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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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NCO Europe KEEP calling!


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I HOPE they GIVE ME A JOB..............

 

Hello, I want to know if you have any jobs on the go. I am arrogant, loud, ignorant, abusive and love putting the phone down on my customers. Additionally, I am able to harrass, send pointless letters and intimidate members of my clients family. I understand that your policy is to call people and not say who is speaking...and when asked, to put the phone down on them and abuse innocent people upto as late as 9pm even though children are in bed.

 

I feel that I am most suited to this position because, like your other staff, I am a complete waste of space, have very little communication skills or qualifications and am desperate to earn pathetic wages for long boring hours being bossed around by gormless team leaders.

 

I hope you will consider me for the position of "Mr Telephone Caller" at your Preston office in the UK. I love Preston, it is such a fabulous bustling city with lots of fast food joints and loose women. I will fit in perfectly there.

 

Lots of love

Your future employee and bestest friend in the wurld

 

ha ha ha ha you will get a job with them then. send above off to them :D

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well NCO just offerd me 25% off if i pay them with in 14 days WOW guess they are a bit peeved as they cant get hold of me by phone i changed the no and not by email either i blocked them there too .as if i am going to pay up DONT THINK SO i would love to go to court and let them not only show me a credit agrement i singed .but to let the judge know what a ****** organization pay pal are to allow honest people to be riped off

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Great thread and lots of useful information!

 

I have had debt collectors calling me for about a year now, I just ignore them and eventually the stop but a Paypal debt has been passed to NCO and they call a few times a day. I have no problem with wasting their time and just fobbing them off, the problem is and what really is annoying me is they cant even say my name! The guy can hardly talk english when I answer the phone and say hello he says:

 

I WANT TO TALK TO "Name i cant say properly"

 

I say you want to or you wish to? And it just goes from there. They refuse to say who they are although 1471 3 returns the call to NCO Europe. Total **** in my opinion and I am glad others are not taking these cowboys seriously!

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Great thread and lots of useful information!

 

I have had debt collectors calling me for about a year now, I just ignore them and eventually the stop but a Paypal debt has been passed to NCO and they call a few times a day. I have no problem with wasting their time and just fobbing them off, the problem is and what really is annoying me is they cant even say my name! The guy can hardly talk english when I answer the phone and say hello he says:

 

I WANT TO TALK TO "Name i cant say properly"

 

I say you want to or you wish to? And it just goes from there. They refuse to say who they are although 1471 3 returns the call to NCO Europe. Total **** in my opinion and I am glad others are not taking these cowboys seriously!

Without appearing to be racist which I certainly am not I find trying to speak to them with correct usage of the quuens English is always a source of fun as is replying to their questions with a question. Once you get them off their prepared script you have them beaten

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Well, there time was up with my CCA request on Monday. Duly sent letter of complaint to Lancashire Trading Standards and a very nice letter to Mr S Leatham-Locke telling him to take my number of their system. See whether he complies, if he doesn't I feel another complaint coming on.

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Without appearing to be racist which I certainly am not I find trying to speak to them with correct usage of the quuens English is always a source of fun as is replying to their questions with a question. Once you get them off their prepared script you have them beaten

 

 

I do the exact same, they just get wound up and put the phone down.

 

Slightly off topic but I refuse to talk to them call centers abroad for the simple reason I was laid off work because our company out-sourced staff to India just so the company could save a few quid hundreds of us lost our jobs. The big companies just dont care any more BANKS included.

