CEL PCN Claimform - Appealed - Red Lion Car Park, Wetherby LS22 6LR

[Nick]

hich Court have you received the claim from ? MCOL Northampton N1 

Name of the Claimant :      Civil Enforcement LTD     

Claimants Solicitors: no solicitor named

Date of issue – 02/04/2024

Date for AOS - 19/04/2024

Date to submit Defence - 03/05/2024

What is the claim for – Claim for Money relating to a parking charge for breach of contract terms/conditions (TCs) for parking in a private car park(CP) managed by claimant. Drivers may only park pursuant to TCsof use displayed in CP and agreed upon entry/parking. ANPR Cameras or manual patrols monitor vehicles entering/exiting the CP and agreed upon entry/exiting the CP and TC Breaches.

What is the value of the claim? £170

Amount Claimed £192.88

court fees £35

legal rep fees £50

Total Amount £277.88

Have you moved since the issuance of the PCN? No

Did you receive a letter of Claim With A reply Pack wanting I&E etc about 1mth before the claimform? N

[honeybee13]

Hi.

Thank you for the court claim information.

Could you also let us have the details we ask for in the other forum sticky please? It will add extra information that will help us.

HB

[Nick]

1 Date of the infringement 23/07/2022

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] unsure

[scan up BOTH SIDES as ONE PDF- follow the upload guide] please LEAVE IN LOCATION AND ALL DATES/TIMES/£'s

3 Date received unsure

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?] unsure

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? unsure

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal] I did appeal showing evidence that I was a customer of the premises and that was denied

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up it was denied

7 Who is the parking company? Civil enforcement LTD

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Red Lion Car Park, Wetherby

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under.

No

There are two official bodies, the BPA and the IAS. If you are unsure,

please check HERE

If you have received any other correspondence, please mention it here i received a letter every few months or so and ignored them as I was told they couldn.t be enforced

[lolerz]

Appealing was a mistake. You've likely outed yourself as the driver to CEL and they'll naturally reject even the strongest of appeals. Then again, who hasn't made some mistakes when dealing with legal matters for the first time. CEL have already messed up on their claimform by claiming for legal representatives fees when they have no legal representative.

Do you have a copy of the PCN that you can scan both sides and get it uploaded to us?

I'd also double check any correspondence you've had from CEL to see if the last one before this (from about a month ago) was a letter of claim.

Tagging @FTMDave who is an expert in these matters

[lolerz]

Is this the place?
 

Google Maps

WWW.GOOGLE.COM

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Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

Topic Title updated for now.

[jk2054]

Sorry, PCN means the parking chagre not the claim form

[dx100uk]

had to hide your last post 

the claimform in unredacted.

also stop hitting QUOTE , just type.

also remember to NAME each upload properly as to what it is

dx

 

[jk2054]

look at DX below

Edited April 5 by jk2054
removed because DX below far more detailed

[dx100uk]

please note the corrected dates for AOS/defence filing above.

you also need to type out the FULL particulars of claim - not just part of it.

..................

pop up on the bulk court website detailed on the claimform.
[if it is not working return after the w/end or the next day if week time]
.
When you select ‘Register’, you will be taken to a screen titled ‘Sign in using Government Gateway’. 
Choose ‘Create sign in details’ to register for the first time. 
You will be asked to provide your name, email address, set a password and a memorable recovery word.

You will be emailed your Government Gateway 12-digit User ID. 
You should make a note of your memorable word, or password as these are not included in the email.<<**IMPORTANT**

 then log in to the bulk court Website
.
 select respond to a claim and select the start AOS box.
.
 then using the details required from the claimform
.
defend all
leave jurisdiction unticked
 you DO NOT file a defence at this time
[BUT you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 ]
click thru to the end
confirm and exit the website

.get a CPR 31:14 request running to the solicitors

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?486334-CPR-31.14-Request-to-use-on-receipt-of-a-PPC-(-Private-Land-Parking-Court-Claim

type your name ONLY

no need to sign anything

.you DO NOT await the return of paperwork.

you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 from the date on the claimform.

[jk2054]

interesting he is the head of legal but according to his linkden he doens't even work there...

[honeybee13]

6 minutes ago, jk2054 said:

interesting he is the head of legal but according to his linkden he doens't even work there...

