Minster Baywatch/Gladstones ANPR PCN LETTER BEFORE CLAIM - Lytham St Annes Pier FY8 2NG

[hlh49421]

Hello,

I've been reading many threads on this website and there really is some well informed people with terrific advice and guidance so i'd like to say thank you in advance for taking the time to read my post.

I received a PCN from Baywatch Minster for 'Parking fee covering visit duration was not paid in full'

To be truthful I was under the impression that these Private Parking Companies had no power whatsoever , the driver drove onto the Car Park and left it there for 35 minutes and drove off without paying a single penny.

I know these people are out to rip people off and take advantage of frightened people so the driver does not want to play ball with them ,so brazenly that's what they've been doing for about 12 months.

Only this time I received a LETTER BEFORE CLAIM from Gladstones Solicitors who estimate the claim value to be £270 altogether! £80 for the fixed solicitors costs £35 for the court fee and £155 for the parking violation!

To fill you in , made absolutely NO contact with GS or Baywatch up until this point, made no admission who was driving the vehicle at the time either

Would be grateful if the experts on this forum could guide their next move?

There would be no point sending the 'snotty letter' about overstaying the car park because that never happened

they just completely and deliberately ignored the pay meter.

Maybe it was broke, maybe the signage was too small to read they don't know. just made no attempt to comply

What are the  options.

Thanks again in advance. 

[FTMDave]

You do need to reply with a snotty letter.

The PPCs send a Letter of Claim because they have to under court regulations, but they also use it as a tactic to see if a motorist will reply. 

If you don't reply they take it that it is likely you won't reply to court papers - maybe 'cos you've moved - so they can sneak in a backdoor CCJ.

So you need to reply showing them you'd be big trouble for them if they did do court.  Don't worry about what you did or didn't do.  The point is bravado to put them off, so they go after some mug more likely to give in.

[FTMDave]

Please complete this -

 

[hlh49421]

1 Date of the infringement - MAY2023

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] YES 12 days later arrived the NTK

3 Date received Not Sure - I immediately tossed the letters into a corner upon receipt of them

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?] YES

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? YES

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal] NO

7 Who is the parking company? Baywatch Minster

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Lytham St Annes Pier FY82NG

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under. BPA

Thanks again for the swift reply FTMDave.

I'm aware that you're one of the leading experts on this forum and it's great to get your input

...and as advised earlier on a previous post I will delay the sending of the letter until the last moment

Just to clarify would you send this smug letter to both Gladstones & Baywatch Minster?

And the file type would be a .pdf?

Have I read in previous threads the Microsoft Word format your information can be decoded?

At this stage that's the last thing I need to be tripping up on

[dx100uk]

you send a royal mail LETTER

never ever ever give/use to them email.

scan up what to date you've received , bothsides to one mass PDf

read UPLOAD CAREFULLY

dx

 

 

[Nicky Boy]

Post your letter full of snot up here so we can "pick it" apart... Yeurrgghh, that came out wrong

[hlh49421]

Did you want me to scan my Baywatch Minster & Gladstones Solicitors correspondence and upload them to the thread for you to take a look at in .PDF form?

I'm not sure how to redact my personal details?

I'll cover up my personals and scan it like that and send the lot in .PDF form later for you to look at.

Would I send the Royal Mail letter to both Gladstones and Baywatch Minster dx100uk?

@Nicky Boy Haha! I was going to use one of the previously used templates that the subscribers of this forum have used in the past so you won't see anything new that you haven't seen before I shouldn't have thought but I will however let you experts take a look and you can check it for me. Thanks a lot mate 

The PPC has sent me a Letter Before Claim just to clarify and NOT a Letter of Claim so do I still need to send this 'snotty' letter yet or do I hang on until/if a letter of claim is sent?

[honeybee13]

It's the same thing.

HB

[dx100uk]

read our upload guide CAREFULLY

you can do everything online now.

use the websites listed there.

one multipage PDF only. all sides of all comms in/out to date.

react your pers details, + REG/PCN numbers 

thats all

leave everything else.

dx

 

[hlh49421]

 NTK+PAPLOC

 

NTK+PAPLOC.pdf

[FTMDave]

Thank you.

On 18/07/2023 at 13:55, hlh49421 said:

Would I send the Royal Mail letter to both Gladstones and Baywatch Minster dx100uk?

Yes, this is what we recommend.

It's because Gladstones have a lot of previous for egging on their clients to start hopeless court cases.  They don't care if they rip off the motorist or their own client.

So we like to tell the PPC direct too that they'd be in for a thrashing in court.

 

[hlh49421]

Can somebody please provide a link to these template 'snotty' letters please? I'm struggling to find the thread now?

Gladstones have given me 30 days from the Letter Before Claim to either pay their "debt" or dispute it

Does that give me 30 days to send the 'snotty' letter?

