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    • I'm not sure on the best option here, I'm happy to go with Tomlin, however I can afford to pay this one in full if needed and wonder whether I should be trying to get a reduced amount, perhaps in the court hallway before going in? that would require submitting a WS of some sort. What I 'like' (strong word) about TO in this instance, is that it allows me to keep my savings to hand for further accounts needing attention in the near future and I would hope gives me some control over the pcm amount.. I've read a number of TO threads now (fell to sleep at the keyboard last night ) but have a few questions please: - Do I specify the payment arrangement in a TO or the claimant? I'm thinking 20% lump upfront plus 96 months of circa 60 squid. - Who decides repayment amounts if CCJ is granted? if the judge, then do I submit I&E at any point? Given the amount of total debt across all my claims, I need to ensure anything I commit to is future proofed. I wouldn't want all my disposable income sent to this one debt, only to have another one in a month or two.
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    • Few tweaks as the run order was completely messed up and the main point of your defence (reconstituted agreement) pushed to the bottom of the statement.   I, XXXXXX, being the Defendant in this case will state as follows; I make this Witness Statement in support of my defence in this claim and further to my set aside application dated 1 November 2022. 1.The claimants witness statement confirms that it mostly relies on hearsay evidence as confirmed by the drafts in person in the opening paragraph. It is my understanding they must serve notice to any hearsay evidence pursuant to CPR 33.2(1)(B) (notice of intention to rely on hearsay evidence) and Section 2 (1) (A) of the Civil Evidence Act. 2.  I understand that the claimant is an Assignee, a buyer of defunct or bad debts, which are bought on mass portfolios at a much reduced cost to the amount claimed and which the original creditors have already wrote off as a capital loss and claimed against taxable income as confirmed in the claimants witness statement exhibit by way of the Deed of Assignment. 3. As an assignee or creditor as defined in section 189 of the CCA this applies to this new requirement on assignment of rights.  This means that when an assignee purchases debts (or otherwise acquires rights under a credit agreement) it also acquires certain obligations to the borrower including the duty to comply with CCA requirements (such as the rules on statements and notices and other post-contractual information).  The assignee becomes the creditor under the agreement. This ensures that essential consumer protections under the CCA cannot be circumvented by assigning the debt to a third party. 4.  I became aware of original Judgement following a routine credit check on or around 14th September 2020. 5. The alleged letter of claim dated 7 January 2020 was served to a previous address which I moved out of in 2018, no effort was made to ascertain my correct address.  I have attached a copy of my tenancy agreement which is marked ‘Appendix 1’ and shows I was residing at a difference address as of 11 December 2018 and was therefore not at the service address at the time the proceedings were served.  I have also attached an email from my solicitors to the Claimants solicitors dated 14 July 2022 which was sent to them requesting that they disclose the trace of evidence they utilised prior to issuing the proceedings against me.  This is marked ‘Appendix 2’. The claimants solicitors did not provide me with these documents. 6. Under The Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims 2017 a Debt Buyer must undertake all reasonable enquiries to ensure the correct address of a debtor, this can be as simple as a credit file search. The Claimant failed to carry out such basic checks. Subsequently all letters prior to and including ,The Pre action Protocol letter of claim dated 7 January 2020 and the claim form dated 14th February 2020 were all served to a previous address which I moved out of in 2018. 7. Upon the discovery of the Judgement debt, I made immediate contact with the Court and the Claimant Solicitors, putting them on notice that I was making investigations in relation to the Judgement debt as it was not familiar to me.  I asked them to provide me with a copy of the original loan agreement but this was not provided to me.   The correspondence to the Claimant Solicitor's is attached and marked ‘Appendix 3’ 8. On (insert date) I successfully made application to set a side the judgment. The claim proceeded to allocation, 9. The claimant failed to comply with the additional directions ordered by District Judge Davis on the 2 February 2024 'The Claim shall be automatically struck out at 4pm on 3 April 2024 unless the Claimant delivers to the Court and to the Defendant the following documents.' None of these documents were received by the court nor the defendant by that date. (insert date you did receive the documents) I then sent a Data Subject Access Request to Barclays but no agreement was provided. Details the timeline of communication between myself and Barclays are attached and marked ‘Appendix 4’and the copies of correspondence between myself and Barclays are attached and marked ‘Appendix 5’. Remove irrelevant 10.The claimant relies upon and has exhibited a reconstituted version of the alleged agreement. It is again denied that I have ever entered into an agreement with Barclaycard on or around 2000.  It is admitted that I did hold other credit agreements with other creditors and as such should this be a debt that was assigned to Barclaycard from another brand therefore the reconstituted agreement disclosed is invalid being pre April 2007 and not legally enforceable pursuant to HHJ Judge Waksman in Carey v HSBC 2009 EWHC3417.  Details of this are attached and marked ‘Appendix 6’. The original credit agreement must be provided along with any reconstituted version on a modified credit agreement and must contain the names and address of debtor and creditor, agreement number and cancelation clause. 11. Therefore the claimant is put to strict proof to disclose a true executed legible agreement on which its claim relies upon and not mislead the court. 12. It is denied I have ever received a default Notice pursuant to sec 87(1) CCA1974.The claimant is put to strict proof to evidence from the original creditors internal document software the trigger of said notice.  13.   As per CPR 1.4(2)(a) the court encourages parties to cooperate with each other in the conduct of proceedings in order to try and save time and costs for the parties and to also save the time and resources of the court however, despite vast attempts at mediation the claimants have been most unreasonable and have remained unwilling to mediate. 14. Until such time the claimant can comply and disclose a true executed copy of the original assigned agreement they refer to within the particulars of this claim they are not entitled while the default continues, to enforce the agreement pursuant to section 78.6 (a) of the Credit Consumer Act 1974. I believe that the facts stated in this Witness Statement are true.  I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. Signed                 ………………………………………………….. Name                  XXXX Date                     30 April 2024   Run 3 copies Court /Claimants Sol/File
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PRA/? claimform - old MBNA Virgin Card


