Big Fight With NAT WEST ***WON***

[marieclaire]

thankyou

[Deller]

Quick update, I've gone ahead with my proposed action and faxed through a copy of my updated particulars to Cobbetts along with a covering letter and another copy of my schedule, I have asked for all of this to be attached to my claim and explained that I was unable to provide these details originally due to restrictions of space when filing my claim online. Particulrs sent as follows:-

 

CLAIM BETWEEN

 

deller1, and

 

NATIONAL WESTMINSTER BANK plc

 

CLAIM NUMBER xxxxxxxx

 

PARTICULARS OF CLAIM

 

 

1. The Claimant has an account, a/c no xxxxxxxx, s/c xx-xx-xx, with the Defendant which was opened around 1991

 

2. During the period in which the Account has been operating the Defendant debited numerous charges to the Account in respect of purported breaches of contract on the part of the Claimant and also charged interest on the charges once applied. The Claimant understands that the Defendant contends that the charges were debited in accordance with the terms of the contract between itself and the Claimant.

 

3. A list of the charges applied is attached to these particulars of claim.

 

4. The Claimant contends that:

 

a) The charges debited to the Account are punitive in nature; are not a genuine pre-estimate of cost incurred by the Defendant; exceed any alleged actual loss to the Defendant in respect of any breaches of contract on the part of the Claimant; and are not intended to represent or related to any alleged actual loss, but instead unduly enrich the Defendant which exercises the contractual term in respect of such charges with a view to profit.

 

b) The contractual provision that permits the Defendant to levy such charges is unenforceable by virtue of the Unfair Contract Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations (1999), the Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977 and the common law.

 

5. Accordingly the Claimant claims:

 

a) the return of the amounts debited in respect of charges and interest between 18th September 2000 and 1st October 2006 for the sum of £xxxx;

b) Court costs;

 

c) Interest pursuant to section 69 County Courts Act 1984 at 8% in the sum of £xxx or at such rate and for such periods as the court deems just.

Alternatively, if the charges are a fee for a service, then they must be reasonable under S.15 of the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982.

I believe that the contents of these particulars of claim are true

 

 

Signed:

 

 

Date: 31/10/06

 

 

I printed a report to confirm the fax had gone through, then after waiting 5 minutes phoned Cobbetts and received confirmation that the documents had been received.

 

With a bit of luck this may of sorted out my problem.

Here's hoping!!! :grin: :grin:

[Guest screwloose]

Well you certainly seem to be going through the mill at the mo!!

 

I'll have to make sure I pay extra attention when I get to this stage, don't think I could be dealing with all that stress.

 

 

You'll get through it, I've got everything crossed for you. ;-) ;-)

[Deller]

Tell me about it screwloose, my advice to everyone is to make sure your very thorough, it does'nt pay to cut any corners!!

[Deller]

I notice you've worked out how to get the pictures in screwloose. Very pretty!!!

[Deller]

Well, time is running out for Cobbetts to get their defence in and their 28 days are nearlly up. Saturday 4th is judgement day. I expect they'll get their defence in right at the last moment, that seems to be the norm for them.

[GRAZEL]

Keep us posted mate, haven't acknowledged my claim of 27th October yet

[Shelty]

Della, I got my defence on the last day, and the AQ from the court, along with moving to a court near me arrived two days later. Good luck, I know how frustrating it is !!

[Deller]

Tell me about it, very frustrating , but having read through loads of other threads it seems to be the same for everyone.

 

Seems they're keeping hold of the money for as long as they can, more interest for them I suppose, but then again, more for us too!!

[alanfromderby]

more interest for them I suppose,

 

Unfortunately it is more sinister than that....I just wonder how many people drop out because of their tactics.

[baldrick]

Hi Deller,

I've got an offer today from Cobbetts for £2000 which I'll refuse. This has come one day after their AQ, 2 days after my AQ due date. They're following a pattern, next thing is getting a court date, then , hopefully final settlement, yes its stages/obstacles, but hang in and win

[Deller]

Been away for a couple of days and got back to find Cobbetts defence on my doormat, right on their last day to get defence in. This is the stage where I'm a little unsure of what happens or what I should do, especially after the recent problems with the particulars of my claim.

 

Their defence reads as follows:

 

1. This defence is filed and served without prejudice to the defendant's case that the Particulars of Claim do not disclose reasonable grounds for bringing a claim against the Claimant to recover the bank charges (and interest thereon) referred to in the Particulars of Claim or any other sum(s). In the event that the Claimant does not properly particularise his claim then the Defendant will apply to strike out the claim and/or for summary judgement in respect of the same.

 

2. On allocation the Defendant invites the Court to direct that there be a case management conference in order for the Court to consider the making of appropriate orders to give the Claimant the opportunity to properly particularise his claim.

 

3. No admissions are made as to what charges have been debited to the Claimant's bank account.

 

4. The Defendant is embarrassed by the lack of particularity pleaded in the Particulars of Claim to the extent that the Particulars of Claim fail to disclose reasonable grounds for bringing a claim against the Defendant. The Claimant is required to identify the common law, statutes and consumer regulations that he alleges are unlawful. Until such time as these statutes/regulations and the provisions therin are identified the Defendant cannot plead to the allegation within the Particulars. The Defendant therefore reserves its right to plead further to the allegation once (and if) the Claimant further particularises his claim.