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I LIKE THE WAY YOU ARE ALL AGAINST NCO FOR US THAT WORK THERE IT PAYS THE BILLS AND IM SURE U MUST REALISE THAT WE ARE ACTING ON BEHALF OF CLIENTS. ALSO TO CLARIFY A FEW THINGS WE ARE ACTUALLY ENTILTED TO CALL PEOPLE TWICE A DAY BEFORE IT IS CLASSED AS HARRASSMENT. IF THERE IS A MISTAKE WITH AN ACC WE DO WHAT WE CAN TO RESOLVE THE MATTER ON YOUR BEHALF AND WITH OUR CLIENTS. TO BE HONEST ITS A JOB IT PAYS THE BILLS AND IF U DONT WANT US TO CALL YOU THEN PAY UP AFTER ALL WE HAVE A LIVING TO MAKE ASWELL

 

:p

 

sorry pal but your company calls me all day everyday and alway more than 8 times a day so thats constitutes harrassment to me when your company call me all they say is "is mr so and so there i say yes whos speaking they say confirm your details first and well tell you.

sorry but untill i know who nco europe are and what debt they are chasing up im not giving any of my details over the phone.

and monday just gone was the best call of all it went like this

"after the usual introduction "well if you dont pay what u owe us well see u in court and before we see you in court we will visit you with baseball bats" bring it on you pathetic excuse for a call centre person and best of all when i reported this to the police and they contacted you they were told theres no management to speak to

then they phone from a birmingham number and say there from preston EH hows that work

ive since found out that my debt is for £7.23

what a joke this company is i wont be paying and i have the recording of your threatning phone call to me so i will see YOU in court not the other way round

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sorry pal but your company calls me all day everyday and alway more than 8 times a day so thats constitutes harrassment to me when your company call me all they say is "is mr so and so there i say yes whos speaking they say confirm your details first and well tell you.

sorry but untill i know who nco europe are and what debt they are chasing up im not giving any of my details over the phone.

and monday just gone was the best call of all it went like this

"after the usual introduction "well if you dont pay what u owe us well see u in court and before we see you in court we will visit you with baseball bats" bring it on you pathetic excuse for a call centre person and best of all when i reported this to the police and they contacted you they were told theres no management to speak to

then they phone from a birmingham number and say there from preston EH hows that work

ive since found out that my debt is for £7.23

what a joke this company is i wont be paying and i have the recording of your threatning phone call to me so i will see YOU in court not the other way round

I hope the Police take this report seriously and take these bullies every inch of the way. If someone from NCO gets time I wonder who will pay the bills then. How will their family feel when his colleagues ring up demanding money

 

Shoe on Other Foot Time

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Oh, I'm liking this one BIG time

omnia praesumuntur legitime facta donec probetur in contrarium

 

 

Please note: I am not a member of the legal profession, all advice given is purely my opinion, if in doubt consult a professional

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Maybe it will feature on Crimewatch. Hope it at least makes the papers. Bet they are all reading this thread in the call centre waiting to see who is going to get a visit from the boys in Blue. This has made my day :D

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Is this correct- they threatened you with baseball bats?

 

Did you get a crime number?

 

oh yes got the crime reference number

what i forgot to say in my first post was i recorded the call

as i was sick to the back teeth with them phoning and being abusive to me id had enough

fair enough i owe money to a mobile phone company £7.23 but hell if i didnt get the abuse off them id pay but being threatened by a jumped up little twerp over a phone they can whistle for there money now

anyway im still waiting for the visit with bats LOL i too am waiting with baited breath for them to turn up cause im 6ft 6in tall 19 stone and am currently serving with 2 para parachute regiment and on leave for 3 weeks so this encounter if it ever happens will be oh so damn fun hehehe

i will gladly keep you all updated as to the outcome of this

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Why not use your parachute to tie them up in when they call, I don't believe it can be classed as an 'offensive weapon'!

 

I found a cheap recording gadget in Maplins yesterday, cost about £12 and you can use it on mobile phones as well, I'm very tempted to get this as o2 keep calling me saying its a 'courtesy call' and then trying to get me to go onto direct debit.... Complaint to Trading Standards about o2 going out today in post.

 

If you work out the cost of the calls from the company against the cost of the debt it is disproportionate. I still think "Won Ton's Chinese Laundry and Brothel" is a good one to answer with when they are in pester mode. (Old line of one of my brothers.

