for 5/6 nights at a time when she was in hospital for operations. She had these operations over a few years. He was only staying during ops.

 

@mariner51.

I have noted what you have posted. I shall do that in future.

 

@Lillibelle.

He doesn't have his belongings at her house, other than lawnmower, and some gardening tools and some junk in the shed.

Yes they are asking for return payment of HB and income support. They keep writing and telling her to start a payment plan to repay it. they haven't pushed this to balifs yet.

Her recent claim for HB did not get refused. They are asking for more proof. And now they say it could take up to 4 wks to process. (3 wks left now)

 

@ Lillibelle.

you have been very helpful in the past. I would appreciate it if you still kept an eye on this thread please.

I was at work the other day and real busy. It was mad and every time I replied to a post Someone else, went back and asked the same question. I felt like I was taking 1 step forward and 3 steps backward. It was my fault for making another thread. I know that now. Lesson learned.

 

Update: have spoken to shelter and have been advised not to open door to anyone and have appointment with them next week.

 

Now just waiting on housing benefit process.

Im going crazy. Wonder what she is going through.

Sometimes I wish I never got involved. I feel like walking away.

But I don't think I could live with that.

Shelter say my friends case looks good.

We shall find out.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry it has taken me so long to reply.

 

 

 

@45002. He was at her house for 5/6 nights at a time when she was in hospital for operations. She had these operations over a few years. He was only staying during ops.

 

 

From what you posted so far the council Do have some kind of evidence !

 

But what is that evidence ?

 

Maybe a close friend or relative upset about something have been contacting the council or even the father of her children has been doing the dirt on her ?

 

The Neighbours may having been reporting to fraud department some else living with her or even where your friend lives has been under surveillance by fraud department,these things have been know to happen !

Please use the quote system, So everyone will know what your referring too, thank you ...

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Her claim this time may well be valid,,,it does seem to be taking a long time tho,,my own LA move quicker than that in urgent cases,especially with eviction looming,,and there is no guarantee that the LA won't still press for eviction even if she does get the claim through.( I may be wrong there,I'm happy to be corrected)

I got frustrated with you because it simply does not make sense,and when it doesn't make sense it normally means it's not completely true.you may be being misled too.

 

If she is being asked for refunds of ctax/hb AND IS for 5/6 years she is up the creek cos thats going to be a massive amount of money and I would imagine they have pretty rock solid proof that the claims weren't valid. As I said earlier,,it's not down to them to prove he did live there (they already know) it's she that has to prove he didn't and speaking from the fence...I think he probably did,,maybe not consistently,but by your own words,he stayed there for long periods and she should have declared iit. I'm glad she went to Shelter as I would advise her to have alternative accomodation lined up if the eviction goes ahead,If she does get benefits back bear in mind how much she is going to have taken off her for the repayments..Also,why hasn't she received ANY mail re the ctax? She would have been notified of the investigation,,the LO hearing,,the final warnings etcetc before the bailiff was involved.

She needs to get all her ducks lined up as it were and start dealing with these issues,,making sure she has a translator with her as you say her English is poor,it's not a good enpugh defence to say she doesn't understand whats going on,there are plenty of multi lingual people available for cases such as these.

Lillibelle

 

I only know what I know cos I know it,I only give advice,I'm not legally trained nor do I pretend to be.

Link to post
Share on other sites

From what you posted so far the council Do have some kind of evidence !

 

But what is that evidence ?

 

Maybe a close friend or relative upset about something have been contacting the council or even the father of her children has been doing the dirt on her ?

 

The Neighbours may having been reporting to fraud department some else living with her or even where your friend lives has been under surveillance by fraud department,these things have been know to happen !

 

My thoughts exactly 45002,,seen plenty of programmes on TV where benefit fraud depts film people suspected of fraud..If Mr A thinks Mr B is getting something he shouldn't be,,he won't think twice of dobbing him in..I get the impression,,considering the 5/6 years of benefits they want back,that she has been watched/checked on for quite a while because the LA seem pretty sure of their facts. The 'no fixed abode' doesn't seem right and certainly doesn't help her case..he wasn't NFA for the 9 years before starting a business? Does he live at the business address? If not,,where? She has a lot of explaining to do methinks..

Edited by Lillibelle

Lillibelle

 

I only know what I know cos I know it,I only give advice,I'm not legally trained nor do I pretend to be.

