Ingeus

[Mr.P]

[...]since there wasn't any start of finish time on the MAN for this supervised jobsearch does that mean I can attend the seetec office do five minutes jobsearch print out 3 or 4 jobs and then leave the premises and claim my £6.30 travel fare ?

 

Get a signed & dated note to say that you attended on headed paper or a comps slip. If no start or finish time is stipulated, turn up at your convenience and leave when you want. I'd strongly recommend getting travel expenses refunded on the way in then you don't get held to ransom.

[jasta11]

Thanks for the reply Chester6 since there wasn't any start of finish time on the MAN for this supervised jobsearch does that mean I can attend the seetec office do five minutes jobsearch print out 3 or 4 jobs and then leave the premises and claim my £6.30 travel fair?

 

It's an appointment (and a mandatory one too), so there should always be a time stated to attend. Plus jobsearches usually involve booking computers so a time slot is even more desirable.The DWP WP Guidance states;

 

'The following steps must be taken on every occasion you want to mandate a participant to do something:

 

Ensure that the activity is reasonable in the participant’s circumstances

Ensure that the participant is aware of the sanctions consequences of failing to participate in a mandated activity

Notify the participant in writing on a Mandatory Activity Notification (MAN):

The specific action that they are required to undertake

When or by when they must undertake it'

They haven't given you an accurate indication of when you should undertake it if they've only put the date but not the time. Might pay you to go there early so that they can't try and claim you were 'late' if you turned up in the afternoon - I wouldn't put it past them. Personally I'd report them to the DWP for failing to state a time - you're not psychic so you need to know when to turn up. The few jobsearch appointments I had while at Ingeus always had both a date and time stated.

[RebeccaPidgeon]

I forgot to mention earlier that I was in my local Ingeus office today. I overheard two advisors talking to each other. One was bragging how they were close to achieving "gold" standard for the month. Sounded like they had nearly met the top target needed for returning clients to work, picking up a nice bonus along the way. The other advisor spoke of numerous warehouse vacancies becoming available and that they had sent all her best available clients already, and was only left with the "dregs", of whom they had no intention sending forward for interview.

 

Send your best clients for interviews so you can hit targets and get your bonus. "Park" those who need the most support and then brand them as "dregs" because you don't have the skills to work with such clients. Way to go Ingeus.

Unfortunately, Welfare To Work Clerks do not have Clients - and if some unsuspecting Job Seeker on the Work Programme is provided with an interview as a direct consequence of any effort on the part of any Welfare To Work Clerk this could be for any number of reasons. For example, through the Flexible New Deal A4E were found to guilty of arranging "placements" within a Business Unit set up by A4E, and then claiming the financial prize - one of the many instances of fraud.

 

In respect to the Work Programme - Welfare To Work Clerks do not have Clients, the Client is established by the Work Programme Contract between Job Centre Plus and the W2W Organisation. The candidate is only required to attend the Work Programme insofar as the Job Seekers Agreement remains in place. If a job seeker is offered an interview for a Warehouse Job, this has nothing whatsoever to do with whether the candidate is perceived to be "Best" or otherwise.

[Dark 1]

Hey guys I eventually finished the work program this September just in time for me to come off esa and onto jsa

I am now on post work programme support at the jobcentre

and I have to say im not handling all this too well

i have to see my advisor on a weekly basis join universal job match they expect me to do 40 hrs job search a week

and they want evidence of all this

i asked for my exit report from the work program but they say they don't have it

this is so hard to deal with since i have been on esa the last 2 years with a broken leg and then to suddenly be expected to complete all these tasks is pretty heavy

i have all ready missed one appointment which resulted in my claim being closed so i had to rapid reclaim and it has left me without money for over 3 weeks

today i had to go to this post work program support interview and i haven't even had a penny of the job centre in 3 week so i had to walk or lose my money again

So because i have been on the work program 2 years even though i had a broken leg and was on esa there treating me as if i was on the work program on jsa and just couldn't be bothered looking for a job

yeah i was on the work program 2 years but i only set foot in the office about 5 time total i gained absolutely nothing from them not even a cv and because of this i have to do a more intense job search than any new claimer

I don't think i will be able to keep up with all the stuff they want me to do so a sanction is inevitable for me at some point

well i have had 2 years on the sick with a broken leg so soon as the heat gets to much im going to my doctors for a sick note for stress and depression its not what i want but

i just feel victimised at present

stuck in the house for 2 years then expected to jump through all these hoops is taking a fair toll on my mental health add the fact they want me to attend appointments when i have not even received my jsa and am pennyless

sorry for the rant im just very depressed at the moment

[jasta11]

Sounds like you've had the same experience of the work programme as the rest of us had - totally useless. I still can't understand how jobcentres can ask some claimants to do very little while others they come down really heavy on.