 

5. The Claimant is time-barred from bringing a claim of unauthrised bank charges prior to 2 October 2000 by the provisions of section 5 of the Limitation Act 1980.

 

6. Save as hereinbefore appears the Defendant joins issue with the Claimant on his claim(s) and denies that it is liable to the Claimant as alleged or at all.

 

 

So what happens now, I'm a little confused, do I wait or should I be responding in some way??

 

 

PLEASE HELP!!!!

[knightreplica]

from what i have read deller this seems to be the usual responce, and that all the particulars have been given at time of filing the claim, and on the seperate occassions that u have sent a complete break down to natwest... there are a few threads here one of which i think is the partcpr18 one which deals with this... it has a letter u can send back stating that the amounts and individual transactions have all been supplied to their client and that u see this as a stalling and intimadatry tatic... and that just for the sake of their records yopu enclose the account name, number and a breakdown. this is the only information u need to supply to them, they already know from your particulars what laws your using for the claim itself

[Deller]

My worry though is what my original particulars of claim were (as stated in post #67 of this thread). I have since sent an updated version to Cobbetts but havn't amended my particulars through the court. Not sure whether this would affect my case as the particulars Cobbetts are referring to will be those stated on my original claim. :confused:

[alanfromderby]

I think it is vital that you provide the revised particulars to the court.

[Michael Browne]

I have since sent an updated version to Cobbetts but havn't amended my particulars through the court.

 

This won't change anything. You can send Cobbetts the greatest POC's ever, all they have to do is throw them in the bin.

 

The ones that matter are the ones you file with your claim and, by your own admission, these are pretty inadequate.

 

Follow Alan's advice.

[gizmo111]

I had exactly the same defence from them on Friday for a 2nd claim - not including the limitation act - here http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/natwest-bank/41199-nat-west-2nd-claim.html

I have letter ready to reply to Cobbetts and will send a copy to court - feel free to use and amend if you wish.

[knightreplica]

corbetts prob arnt even reading them, they get the claim and send out the first letter. hence the reson why everyone are getting letters with the same half a sentence missing... dont worry fella ul be ok,,, if your that worried send the court a letter explaining and refering to the fact u sent corbetts a copy and the date

[Deller]

Having read through a lot of other threads the defence I've received does seem to pretty much the same as a lot of other peoples, but I'm still worried because of my POC mistake. Should I be responding to Cobbetts along the lines of the letter gizmo111 used, or should I send a copy of my updated Poc (as in post #77) to the Court and ask them to attach to my claim, or do I need to make official amendmant and if so not sure how to go about this in the correct manner. Or maybe I should do nothing, wait, and see what their (Cobbetts) next move is. I'm finding this all very confusing!!! :confused:

[gizmo111]

Send a letter to Cobbetts pointing out that you have a mended POC and sent schedules.

Send all amendments to Court with a copy of the above letter.

Unless anyone knows different?

[gizmo111]

Dellar - I see you are in Bristol as well - the court are in chaos so if you can take it to them - they have lost quite a bit of stuff that I have sent to them and papers I physically took in to them.

[Deller]

Thanks for the advice gizmo, I have just checked on MCOL and my case states:- The defendant disputes the whole amount you have claimed. Your claim cannot proceed online and will be transferred to the appropriate court for continuation. You will receive confirmation to where the claim has been transfered to shortly.

 

Should I prehaps wait for this to happen before I take any further action, and how long does it take for a claim to be transfered?

[gizmo111]

It would automatically get transferred to your nearest court which is Bristol CC - ring them and see if it has been transferred - no is 9106700

[alanfromderby]

Thanks for the advice gizmo, I have just checked on MCOL and my case states:- The defendant disputes the whole amount you have claimed. Your claim cannot proceed online and will be transferred to the appropriate court for continuation. You will receive confirmation to where the claim has been transfered to shortly.

 

Should I prehaps wait for this to happen before I take any further action, and how long does it take for a claim to be transfered?

 

I would say that you would be best to now wait a couple of weeks then give your local county court a ring to see if the file has arrived. As soon as it has then I would send an exact copy of what you sent to the Defendant, along with a covering letter as you have suggested stating that you have already sent a copy to the Defendant.

 

If the court want you to make an official request - or they are unhappy in any way, you can be sure that they will let you know what they want you to do - however, I would expect that they will just accept the revised POC's without any bother.

 

until you are contacted by the court. Until the case file is actually

[Deller]

I've telephoned the Bristol County Court to see if my claim had been transfered there. I was told that case was in the process of being transfered as of today. I explained that I had received Cobbetts defence and that it stated my Particulars of Claim were inadequate. When I asked if these needed to be amended the lady said that as soon as the file arrived it would be referred to the judge and that he would suggest what needed to be done next.

 

So I guess its just a case of sitting and waiting now like Alan has stated.

 

Will probably phone the court again in a few days to see if my file has arrived and when I know its there I can then forward the additional documents which I've already sent to Cobbetts, hopefully they will just accept these!!