Link to post
Share on other sites

During the interview she was asked when did her ex start visiting the kids again. She repiled that it was about 5/6 years ago during the time of her first operation.

 

Sounds like BFraud put 2 + 2 together and got 5.

 

I don't find it feasible for BFraud to investigate for 5 years and not do anything about it. I think they just accuse for 5 yrs because that's when her ex's letters came to the house.

Edited by inn0cence
Link to post
Share on other sites

My thoughts exactly 45002,,seen plenty of programmes on TV where benefit fraud depts film people suspected of fraud..If Mr A thinks Mr B is getting something he shouldn't be,,he won't think twice of dobbing him in..I get the impression,,considering the 5/6 years of benefits they want back,that she has been watched/checked on for quite a while because the LA seem pretty sure of their facts. The 'no fixed abode' doesn't seem right and certainly doesn't help her case..he wasn't NFA for the 9 years before starting a business? Does he live at the business address? If not,,where? She has a lot of explaining to do methinks..

 

My thoughts as well.

 

During the interview she was asked when did her ex start visiting the kids again. She replied that it was about 5/6 years ago during the time of her first operation.

 

Sounds like BFraud put 2 + 2 together and got 5.

 

I don't find it feasible for BFraud to investigate for 5 years and not do anything about it. I think they just accuse for 5 yrs because that's when her ex's letters came to the house.

 

Unless I missed something in your thread,are you saying now your Friend has already had a "IUC" Interview under caution ?

 

This sounds even more serious now

 

Yes your right 5 year investigation does sound a bit long,but they have been investigating from what you posted so far

 

That's not legal advice.

 

She needs a criminal solicitor, preferably one who specialises in benefit fraud.

 

 

Good Advice Lea_HTH

Please use the quote system, So everyone will know what your referring too, thank you ...

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

That's not legal advice.

 

She needs a criminal solicitor, preferably one who specialises in benefit fraud.

she has one, that also speaks the same language as her. He was at the IUC with her. he is the one that has done her appeals.

but he doesn't do cival court.

Link to post
Share on other sites

she has one, that also speaks the same language as her. He was at the IUC with her. he is the one that has done her appeals.

but he doesn't do cival court.

 

The eviction/repossession issue is a civil matter, but if she's being prosecuted for benefit fraud that's criminal, not civil.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING. EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 

The idea that all politicians lie is music to the ears of the most egregious liars.

Link to post
Share on other sites

45002 WROTE:

Unless I missed something in your thread,are you saying now your Friend has already had a "IUC" Interview under caution ?

 

This sounds even more serious now

 

Yes your right 5 year investigation does sound a bit long,but they have been investigating from what you posted so far

 

sorry i thought you guys would know that. because we have talked about appeals and stuff. you only get to the appeal hearing after IUC.

 

 

NEWS:

just found out her ex had bank statements at her house from early 2007 to mid 2010.

that is 3 yrs. benefit fraud want to know from 2005 to present.

very strange.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The eviction/repossession issue is a civil matter, but if she's being prosecuted for benefit fraud that's criminal, not civil.

 

yeah thanks.

got that.

her solicitor will deal with tribuneral appeals and the going to court and stuff. but he doesnt do civil, which is where the rent got dealt with.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually, what your friend needs most right now is an experienced benefit adviser to take over the case going to Tribunal. This adviser could then try and get the case heard urgently, and were it me I would make the request for a revision of the new claim into an appeal request and try to get both heard at the same time, since they deal with the same matter - when and when not the ex was living at her house and whether he is currently living there.

 

Everything will hinge on the appeals, so getting help with this along with help from shelter should be a priority. She needs the urgent hearing on both claims, and she needs to be putting together evidence for the time period in question that ex wasn't living there, and explanation (ie hospital stay) for the times he stayed there. How co-operative is the ex? Is he willing to provide information about where he was staying during the time periods, and documents proving his address now? If he stayed with people, are they willing to provide statements confirming he was staying there? When she gets the appeal pack through she will need to go through the evidence with the benefit adviser, and have a reasonable explanation for everything.

 

The difficulty will be for any periods where he was 'no fixed abode' or couldn't prove where he was staying - the absence of any evidence of the ex living elsewhere, will be considered sufficient to show he was living with her.