Could you link us to what you're talking about please jk?

HB

[jk2054]

Their legal rep is S wilson but according to his linkden he doesn’t work for civil enforcement

 

https://uk.linkedin.com/in/scott-wilson-88ab3a20

[FTMDave]

Please confirm when you have done AOS and CPR, and then we can look into how you got this PCN and how to go about fighting it.

[dx100uk]

2 hours ago, jk2054 said:

Their legal rep is S wilson but according to his linkedin he doesn’t work for civil enforcement

https://uk.linkedin.com/in/scott-wilson-88ab3a20

so what, the definition of a legal representative is...... think about it a bit....

dx

[jk2054]

but hes not working for a law firm!

[dx100uk]

where does anything stipulate he has to be............

 

[Nick]

AOS AND CPR COMPLETED

[FTMDave]

OK, a few things.

1.  Are you sure they didn't send you a Letter of Claim a month or so before the claimform?

2.  We need to see your appeal to find out if you outed yourself as the driver.

3.  We need to see the original invoice to see if CEL abided by the legal time frames for sending their invoices out.

4.  Why did you park for nearly nine hours in the car park?

Please deal with these points.

If you've thrown paperwork away then tell us, and a SAR can be arranged.

Edited May 1 by FTMDave
Typo

[Nick]

OK, a few things.

1.  Are you sure they didn't send you a Letter of Claim a month or so before the claimform? I just threw all correspondence from them away.

2.  We need to see your appeal to find out if you outed yourself as the driver. Again I don't have a copy of an appeal, I have checked all sent emails but cannot find one

3.  We need to see the original invoice to see if CEL abided by the legal time frames for sending their invoices out.

4.  Why did you park for nearly nine hours in the car par?

I was picking up my cousin and her family as she was working as a cook there a the time.

We were heading on holiday to Scotland the following day.

I had been in the same car park many times before.

I entered the pub through the back door went to the bar, ordered a drink and a meal.

At no point did any bar staff alert me that I needed to add my registration number or did I see any signs advising me to do so.

I then took a seat outside in a small seated area so I could chat to my cousin during to wait for her to finish work.

We were joined by the management of the Pub and barstaff during my time waiting 

If you've thrown paperwork away then tell us, and a SAR can be arranged. I have

I also must have outed myself as the driver as I sent copies of receipts showing I was a customer in the bar

[FTMDave]

There is no-one on this site who hasn't made mistakes when in a legal dispute.  I've made loads.  It's inevitable if you've not been in the situation before.

However, it's important to learn the lesson and get it right next time.

It was not a good idea to ignore a Letter of Claim.  In the minds of the parking companies, if someone ignores a Letter of Claim they might ignore a claim form too and gift them an easy default victory. 

Throwing away the paperwork was a bad idea.  You've now got to defend a case without really knowing what you're being accused of.  You can be damn sure that CEL will put as many obstacles in your way as possible while you play catch up.

What would have been a good idea would have been to get on to the pub and ask them to intervene.  We have had lots of cases where the organ grinder got tickets cancelled.

Anyway, spilt milk and all that.

1.  Wait and see if CEL reply to the CPR. If not, around the time you file your defence, you can SAR them.

2.  Given your good relations with the pub, even at this late stage get on to them and ask for their help.  It can't harm you.

3.  Is the pub local to you?  You mention the rubbish signage.  It would be a good idea to go and take photos of the signage (or lack of).

[Nick]

Unfortuanately My cousin no longer works there and hasn't for a while and the pub is in Yorkshire and I'm in Warwickshire

[dx100uk]

The Red Lion Wetherby - Home

WWW.THEREDLIONWETHERBY.CO.UK

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Welcome to the Red Lion in Wetherby! LS22 6LR - We hope to see you soon.

 

[FTMDave]

dx is spot on.  The E-mail address is there: [email protected]

Explain to them what you explained to us and ask them to call CEL off.  Has to be worth a try.

[FTMDave]

The pub has rave reviews on Google Maps about the helpfulness of the landlord and the staff.  Turns out Pete is the landlord.  It has to be worth a try contacting the pub.  It's a huge pity that wasn't done in July 2022,

[Nick]

Got this via email yesterday

 

 

CEL SAR return.pdf