help!! Finance U Ltd Car Repossessions by Bill of sales

[HKtoWales]

Hi,

I have had no end of nonsense with Finance U in the last couple of weeks.

I was in between jobs from end of Jan until end of March.

I contacted all my creditors in writing, explained the situation, and made goodwill payments to them before arranging a revised repayment for when I was earning again.

EVERYONE replied positively except Finance U who didnt respond at all.

They came and took one of our cars last week (we have two but it was not in the area)

I went into the Royal Courts of Justice last week and found out that the Bill of sale was not registered in time, nor signed by someone independent of Finance U.

I have called Humphries in excess of 20 times. Left countless messages and sent faxes and emails.

Absolutely nothing in return.

 

Any advice - I still have the other car.

[emanevs]

upload your documents without the personal stuff.

 

he will probably come round for the car, stick it in your garage perhaps....

 

r you in any IVA/BR?

[HKtoWales]

Any chance someone who is familiar with the practices of this lot can send me a PM - a few questions to ask.

[AndyOrch]

Advice is not given by PM HK ...start your own thread on the matter.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[HKtoWales]

OK - I will try(!) to keep it brief.

 

1. Had two vehicles with CPG and Finance U Ltd. Lost my job in February and contacted them to arrange a temporary repayment schedule for 1 month whilst in between jobs. I did this with all my creditors and all responded in some guise except for you know who.

2. Two Bills of Sale are in place for the vehicles - in two separate names.

3. CPG henchmen arrived at my house at 7am several weeks ago, and took one of the vehicles, adopting very unsavoury tactics to intimidate my wife into handing over the keys. I was away from home, and had the other vehicle.

4. Went to Royal Courts of Justice - both Bills of Sale appears invalid since they are not attested by an individual independent of both parties.

5. Have been in dialogue with Financial Ombudsman in preparing written communication with CPG and Mr H. Have sent 19 letters by recorded delivery with proposals for resolution. All have been ignored.

6. Remaining vehicle is locked in a garage unless in use behind a locked gate.

7. Final proposal with 2 week response deadline was sent in early June. Outlined that if no response was made that it would be viewed as acceptance of the proposal from CPG. No response obviously. Proposal stated that CPG keep the repossessed car and all finance is cleared, and that I keep the second car and all finance is cleared.

8. CPG made an HPI enquiry on my company car this week, in view to seizing it, if it was free of finance - it is a lease car so was not. Mr H does not think this is an inappropriate (or illegal) means of business.

9. Very aggressive voice mail left by Mr H yesterday, appears completely undetered by the involvement of the FO, Trading Standards and the police. Has said he will take the other vehicle as soon as he sees it.

 

I am

(a) Fed up of this.

(b) Bored of this.

© In need of a few ideas to close this out.

[dx100uk]

own thread created here

 

dx

[dx100uk]

are you saying the BOS is faulty?

 

dx

[HKtoWales]

Thanks dx

[HKtoWales]

Yes - both BOS is invalid as it is not attested by a witness not party to the bill

[dx100uk]

then they have acted unlawfully.

 

time to get the car back and all you payments.

 

have a look in the bill of sale forum here

 

and

[postggj]

Just jumping in on this

 

"There is nothing in the act that prevents an agent of the grantee being an attesting witness [Pearce vs Brookes 1895], 2 Q. B. 451)."

[HKtoWales]

Postggj - Yes I agree with you on that point. However, the person who signed the BOS' is not an agent of the grantee, they are a director.

 

dx100uk - I would love to be able to do this. However, they simply do not engage with me or the Financial Ombudsman and just trawl on regardless. Is there a process I can instigate to force their hand in terms of the car and the payments?

[postggj]

Do you have the signed affidavit that is suppose to accompany the bill of Sale

 

That is the witness affidavit

[HKtoWales]

Unless I am overseeing this, I dont think so.