 

Regarding your exit report, you should have had a copy fron the work provider. It's not an option for them, they have to do it. here's an extract from the guidance rules;

 

'Copy of Exit Report for Participant

There is one small policy change in respect of giving the participant a copy of their Exit Report. Current guidance states all participants must receive a copy of the report but some of you pointed out this would mean potentially a lot of sensitive information going out by post.

To minimise the risk of their Exit Report not being received or received at the wrong address. Participants should be provided with a copy of the Exit Report where you are in face to face contact with the participant or let participants know by post that they are entitled to a copy of the Exit Report on request and make arrangements for the report to be collected or posted. Before posting ensure the participant is aware of the risks of sending personal information via post.'

 

I'd also be asking why the jobcentre say they haven't got a copy either; this report is supposed to cover your two years on the programme and give them information about you, where you need help, etc so they would need it before deciding what steps you now need to take - seems like they've just gone ahead without it, which is wrong.

 

Contact the work program people again, as you're entitled to have a copy of your exit report. It probably won't say much (they never do) but you still want to see it.

[Charlotte_Henderson]

Sounds like you've had the same experience of the work programme as the rest of us had - totally useless. I still can't understand how jobcentres can ask some claimants to do very little while others they come down really heavy on.

 

 

Dunno about the JC, but ingeus seems to come down heavier on the younger ones than us older ones.

 

At our ingeus they seem to put pressure on the yonger ones. why? cos they see more chance of a bonus out of them sad but true...

 

Which reminds me i have an ingeus appointment this afternoon

[RebeccaPidgeon]

Dunno about the JC, but ingeus seems to come down heavier on the younger ones than us older ones.

 

At our ingeus they seem to put pressure on the yonger ones. why? cos they see more chance of a bonus out of them sad but true...

 

Which reminds me i have an ingeus appointment this afternoon

In general terms, if the Welfare To Work Clerk is quite inexperienced (if they were remotely experienced and qualified, they would be working in the Real World), they more than likely feel that they can badger younger candidates than candidates who are older, more mature, more experienced and more qualified than they are - and are less likely to deal with any confrontation that they can't win.

[joeski]

i have to constantly keep remind my ingeus advisor to do things such print stuff off before the appoitment is over :/

[Charlotte_Henderson]

In general terms, if the Welfare To Work Clerk is quite inexperienced (if they were remotely experienced and qualified, they would be working in the Real World), they more than likely feel that they can badger younger candidates than candidates who are older, more mature, more experienced and more qualified than they are - and are less likely to deal with any confrontation that they can't win.

 

Its because they know employers want young staff who they can mould to what they want....at the end of the day its all about bonuses at ingeus!

[Charlotte_Henderson]

I forgot to mention earlier that I was in my local Ingeus office today. I overheard two advisors talking to each other. One was bragging how they were close to achieving "gold" standard for the month. Sounded like they had nearly met the top target needed for returning clients to work, picking up a nice bonus along the way. The other advisor spoke of numerous warehouse vacancies becoming available and that they had sent all her best available clients already, and was only left with the "dregs", of whom they had no intention sending forward for interview.

 

Send your best clients for interviews so you can hit targets and get your bonus. "Park" those who need the most support and then brand them as "dregs" because you don't have the skills to work with such clients. Way to go Ingeus.

 

I hear this all the time at my ingeus, yesterday when i went my advisor and another one. where discussing what they were going to spend their monthly bonus on...

 

As both had done really well this month......then one decided it was enough to do her entire xmas shopping in one go, she then turned to me and said, oh dont you just love christmas! to my reply no i bloody dont seeing as i cant afford it!!!

[Chester6]

Ingeus is motivated by profit so they'll do whatever they must to make money including targeting those they think are the most likely to be employed

[RebeccaPidgeon]

Its because they know employers want young staff who they can mould to what they want....at the end of the day its all about bonuses at ingeus!

Although Welfare To Work Clerks do not have the capacity to know what employers want.... you make a perceptive point about employers obsessed with recruiting ideal staff.

[Mr.P]

oh dont you just love christmas! to my reply no i bloody dont seeing as i cant afford it!!!

 

In the words of Delia Smith - Take it firmly by the legs then stuff it.

 

I find Christmas to be a tiresome ritual full of seasonal disappointment and false hope... But at least I will have a little bit of work in December.

