Notice Of Intended Prosecution Fail to stop and provide details, driving without due care HELP

[Muffintop]

I need some advice, within 7 days please guys.. daughter passed test last year, has received nip from Police for failing to stop and provide details, or report an accident.. and driving without due care.

Basically she was with friends, in a small road in housing area, missed her turning, stopped on small road, reversed slowly into a parking space and went up curb and stalled but clipped the car behind also parked, a vehicle was in front and clearly took her vi or perhaps someone from one of the houses looking out of window, she didnt think she had clipped car enough to cause damage just touched it but went back the next day to check it and there was no damage to other vehicle or her car, clearly she should have looked at the time but didnt ............. dont know where the driving without due care comes from but guess they chuck the book if they can... dont know what to put on the form which has to go back to police within 28days.. i am also insured for the car and could have been driving that day .. but wasnt.

[sailor sam]

Mmm... I would of thought that the police would of come around to inspect the car for damage (paint evidence ect). Potentially I would think that they would need to prove that the damage to the other car was consitant with the damage to your car to be able to prosecute. Having said that, if you were to dispute the 'accident' then they may still do that. It would be uunfortunate for your tin of T-cut to come out and some polishing were to take place before hand!

 

Seriously though if she went back the next day to check for damage, she must of known which car to look at. Obviously she should of perhaps done this within 24 hours and attempted to contact the other owner who has clearly reported it to the police. I would suggest that without his 'evidence' there would be little chance of a prosecution so perhaps you could offer to pay for what ever damage has been caused? Alternatively, play the 'ignorance' card and say that as there was no damage, your daughter didn't consider it necessary to report it and express her remorse ect. If she is lucky, the due care may be dropped but she may still be done for failing to stop.

 

P.S. I take it she was driving the car with your permission and was properly insured!

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[Desperate Daniella]

Hi Muffintop,

 

This is very odd. There is no damage to her car or to the other car?

 

Every day people touch other cars when they are parking. If everyone who touched another car when parking was charged with an offence the queues to the Courts would be miles long.

 

I tend to agree with Sailor Sam. Bearing in mind there is no damage to either car, I think your daughter should say she certainly was turning her car at that location on the day, but wasn't aware that she had touched another car, and perhaps the police could put her in touch with the owner of the car with regard to any damage. She should not say that she went back to check the next day because that will prove that she was aware of what she had done.

 

If there is no damage, and it's only the word of a third party, then I really don't know why the police are bothering with this.

 

Good luck.

 

DD

[borisbeaver]

I had a similiar issue nearly 10 years ago. I was moving house and using a 7.5 tonne lorry. The weather was attrocious and I hadn't really got used to the gear box. After I unloaded, I went to take the lorry back to the depot, unfortunately, I clipped a car (ripped the front wing off), but I had no idea I had done this.

 

Next thing was getting a NIP. When I spoke to the investigating officer and explained that I had know idea that I caused this, and it was purely an accident, they decided it was not in the publics interest to prosecute and dropped it and leave it in the hands of the insurers.

[Desperate Daniella]

And surely it's even less in the public interest to prosecute when there isn't even any damage!

[raydetinu]

If there is no damage, then there is no case to answer surely!

Ask the police for the evidence of the damage directly or through a solicitor immediately. Estimate for repairs etc.

Again if damage caused the Police must give you the name and address of the owner so you can give details to insurers.

The CPS/Police will not proceed unless there evidence of damage caused, believe me. So you must establish this straight away.

Also inform your insurance company about the incident, because if you dont they may deny responsibility as you did not tell them and a claim comes in later.

[T.C.]

If an allegation of an accident is made where it is believed that one or more drivers failed to stop, then the Police are obliged to issue an NIP within 14 days for both the failing to stop and report as well as careless driving as it covers them until such time as the incident has been investigated.

 

It is often accepted that minor little touches occur where the driver may not realise that they have hit something, but under the road traffic act, an offence "May" have occured, and so the NIP has to be issued so that should any offences come to light, then it cannot be thrown out on a procedural mistake.

 

An NIP is not confirmation of a prosecution. It says that consideration will be given to prosecuting for one or more offences, and there are a specific number of offences for which the NIP must be issued if not given verbally. Failing to stop and report and careless driving are three of them.

 

At the moment, don't worry too much. Given the minor nature of the crash (assuming a collision did actually take place and this is not a malicious allegation), the Police will have to interview all those involved, and then either decide on the basis of one persons word against anothers that there is insufficient eveidence to prosecute, or chuck it upstairs to the CPS for a decision.