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Okay here goes...

 

What they wrote on the Claim Form

—————————————————

 

 

1.The Claimant claims sum of XXXXX for debt and interest.

On 12/9/08 the defendant entered into an agreement with MBNA for a Credit Card under reference XXXXXXXXXXX.

 

2.On 30/4/13 the defendant defaulted on the agreement with an outstanding balance of XXXX.

 

3.On 21/6/13 the debt of XXXXX assigned to Aktiv Kapital Portfolio AS, Oslo Zug Branch, who itself assigned the debt to PRA Group (UK) on 31/12/14.

Notices of assignment were sent to the defendant in accordances with S136 Law of Property Act 1925.

 

4. AND THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS

1. The sum of XXXXX

2. Statutory interest pursuant to Section 69 of The County Courts Act 1984 at a rate of 8.00% per annum from 21/6/13 to 15/4/16 XXXXX and thereafter at a a daily rate of 3.01 until judgement or sooner payment.

—————————————————

 

My response to above to be uploaded to MCOL if all good

 

1 The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are vague and generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.

 

2. Paragraph 1 is noted. I have had financial dealings with MBNA in the past. It is denied I have any knowledge of the above Claimant or if any alleged debt was assigned to them.

 

3. Paragraph 2 is denied. I have not been served with a Default Notice pursuant to the consumer credit Act 1974.

 

4. Paragraph 3 is denied I am unaware of any legal assignment or Notice of Assignment pursuant to the Law and Property Act 1925 Section 136(1)

 

5. Paragraph 4 is denied. Section 69 interest is awarded at the discretion of the court and subject to the claimant's actions on complying with pre action protocol and cannot be added to the claim to inflate the alleged debt. Any alleged debt remains at £XXXX plus court fee and costs.

 

6. On receipt of the claim form, the Defendant sent a request under the customer credit Act 1974,by way of a section 78 for a copy of the agreement,

and on payment of the statutory fee of £1.00; the Claimant is and remains in Default of said s78 request

 

A further request made via CPR 31.14, requesting disclosure of documents on which the Claimant is basing their claim .The claimant has not complied

 

7. It is therefore not accepted with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant and the Claimant is put to strict proof to:

 

a) show how the Defendant has entered into an agreement and;

b) show how the Defendant has reached the amount claimed for and;

c) show the nature of the breach and evidence by way of a Default Notice pursuant to sec 87.1 CCA1974

d) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim

 

7. As per Civil Procedure 16.5 it is expected that the claimants prove the allegation that the money is owed

 

8. On the alternative, as the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of section 136 of the Law of Property Act and section 82A of the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

9. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.

 

Thanks all

 

Sky

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Particulars of Claim

 

1.The Claimant claims sum of 16961.01 for debt and interest.

On 12/9/08 the defendant entered into an agreement with MBNA for a Credit Card under reference XXXXXXXXXXX.