If I send the letter by 2nd class post on day 30 they won't receive it in time.

Would you recommend sending the letter a week or two before the 30 days is up?

and lastly does it matter if the letter is typed or handwritten providing it is sent by POST and no mention of an email address is disclosed?

I'll also remember to get the free certificate of posting when the letter finally leaves my hand

[dx100uk]

use our enhanced google search box

snotty letter.

you send your reply (after posting it here for checking) very near day 30 of theirs.

you need to put BACK all times and dates in your scans please.

how can we check they are compliant when you redact EVERYTHING.

only remove your name/AD and any REG/PCN/REF no's 

 

[Nicky Boy]

hlh

Might I suggest a starting point for your snotty letter?

I like the sound of a recent one at post 27 here...

 

Some artistic modifications / changes would be nice...

 

[lookinforinfo]

The Protection of Freedoms Act Schedule 4 which governs private parking has been in force since 2012. So you would have thought that the parking rogues would have got their PCNs in order after eleven years of trial and error. Not a bit of it. Minster have taken your PCN to new lengths.

Included in the Act is the request on the Notice to keeper that the keeper could pay the charge .Schedule 4 S9[2][e] 

(e)state that the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and invite the keeper—

(i)to pay the unpaid parking charge

So what does Minster do?  "You should pay the outstanding amount if you were the driver". Totally at odds with the Act since the Act is looking for the keeper to pay the charge regardless who was driving.  S

That means that the PCN does not comply with the Act and so the keeper is not liable to pay the charge. only the driver is liable. {That is why we advise not to admit the driver's name since thousands of motorists who have valid motor insurance policies are able to drive your car.]

Schedule 4 S9[2][a] states "

(2)The notice must—

(a)specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;

They have failed to specify the period of parking on the PCN as required. They have put the arrival and departure times on the photos but that is not on the PCN. And as the times include driving from the entrance to the parking place, then driving from the parking place to the exit, it cannot be described as being parking.

Schedule 4S7 [c] states "

(c)inform the driver that the parking charges relating to the specified period of parking have not been paid in full and specify the total amount of the unpaid parking charges relating to that period, as at a time which is—

(i)specified in the notice;

So the maximum that they can charge is the amount on the signage. There is no mention in the Act for additional amounts to be added.  

If you were not the driver you can tell the Court that and they should cancel the PCN. Even if you were the driver Courts do not accept the parking rogues assertion that the driver and the keeper are the same person so they have to provide some sort of proof that you were the driver which would be very difficult if not impossible.

[hlh49421]

That's great knowledge lookinforinfo. So if court papers were to arrive at my doorstep it would make sense to tell the court that I WAS NOT the driver of the vehicle on the day in question 

Edited July 26, 2023 by hlh49421

[dx100uk]

doesnt work like that.

dx

 

[Nicky Boy]

hlh,

The info from LFI will be useful for your Witness Statement... IF it ever gets that far.

Just send the snotty letter for now... but not too early!

[hlh49421]

Dear Will & John,

Re: PCN No - XXXXXXX

Thank you for your 'Letter before claim' however I have absolutely no intention of paying you or your client any of the money that you have irresponsibly dreamt up.

If you had studied the case properly you would have realised that your clients claim is unlawful and completely invalid

You can instruct your client to end this futile pursuit of money or I will look forward to beating them in court

COPIED TO MINSTER BAYWATCH LIMITED

[hlh49421]

I've got until the 5th August for them to receive my letter so i'll probably send via second class post tomorrow

Will Gladstones be aware of the PCN number by the way? Minster Baywatch have repeatedly printed the PCN number on all their correspondence but on the Gladstones letter before claim there is no mention of my PCN number?

Do I need to write my name and address on the letter too in the top left corner? Or will the PCN Number identify me?

Do I also send a letter to Baywatch Minster with 'COPIED TO GLADSTONES SOLICITORS LTD' at the foot of the letter?

[FTMDave]

Yep, invest in two 2nd class stamps and get two free Certificates of Posting.

Yes, include the PCN number.  Yes, include your name & address.

No, you just need to send the letter to Gladstones and copy to Minster Baywatch.

[hlh49421]

I've now received another letter from Gladstones acknowledging receipt of my previous 'snotty' letter but now with a new deadline in September to pay up again. I'll post a link again with all the redacted paperwork.

 

PPC-Gladstones.pdf.pdf

[dx100uk]

yours is not the next move.

get reading up too here.

dx

[hlh49421]

Sorry dx100uk, I didn't fully understand you there? Are you saying don't respond to this latest attempt by Gladstones? I only responded to the letter before claim to avoid county court action but i'm happy to keep ignoring again from now on if these letters carry no weight

[Nicky Boy]

That's right, back to ignoring.

They said they would do court, you said get stuffed, soooo... they said they're doing court... again!