 

She needs a benefit adviser experienced in appeals, preferably LTAHAW appeals. Successfully showing that the ex doesn't currently live with her is the only way of keeping her home. Successfully proving at appeal that the ex wasn't living with her during the time periods in question may well be the only way of avoiding prosecution. A criminal solicitor can be found later if charges are brought (assuming they haven't been, if they have then she ALSO needs a criminal solicitor).

 

An interpreter can be provided by welfare rights organisations and law centres for the appts.

We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office ~ Aesop

Link to post
Share on other sites

You seem to have missed out in earlier posts that she was already interviewed under caution and that she had a solicitor, and that she'd already gone through the appeals process...maybe you did mention that, I can't be bothered to re-read 9 pages of posts to find out. Nonetheless, I had already gathered, as I believe most others posting here, that the story was not a full story. Really, your 'friend' is in very deep trouble, and if convicted is likely to get a prison sentence as I cannot imagine the fraudulently claimed benefits over a 6 year period are less than 20k.

 

Shelter can assist with the housing issue - but further to my earlier response (a few days back), it is highly unlikely she will get her housing benefit reinstated this far along in the prosecution process - I believe I did say that giving accurate information would elicit accurate assistance. Her benefits are likely to have been suspended, rather than merely cancelled, which makes a material difference. If found innocent, then all her back payments will be re-instated, however in the interim, it is likely that only small payments will be made to her, if anything at all, and if convicted then the HB won't be paid and she'll be evicted. She won't be homeless however, as I said she'll likely go to prison. And if her partner was complicit in the fraud, he'll be investigated and prosecuted too - which may explain his evasiveness.

 

The court may wait until the process is over before evicting.

 

Sorry, but there is no way to sugar-coat this information - benefit fraud is serious, and if she's been interviewed under caution and been through the appeals process she KNOWS what evidence they have against her as at some point they would have revealed as much - hence getting her admittance that he was there sometimes for 5/6 years. If there was no evidence as you have stated on several occasions, then this investigation would have ended some point after the first interview. You may not be being given the whole story - and if you are, then you are not giving it to us here - but most of us aren't foolish enough to not be able to read between the lines.

Edited by Lea_HTH
Added info re partner.
Link to post
Share on other sites

yeah thanks.

got that.

her solicitor will deal with tribuneral appeals and the going to court and stuff. but he doesnt do civil, which is where the rent got dealt with.

 

If the solictor hasn't already requested an urgent appeal, advised appealing the recent HB claim decision and started trying to get evidence showing the ex was living elsewhere, then he doesn't know enough about benefits to take this case to tribunal.

We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office ~ Aesop

Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually, what your friend needs most right now is an experienced benefit adviser to take over the case going to Tribunal. This adviser could then try and get the case heard urgently, and were it me I would make the request for a revision of the new claim into an appeal request and try to get both heard at the same time, since they deal with the same matter - when and when not the ex was living at her house and whether he is currently living there.

 

OP said the appeals have been 'done'.

Link to post
Share on other sites

yeah thanks.

got that.

her solicitor will deal with tribuneral appeals and the going to court and stuff. but he doesnt do civil, which is where the rent got dealt with.

 

Again, you seem to be posting different information - in post 166 you state the solicitor 'has done the appeals', that's past tense. In this post you say 'will deal'.

 

Which is it?

Link to post
Share on other sites

@ Lea_HTH please read this.

 

45002 WROTE:

Unless I missed something in your thread,are you saying now your Friend has already had a "IUC" Interview under caution ?

 

This sounds even more serious now

 

Yes your right 5 year investigation does sound a bit long,but they have been investigating from what you posted so far

sorry i thought you guys would know that. because we have talked about appeals and stuff. you only get to the appeal hearing after IUC.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry inn0cence,,I had no idea she had an IUC,,I was under the 'clearly wrong' impression she had toddled to the eviction hearing and the Judge had re set for 8 weeks,and that she had not understood anything because of the language barrier,,,I have to give way to the more knowledgeable folks on here,this is serious stuff and I would be wrong to even try and advise you furthur except to say I wish her luck cos ,from what you have said,she is in serious serious trouble and I don't think ignorance of the benefit system and language issues are a good enough defence.

Lillibelle

 

I only know what I know cos I know it,I only give advice,I'm not legally trained nor do I pretend to be.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...