 

2.On 30/4/13 the defendant defaulted on the agreement with an outstanding balance of 13760.15.

 

3.On 21/6/13 the debt of 13760.15 assigned to Aktiv Kapital Portfolio AS, Oslo Zug Branch, who itself assigned the debt to PRA Group (UK) on 31/12/14.

Notices of assignment were sent to the defendant in accordances with S136 Law of Property Act 1925.

 

4. AND THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS

1. The sum of 13760.15

2. Statutory interest pursuant to Section 69 of The County Courts Act 1984 at a rate of 8.00% per annum from 21/6/13 to 15/4/16 3100.86 and thereafter at a a daily rate of 3.01 until judgement or sooner payment.

 

 

Defence

 

1. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.

 

2. Paragraph 1 is noted. I have had financial dealings with MBNA in the past but I do not recall any alleged balances outstanding with particularity.

 

3. Paragraph 2 is denied. I have not been served with a Default Notice pursuant to the consumer credit Act 1974.

 

4. Paragraph 3 is denied I am unaware of any legal assignment or Notice of Assignment pursuant to the Law and Property Act 1925 Section 136(1)

 

5. Paragraph 1 & 4 (2) are denied. Section 69 interest is awarded at the discretion of the court and subject to the claimant's actions on complying with pre action protocol and cannot be added to the claim to inflate an alleged debt. Any alleged debt remains at £13760.50 plus court fee and costs until a Court deems otherwise.

 

6. On receipt of the claim form, the Defendant sent a request under the customer credit Act 1974,by way of a section 78 for a copy of the agreement,

and on payment of the statutory fee of £1.00; the Claimant is and remains in Default of said s78 request

 

A further request made via CPR 31.14, requesting disclosure of documents on which the Claimant is basing their claim .The claimant has not complied

 

7. It is therefore not accepted with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant and the Claimant is put to strict proof to:

 

a) show how the Defendant has entered into an agreement and;

b) show how the Defendant has reached the amount claimed for and;

c) show the nature of the breach and evidence by way of a Default Notice pursuant to sec 87.1 CCA1974

d) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim

 

7. As per Civil Procedure 16.5 it is expected that the claimants prove the allegation that the money is owed

 

8. On the alternative, as the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of section 136 of the Law of Property Act and section 82A of the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

9. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.

 

 

Just a few alterations...see if you are agreeable.

 

Andy

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Thanks Andy for the amends, I agree.

 

So I upload that defence text only online I dont need to replicate the first Particulars?

 

This will surely halt the Claim, will they try and dig out the paperwork and try again without the claim on interest?

 

We contested a Nationwide Claim recently and they simply Discontinued it, which was great.

 

Sky

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Just submit the defence only...the particulars are brought forward for cross reference to the defence response.

We could do with some help from you.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Andyorch and any others,

we have had a letter from PRA confirming receipt of our defence

and that they have written to Court informing them they wish to proceed with claim.

 

Nothing has been entered on MCOL only our original defence is shown on the case number. Surely our defence stops the original claim and a simple letter to the court cannot force it to proceed, unless they have all documents and have sent those to back up.

 

Either way the original inflated claim cannot proceed as that is incorrect?

 

What should we do, or is this typical bluster for us to communicate?

 

Any advice would be gratefully appreciated

 

S

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they have 28 days from the filing of your defence to proceed

else its stayed until they pay to move it fwd

 

 

they say they are but ofcourse

if they will without any paperwork is very doubtful.

 

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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If they wish to proceed, the next stage is allocation to track....if and when they do ....you will receive a Directions Questionnaire (N181)...so relax until this is recieved.

We could do with some help from you.

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Okay, we have had something through from Northampton, 'A Notice of Proposed Allocation to the Fast Track'

 

It says that this is now a defended claim, obviously where we have entered a defence. It looks like this is our copy amended to the defendant, but we have an attached Defendants Questionairre we have to fill in.

 

I just need advice on what we are now filling in as we have a date to do this by. What is the change now in the Fast Track process as it says we must serve copies on all parties

 

Any advice would be gratefully appreciated

 

S

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Take a peek at the following thread SW....

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?461958-HPH2-Cohen-Claimform-Barclaycard-%91debt%92/page2

 

But obviously you cant request it be SCT in your case as it is Fast Track.

We could do with some help from you.

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Sorry Andy, I don't understand what I am looking for in that thread :???:

 

On our Directions questionnaire Fast Track and Multi Track it says to be completed by and Defendant has been ringed, I can see at the bottom it is an N181.