[postggj]

A copy will be held in the high court

 

Ask for a copy of the BOS and affidavit of service

[postggj]

The Bill of Sales Act 1878 and the Bill of Sales (Amended) Act 1882 are the relevant Acts to protect consumers and advise what a lender must do in order to rely on the Acts for protection - In most instances it is what the Lender does not do, or actions that the lender takes against you that the Law shows that they cannot do; that assists consumers overcome bad practices by some lenders and can work to protect consumers from unlawful possession of your motor vehicle.

 

GUIDANCE:

 

step 1: request the High Court Stamp Reference No. from the lender if you do not already know it.

 

step 2: write off to the High Court of Justice as shown below:

 

 

 

Your Name

Your Address

Post Code

 

Date

enforcement officer

Royal Court of Justice

Room E17

The Strand

London

WC2A 2LL

 

Dear Sir or Madam

 

Re: Bill of Sale - Ref No: XXXXXXX

 

With reference to the above, I write to request a true copy of the registered Bill of Sale; details of which are below:

 

Debtors Name & Address:

 

(Input your name and address)

 

Lenders Name & Address:

 

(Input Lenders name and address)

 

Bill of Sale Ref No:

 

(Input the known reference number of the Bill of Sale - if you don't have it you will have to send a payment in the sum of £40 with this letter - if you know it, then you only have to send a payment of £5.00)

 

It is common knowledge that a Bill of Sale can be lodged with you and be done so as an 'out of time' registration; with this in mind, can you confirm whether the said Bill of Sale in this matter has been registered out of time; and if it has been, would you kindly advise if there has been any application made to rectify the registration.

 

I look forward to your early reply and enclose the sum of £xx.00 as necessary.

 

Yours sincerely

 

(sign your letter)

 

XXXXXXXX

 

NB: Post it recorded delivery and keep copy of your letter and copy of recorded delivery slip on file.

 

Step 3. Once you get the reply - if they confirm it is registered out of time and can confirm that no application to rectify has been made - then proceed to step 4.

 

Step 4. Check the Bill of Sale Acts of 1878 & 1882 - you will be looking for any sections within your copy of the Bill of Sale that does not comply with these Acts - note any variances or anything that does not comply. (the more you can find - the more chance you have of securing an order to throw it out)

 

Step 5. get in touch with a solicitor and instruct them to file for a declaration that the Bill of Sale is void/uneforceable.

 

The effect of these measures is that once a court declares the Bill of Sale void - then the 'security is void' - this means they cannot seize the vehicle.

 

Interestingly - it could also mean that your credit agreement is also unenforceable - this will depend on the terms and conditions within it and those found in your Bill of Sale.

 

You will only have to submit a payment in the sum of £5.00 (as at Nov 2010). If you cannot supply all of the detail above; you may have to pay as much as £40.00.

 

If you have a copy of you Bill of Sale on record; then the reference number will be shown on there - it will not be the same number as the lenders loan reference number - it may look something like: '0067910'

 

thanks to applecart

[HKtoWales]

Thanks - this is really helpful.

Any practical advice for now, as I am sure they will make an attempt to get car 2 - regardless of the legalities.

[postggj]

That is down to you my friend, keep it locked in a garage would be my advice

[HKtoWales]

Yes, doing that right now. Also it is in a locked garage at the end of a drive with a locked 5 bar gate at the end.

Any experience of people like this breaking into this also, despite it being illegal?

[postggj]

If they do break in then it will be unlawful recession of contract

 

ALL AGREEMENTS AND BOS WILL BE VOID

 

ALL PAYMENTS MADE RETURNED AND YOU WILL ALSO RECEIVE THE CAR BACK FOR FREE

[HKtoWales]

Really? So if they break the lock on the gate or break into the garage to remove the vehicle - all bets are off?

[postggj]

yes

 

The BOS does not give them any right under common law to enter your property and remover articles without a return of goods order by the court

 

Even a certificated bailiff cant do that if the garage is not detached from the house, i believe even if the garage is separate, if kept locked, they cant break inn, but that part needs to be confirmed

 

A vehicle on the public highway is a different matter

[citizenB]

nowayjose, I have sent you a private message.