[joeski]

W2W such as Ingeus makes many feel paranoid and like they are out to get you it seems

It's understandable to feel like that considering they are trying to trip people up and try to sanction regardless of how wrong the sanction is

Plus each scheme is worst then the one before in general. I have only found my local seetec to be worse though people wise (only 3 at Ingeus are irredeemably bad), one called me a liar cos he was too lazy to talk to his colleague, one pretended to be a nice guy until he never informed I was with a new adviser and then he made it obvious talking to me was the last thing he wanted and the one who didn't condemn homophobia at a job interview from seetec period. Interview prep can't always help when the interviewer is a bad rude one

 

this is exactly how i feel, i just want to get a job asap so i don't have to deal with the likes of ingeus anymore.

[Chester6]

this is exactly how i feel, i just want to get a job asap so i don't have to deal with the likes of ingeus anymore.

 

Same here

I keep applying and looking but I keep having to do stupid courses and waste of time forced labour which is taking time away and a pointless distraction mostly

[Charlotte_Henderson]

Although Welfare To Work Clerks do not have the capacity to know what employers want.... you make a perceptive point about employers obsessed with recruiting ideal staff.

 

I have kept in contact with all 10 of the people i was on a recent WP course i was on, 4 are under 24 the others are my age or above....we all see the same advisor at Ingeus and all of are looking for retail work...

 

Now the younger ones are regularly put forward for interviews, bearing in mind 4 of them have never worked in a shop before.

so it cant be cos of experience they are choosen, none of us older ones ever get put forward for interviews...and yes we've asked and they fob us off with excuses time and time again.....we all know its because they can see a big fat bonus from the younger ones!

Edited October 3, 2013 by Charlotte_Henderson

[Mr.P]

Under 21, and the employer can get away with paying £5.03 per hour. For anyone older, the minimum wage is £6.31. Younger candidates are more likely to tolerate poor working conditions due to inexperience of regulation and what is acceptable. Retailers that target the younger market will want staff that can "connect with customers" and are in tune with the current trends...

 

Youths on the shop floor is one reason I take my complaints out with the manager - Currently berating one store over the display of axes & hammers that are likely to cause injury if a small child runs around. Also causing trouble in a poundland store for leaving piles of plastic & packaging lying around after stacking shelves... Guess I won't ever get offered jobs in those stores

[Charlotte_Henderson]

Under 21, and the employer can get away with paying £5.03 per hour. For anyone older, the minimum wage is £6.31. Younger candidates are more likely to tolerate poor working conditions due to inexperience of regulation and what is acceptable.

 

Which of course is the correct answer

[Charlotte_Henderson]

i just want to get a job asap so i don't have to deal with the likes of ingeus anymore.

 

We all want the same thing, as ingeus are useless!

 

Loving the i hate ingeus page someone has set up on Facebook

[RebeccaPidgeon]

I have kept in contact with all 10 of the people i was on a recent WP course i was on, 4 are under 24 the others are my age or above....we all see the same advisor at Ingeus and all of are looking for retail work...

 

Now the younger ones are regularly put forward for interviews, bearing in mind 4 of them have never worked in a shop before.

so it cant be cos of experience they are choosen, none of us older ones ever get put forward for interviews...and yes we've asked and they fob us off with excuses time and time again.....we all know its because they can see a big fat bonus from the younger ones!

Sadly, Welfare To Work Clerks do not have the capacity to know what employers want.... but you still make a perceptive point. I suspect that if the W2W Clerk that you are referring to had the competence to pick up the telephone to speak to an employer, they would be not employed as a W2W Clerk.

 

For the case that you mentioned, it is possible that the Employer Services Team could have seen a vacancy advert from a local retailer (lets assume a Fashion Outlet, targeted towards the younger demographic), within which they specify the need for Zero Hour Staff filled by inexperienced school leavers (or under 25s) - although age discrimination in employment legislation would make such an advert illegal, I am not sure whether any candidate older than 25 would feel particularly welcome by such an employer - even if a faux interview was arranged.

 

However, from what you say, there may be a case for you to report Ingeus for promoting Age Discrimination in Employment

http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/wales/work_w/work_discrimination_e/age_discrimination_at_work.htm

[JustInterested]

Also causing trouble in a poundland store for leaving piles of plastic & packaging lying around after stacking shelves...

 

The correct procedure Mr P is to entangle oneself in said packaging and fall heavily to the ground shouting, on the way down, "this is gonna cost ya!".

[osdset]

The correct procedure Mr P is to entangle oneself in said packaging and fall heavily to the ground shouting, on the way down, "this is gonna cost ya!".

Better to have the witnesses say "this is gonna cost ya!" whilst Mr P is writhing in agony on the foor.

[Mr.P]

You guys are all heart.!!

[Chester6]

You guys are all heart.!!

 

Just making sure that you get your pound of flesh in compensation from pound land

Edited October 4, 2013 by Chester6

[joeski]

We all want the same thing, as ingeus are useless!

 

Loving the i hate ingeus page someone has set up on Facebook :lol:

 

 

that page has nothing to do with me xD