Bank ANPR PCN - appealed - Wrong Reg - Fountain street car park, Hull

[pcn246]

1 Date of the infringement 12/10/2023

2 Date on the NTK 12/10/2023

3 Date received 23/10/2023

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?] Y sort of, mentions it but not specifically section 4 

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? Yes

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal] Yes

Have you had a response? [Y/N?]  No

7 Who is the parking company? Bank parking limited

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Fountain street car park, Hull

 

 

Hello everyone,

as the title says I thought I had updated the reg on my autopay account to my new vehicle, but hadn't.

I received a parking notice home (as I am a student), and only just opened it, well outside 14 days 

I am now liable for £100 rather than £60.

I already sent of an appeal email in my panic,

I know it was hasty and now I regret doing so.

NTK.pdf appeal.pdf

[Nicky Boy]

PDF's now redacted properly.

I live nearby Hull, isn't this car park a "charity" one for the air ambulance?

[pcn246]

Haha

Yes it is.  Has been for the 5 years I've been at med school in the area. Though bank parking I think were a recent thing, never used to be them managing.

[Nicky Boy]

Only asking, because your "appeal" is highly likely to be rejected.

When that happens, it may be more productive to contact Yorkshire Air Ambulance, to see if they can intervene.

After all you are supporting them with a regular pre / auto payment...

[pcn246]

Just contacted Yorkshire air ambulance on the phone, they have absolutely no idea what I was talking about!

If it even still is a charity car park (which I'm beginning to question), may just be a case of donating some or all proceedings as opposed to being directly linked.

I was 99% certain my appeal would be rejected, these companies are pure evil and reading through a few threads of other companies, seems as though they are all cut from the same cloth.

Any advice on next steps?

Thanks again for the prompt reply.

[Nicky Boy]

Glad you've been reading up and found out what you're up against.

Our usual advice is to ignore everything they send, until / unless you get a letter of claim, then come back here, to discuss a "snotty letter".

However, the caveat is that they will probably chase you for months with "scary letters", adding more and more ficticious amounts of money, before they do court (if they have the gonads).

Many PPC's give up after a while, some more give up at the snotty letter stage, some still issue a claim, then give up at the witness statement stage.

85% of the victims actually taken to court, win with CAG's help. The 15% is made up of users who don't engage with us and make mistakes and, of course, "judge lottery"... Judge is either in a bad mood or misinterprets the law.

If you really feel that you can't cope with all that, there is always the option to pay the invoice and it will just go away.

We hope you're a fighter though, and will advise you every step of the way if you decide to fight it.

Your choice pcn...

[pcn246]

Screw them, im happy to fight.

The only issue I have though is:

1) how likely am I to actually win? It was a pure error on my part, I have dozens of completed payments with my old car and the one time I forget I get slapped with this. 

2)Knowing my luck I will probably be in the 15%, so how expensive can it get? right now its £100, are we talking 200? 300? 1000?? What have you guys seen and experienced?

[FTMDave]

If you lose in court it's generally about £250 to pay.

[Nicky Boy]

Just had another thought...

Try contacting HRI Estates Dept about it.

I don't rememmber what was there before, but it's likely that HRI have bought that land for future expansion.

[pcn246]

Ah, well then i will leave it up to you. Do you in your honest opinion think I am likely to win if I stick with it?

I'll see if I can contact estates not sure of a number though I cant seem to find one.

[Nicky Boy]

PM sent...

On 17/11/2023 at 11:39, pcn246 said:

Do you in your honest opinion think I am likely to win if I stick with it?

85% IF, IF, IF it ever gets there... (Better if you engage with the thread properly).

[pcn246]

85% is decent odds, ill take it!

I did call up bank park and they did say it's currently on hold, and it will be reviewed within 28 days. Maybe someone will be in a good mood who knows!

[Nicky Boy]

pcn,

28 days, Ha! Just trying to make you sweat...

There's nothing really lost by playing along for a little while. These "companies" have to jump through so many hoops, they make plenty of mistakes.

For instance, you have now "outed" yourself as the driver, so they should no longer be contacting Dad... Wait and see what happens on that one for a start.

[pcn246]

Yeah I realised how stupid that was once I starting reading the threads,

think I read one about one company quoting a  judge Ackroyd court case that said the registered keeper was the driver but the context was completely different they just looked stupid!

Don't think there was a documented resolution but still, lesson learnt to just keep quiet

They can wait, it's still my money that haven't got their talons into it yet

[dx100uk]

2 hours ago, pcn246 said:

I received a parking notice home (as I am a student), and only just opened it, well outside 14 days 

the NTK is within time.

matters not.

see if they want to play, dont contact them further until/unless you ever get a letter of claim.

dx

 

[pcn246]

Thanks,

just doing some further reading,

I'm seriously worried I've shot myself in the foot by outing myself and possibly hampered my case significantly.

Any guidance on this?

Have I messed up as badly as I think I have?

[Nicky Boy]

No, not really.

We're talking about protection under POFA 2012.

The PPC can transfer liability from the driver, who's details they don't (normally ) have, to the Keeper who's details they do have. Normally they mess that up, 'cos they need to jump through all sorts of hoops. You've just lost that layer of protection. There's plenty more to go at.

Don't sweat it, there'll be plenty of other things they'll get wrong, or they've already got wrong. Signage, following, their own code of practice, etc.

Like I said, there's nothing lost just waiting it out for now and see how things pan out.

Just don't make any moves without letting us know what's going on.

In case you haven't twigged from all your reading, the PPC's actually use "contractual" legal arguments to catch you out.

You form a contract with them by driving past and reading their signage. Sooo, their signage has to be damned perfect for a start.

Another thought... why is the vehicle registered in Dad's name?

I do hope you're not cheating on the "named driver" insurance angle...

[pcn246]

I definitely didn't read their signage lol, just became habit for me to pull and park and expect 3 quid billed couple days later. Only reason I noticed was because I thought "hang on, I haven't been billed".

I'll hopefully get a reply soon and get the ball truly rolling, I did try HRI estates and no luck with that avenue, thanks for the find regardless.

Nah im not stupid enough to cheat insurance, that's in my name only, my parents are not even named on it, (for some reason it was actually cheaper to leave them out at renewal).

My dad's the keeper because when I got my first car, the finance agreement was in his name as I was a lot younger with no income and no credit history.

My current car was gotten with a trade in of the last, but when we were transferring ownership and doing the trade in they just used his name as he was the previous owner of the trade in, I asked them to put it in my name but they didn't, and I didn't see the point in potentially devaluing my car by adding another driver on its history for the sake of it.

I think from the dealer perspective it was a lot less paperwork for them to just use my dad who was already present but I didn't really mind either way

[Nicky Boy]

Well, I think I've found the landowner on Council planning portal. See upload, (section 8).

Not sure whether to use this right now, or wait to see if Bank produce a contract with the right name on it.

If they're getting a kickback from Bank, they probably wouldn't be interested in helping...

Wait for opinion from the others.

Landowner details.pdf

[FTMDave]

This dates back to 2017.

However, contacting the landowner is often an easy & quick way to get these invoices cancelled.

Given an e-mail costs nothing, I would contact the lot in writing - Yorkshire Air Ambulance, HRI Estates Dept., this T C Harrison Group.  Be polite, explain what happened, request they get the invoice cancelled if they have the power to do so, and if they don't have the power would they kindly identify the landowner to you.