 

Is this for us to agree the next stage, as we can disagree that this is not the right track, completing box D2 on the form.

 

It says we must complete the questionnaire, file at the Court office and serve other copies to all other parties. and b) attempt to agree directions with all other parties and c) file proposed directions (whether or not agreed) with the Directions Questionnaire.

 

Our main worry is that at the top of the Notice, it says "If you do not comply with the notice the court will make such order as appears to be appropriate. This could include striking out the claim or entering judgement"

 

Thanks

 

SW

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std n181 ringed as your copy

yes fast track..

 

 

so follow that linked thread and fill it out

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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DX thanks for responding.

 

 

I think I understand now the ABC sections in the other thread obviously link to the sections in my N181

 

But the A section on settlement,

do I select YES to settle even though I am contesting the whole case that they are inflating the amount

and have not produced documentation.

Would that not be construed that we agree with the claim?

 

There is an option for NO with a box to add reason why, do I put that across there.

 

Sorry for the stupid questions but we really have one chance on this, don't want to muck it up

 

Thanks

 

SW

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post 22 in that thread

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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You should always agree to settlement (mediation) irrespective..all parties are expected to participate.......unless of course the claim is statute barred.

We could do with some help from you.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Okay guys, an update...

 

Sent off two copies of N181 Directions

one to The Court

and a copy to claimant, by the cut off date as requested.

 

 

We put in our 'other information' box about the fact that we sent CPR 31.14 requests to both MBNA and Aktiv Kapital (pre PRA) and nothing back.

 

 

We have just recieved in post from PRA, copy of agreement, default letter and assignment plus statements of card.

 

I presume our only option is to come to an arrangement with them,

they have provided an income and expenditure form.

This is my wife's card, am I obligated to put down my earnings?

 

We feel we could afford £20 a month as my wife is only working part time at a school, £300 a month take home.

 

Will they try and still push through Court if we fill in expenditure details and offer £20 a month?,

also try to obtain a Charging Order.

 

 

If they do they can only get a restriction on her half, so pretty useless to them.

 

 

Our main priority is to pay mortgage and bring our young son up.

 

This debt was a result of a huge credit line Virgin gave her when we had a business,

the business collapsed due to a number of debtors in 2011,

we have been struggling ever since.

 

How much do you think PRA have paid for this debt?, could we consider a Full & Final from a relative to stop the Court?

 

Wife is deeply depressed about all this, really is petrified to have to go to Court.

 

Andy, DX, anyone have any further help on this, it would be gratefully appreciated.

 

Thanks

 

SW

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woe slow down..!!

 

 

who said you've got pay anyone anything?

 

 

can you scan up theca return please

do it ALL to JPG's

redact each page

 

 

pop each redacted picture into a multipage word doc

one picture to a page

then

file

save as

.pdf

and attach it here

follow the upload guide

 

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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1st page is on the agreement

But there should be more

Up to 22 points I think?

 

Sadly the agreement is OK

As it was online virgin sign up?

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

I presume our only option is to come to an arrangement with them, they have provided an income and expenditure form.

This is my wife's card, am I obligated to put down my earnings?

 

We feel we could afford £20 a month as my wife is only working part time at a school, £300 a month take home.

 

Will they try and still push through Court if we fill in expenditure details and offer £20 a month?,

also try to obtain a Charging Order.

 

If they do they can only get a restriction on her half, so pretty useless to them.

 

 

DX, Andy,

I need additional help on this please.

 

If agreement is binding then we need to come to an arrangement. As mentioned above how can we move forward to the above?

 

SW

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Its a sole debt so no, you dont have to provide any other income details on an I&E, other than your other half's

 

AFAIK, only a Form K restriction can be placed on a jointly owned property, this means that you, as the non debtor, can still sell the house if you wanted and the creditor with the Form K restriction will be notified, after any sale, not before, so they cant enforce a Form K, as such.

 

What it does is informs them that your other half may now have capital to pay the debt owed.

 

Having said all of that, they would only normally be granted a CO if your OH had not maintained any payments under a court order and they then need to go back to court for the CO

 

Google Form K restrictions for more info

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Thanks Martin,

 

We will proceed with a £20 a month figure offer.

 

I do have a relative who would be prepared to offer a F&F of £2000 in four cheques, is that worth offering, I would imaging PRA would have bought this for less.

 

SW

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Have you gone through the statements to see if any of what they are claiming is default charges, late fees etc?

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