 

If they were to decide to prosecute, then you can consider instructing a solicitor either through your legal expenses insurance if you have it, or your daughter may qualify for legal aid.

[scaniaman]

Since both of you are insured to drive this car then police will have to prove who in fact was at the wheel at the time of bump!!!!

[Muffintop]

I am absolutely asounted by your response caggers thankyou so much, I have read all of your responses and almost feel a little better. I did ring a solicitor today and ask for fixed fee rates, he did mention legal aid as she is studying. I think we will go to the initial consultation and I will take some of the comments here ie. I had forgotton the wording of a NIP you are being considered for the prosection of... yes considered depending on the facts not an automatic summons and trial.. It has made me question the legal system when many of us touch bumpers and we dont all end up going to court, ok we would get out check there is no damage and either leave a note or agree with the other party that there is no damage done.. she has reversed into a parking spot and misjudged the kerb and gone up it a little and stalled,, this is not her knowing and realising as any reasonable motorist would that she has infact touched the car behind and therefore there is no intent factor, she has to know she has hit a car, she has to know she is going to drive off and intend to not report it... I know all this but Im still terrified. I really hope that this is sorted out and like you say above if damage can be proven and not just made up by the other driver to get a vehicle with a little dink sorted out at my daughters expense then of course she would offer to pay for it. ... Im now wondering if she has legal assistance with her insurance policy and whether to explore this further at this stage but think I would be best to see the solicitor as planned and let a legal aid application get put in quickly so that we can get this nip back to the Police traffic dept in the hope they will get their fingers out and get it sorted within 4 weeks so she can if she has to go to court go to a youth court as she is 18 in 4 weeks. I have found out today that if your in the first year of driving and get 6 points your toast and your license is taken away and you have to retake your test.. she worked so hard to pass her test and kept taking it and on the 3rd time passed. I hope the outcome is favourable and she will certainly learn a lesson if she ever THINKS she may have dinked a car check it... I will keep you all posted as I may need some more help... its so hard to get a case through the CPS even with evidence that Im just amazed that something like this would pass the threshold and there just seems no justice really in the serious crimes..... tell me about it. thanks again guys.

[T.C.]

Just don't lose any sleep at the moment. Remember, all the police have done is follow procedure and the NIP is only to advice that consideration is being given to the question of prosecuting, it is not a given.

 

As far as legal aid is concerned, giventhat it is means tested and she is a student, in the event that you have no LEI, then she should not have difficulty getting legal aid, but you may have to shop around as many law firms have had their legal aid certificate removed under recent changes by the MoJ

[ihateyes]

We all have camera phones..... if we think we have dinkd another car, or have done so... take a picture.

 

Too many slime balls out there looking to make a quick buck or a easy repair!! (ie rust on panel)

[patdavies]

Since both of you are insured to drive this car then police will have to prove who in fact was at the wheel at the time of bump!!!!

 

Er, that's the point of the nip/S.172 request...

[T.C.]

Er, that's the point of the nip/S.172 request...

 

Absolutely, and remember, there is strict liability oon this, so if you fail or choose to return the S172, then the registered keeper will be the person who is summonsed.

Edited April 2, 2011 by T.C.
spelling error

[Muffintop]

Again cant thank you enough for the advice, I am rubbish at traffic stuff... yes I will return NIP next week, we only got it Friday but Im at odds how much to put in supporting evidence.. If I dont put anything then they would have to run a trial so that her side of account can be put forward for consideration, but I dont want to put too much and possibly draw a conclusion.. this is why

 

I have contacted a solicitor who should be able to offer legal aid as she is u18 for the next month. I do think I could put something myself but think it may be better worded by a legal advisor but if not sorted by end of week I will proberly help her complete and get it back.. we are both so worred about it that we need it out of the way as its affecting her studying.. I hope that once NIP returned there will be insufficient grounds to continue and may just be case of giving her details for insurance purposes, but yes I think this other person is swinging the lead and stating that damage has been caused that hasnt.

[Muffintop]

Mmm... I would of thought that the police would of come around to inspect the car for damage (paint evidence ect). Potentially I would think that they would need to prove that the damage to the other car was consitant with the damage to your car to be able to prosecute. Having said that, if you were to dispute the 'accident' then they may still do that. It would be uunfortunate for your tin of T-cut to come out and some polishing were to take place before hand!