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i have a prob with NCO europe they wont stop calling what should i do now ?

back in november 06 i bought a guitar from e bay but paypal messed up the payment instead of taking the money from my pre paid credit card they tried to take it from my bank acount that was never set up with e bay...ok so i tried to pay paypay i contacted them without luck so what i did was to keep the money aside so thtat when it was time to pay or somebody came calling i had the money ...on the 2nd march 2007 i got a call from NCO Europe asking me for the fifty ponds i owed to e bay , i said to them ring me back in one hour as i needed to go and load the money onto my pre paid credit card !! i did this and within an hour a very nice lady called me back and i piad the outstanding balance end of story .... well no since then i have received around 3 calls per day saying i havent payed dispite me e mailling them my statement to say ive paid i also get this number showing on my phone nobody is ever ther its 01212107400 .

today i was bad during a game of golf my phone rang and i cracked telling them to f**k off so far ive not had any more calls but i wonder if i have any case for harrassment ????

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i have a prob with NCO europe they wont stop calling what should i do now ?

back in november 06 i bought a guitar from e bay but paypal messed up the payment instead of taking the money from my pre paid credit card they tried to take it from my bank acount that was never set up with e bay...ok so i tried to pay paypay i contacted them without luck so what i did was to keep the money aside so thtat when it was time to pay or somebody came calling i had the money ...on the 2nd march 2007 i got a call from NCO Europe asking me for the fifty ponds i owed to e bay , i said to them ring me back in one hour as i needed to go and load the money onto my pre paid credit card !! i did this and within an hour a very nice lady called me back and i piad the outstanding balance end of story .... well no since then i have received around 3 calls per day saying i havent payed dispite me e mailling them my statement to say ive paid i also get this number showing on my phone nobody is ever ther its 01212107400 .

today i was bad during a game of golf my phone rang and i cracked telling them to f**k off so far ive not had any more calls but i wonder if i have any case for harrassment ????

The letters will start soon plus the calls to neighbours

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mickey- I had exactly the same problem last year. NCO wouldnt listen.

 

I got it sorted in the end by starting a thread on the Ebay Payment and Postage forum telling the wider Ebay comunity about NCO and Paypal's unlawfull harassment. Soon caught the eye of Paypal's online Ebay rep Kim and it was sorted within days.

 

use this as the title of your thread:

 

FAO Kim-Never ending NCO/Paypal harrasment.

 

go here:

 

eBay Forums: Payments & Postage Board

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ok thanks for your advise i did just that and have posted under my e bay user name thequoman also today ive been to the police and logged the harrasing numbers and been on to orange who will block the numbers from there melicous calls dept
Well done. NCO are becoming very unpopular. Wonder why:-x

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Well after my letter to Mr Leatham-Locke I received a letter today from a Miss Walters, posted in Birmingham. Its a classic, still smiling, its unbelievable. I will give you the gist. Acknowledged my recent letter dated 18th April, it was actually dated 16th April. Didn't think the number of calls made (13) were harassment. Listed the days phoned.

25.01.07 Voicemail message left (they were originally writing to my old address where I haven't lived since 1992. The occupant doesn't have voicemail).

4 dates no answer

2 left messages with other

6 no answer.

How can they leave messages they don't know how to speak.

She refers to when I contacted them on 9th February when they supposedly asked me of my intentions how I was going to pay. My response to this was that I would call back after speaking with their client. I had actually rang to complain about them writing to my old address and sending one of their infamous cards. As of today's date we have yet to receive this call and they want to know by repayment proposals. In the meantime they can confirm that they have requested a copy of the agreement from their client.

I have written no less than 7 times one being a CCA request on 28th February. The letter on 16th April was the default letter.

Have you stopped laughing yet?

I have responded accordingly enclosing a copy for the Lancashire Trading Standards and have now sent all correspondence so that they can see what a lot of planks we are having to deal with. Also, I have now had confirmation that we should complain to the CSA. FSA don't want to know.

Its a good job I've got a good sense of humour and not easily rattled.

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I would personally stick a complaint in to the OFT as well - they will take action if enough people complain.

All help is merely my opinion only - please seek legal advice if you need to as I am only qualified in SEN law.

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