 

Seriously though if she went back the next day to check for damage, she must of known which car to look at. Obviously she should of perhaps done this within 24 hours and attempted to contact the other owner who has clearly reported it to the police. I would suggest that without his 'evidence' there would be little chance of a prosecution so perhaps you could offer to pay for what ever damage has been caused? Alternatively, play the 'ignorance' card and say that as there was no damage, your daughter didn't consider it necessary to report it and express her remorse ect. If she is lucky, the due care may be dropped but she may still be done for failing to stop.

 

P.S. I take it she was driving the car with your permission and was properly insured!

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

well yes ironically she is a model young person, she works 2 jobs does a levels and pays for her own insurance and car and petrol... she tries so hard and i feel that she is being penalised for such a small thing when she didnt really even realise what had happened at the time.

[Hammy1962]

Ref :-

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?300645-Car-Written-Off-By-Foregin-Trucker.-And-Tesco-Insurance-Won-t-Act-For-Me

 

Are you sure she is not a Bulgarian lorry driver???

 

Hammy

[heliosuk]

Watch out for the poisned umbrella and Blackfriars Bridge Hammy!!!

[Desperate Daniella]

Hi Muffintop,

 

Have I missed something? Is there any damage or not? You could still go back and take a picture. As ihateyes says, did your daughter cause damage, or is the car rusty?

 

Some years ago, I caught someone's bumper as I was getting into my designated office car parking space as they were three inches into it, and the angle to get in from the road was very, very tight. Of course I told them immediately. They should not have been parked there, and were doing some temp work in the office block. They had a very rusty old car, worth about three hundred pounds at most. I said that I would wait for them to let me know how much the estimate for the damage would be before I called my insurers as I might pay cash. Some weeks later the guy phoned me and said he'd had it repaired and I owed him £300+ for the damage!!! I got a male friend to ring back and say that as he had not called before getting the damage repaired we trusted that he had taken photos and would send a copy of the invoice from the garage who did the repair. I never heard another word.

 

Regardless of your daughter possibly catching his car, there are [problematic] out there, so be careful.

 

DD

[patdavies]

Absolutely, and remember, there is strict liability oon this, so if you fail or choose to return the S172, then the registered keeper will be the person who is summonsed.

 

Maybe.

 

The person summonsed will be the person to whom the S.172 is addressed. Whilst in this case this may be the RK, it is not always so. An S.172 can be served on anybody.

[Muffintop]

I have been told by my daughter she did not see any damage, she has no damage on her car, but point is she was aware there was a minor touching from her car to the other, and by rights should have got out checked at the time.. i think because she went up the kerb and stalled she probably thought the bump was due to that. Next day after it playing on mind she went to check other car for any damage, there was apparently none.. We have been there today to take photos of the road, and the same car was in same place, as we drove past it she couldnt see any damage nor could I, so Im really confused.. maybe someone has reported that they thought she bumped the car and didnt stop but the owner of the car hasnt even noticed any damage ... because there isnt any... I just dont know and until the nip has gone in which will be next week following our appt with the solicitor at end of week we wont know if the Police are taking it to next stage a summons, at that stage witness statements will become available to solicitor and we will know what we are dealing with.. I really cannot get this when my sons new car was totalled by a drunk driver, who had no insurance and we knew who it was, rang Police reported 999 at scene and the guy got off.. due to no hard evidence, he managed to get rid of the cctv from the pub by paying the landlord off... my son had a 500 excess that he ended up having to pay.. there is simply no justice here .. what my daughter should have done was get out, check and take a pic of the car so that any future allegations could have been quashed.. will know more after my session with solicitor at end of week. This is really getting us all down now as its hanging over our heads,

[crem]

We have been there today to take photos of the road, and the same car was in same place, as we drove past it she couldnt see any damage nor could I,........ what my daughter should have done was get out, check and take a pic of the car so that any future allegations could have been quashed

 

Why didn't you take the pics today?

[Muffintop]

Hi just want to thank you all for bothering to read this thread and reply, cant believe but got a letter from Police on daughters birthday saying they were no further action from their end.. Just down to insurance company now to satisfy themselves no accident occurred.. they asked for pics of her vehicle to show no damage occurred, bit silly really cos the pics are not date and time so could be taken any time .. if this part is finished then she can get on with her motoring as a new sensible driver and I hope its a little lesson for her how easily things can go wrong.. will ask for thread to close but thanks all again

[Desperate Daniella]

So pleased for your daughter, Muffintop. From what you have said she is a pretty careful driver anyway, so I wish her lots of happy motoring.