Bank Parking ANPR PCN PAPLOC Now Claimform - wrong reg - Appeal failed - Belverdere Street Car Park, Mansfield, Nottinghamshire, NG18 1JJ

[honeybee13]

That's what dx is saying, No to mediation for private parking claims.

If you do mediation, their message says you have to be prepared to compromise with the PPC on how much he will pay them, or your son needs to be.

Is that what he wants?

HB

[AndyOrch]

16 hours ago, Laura Cooke said:

Will do the mediation then though in my previous messages from Admin I was told I should never have agreed to mediation?

You need to read past the first 3 words of DX quote until you get to the words unless and the words in red Laura.

 

Andy

 

 

.

[FTMDave]

dx wrote upthread -

On 21/11/2023 at 14:15, dx100uk said:

if the mediation service ring simply refuse mediation.. end of.

dx

I see you're worried about your son's mental health and the strength of your case.

I have a busy day at work today but will read through your thread with a fine tooth comb this evening considering this and then reply properly.

[Laura Cooke]

Thank you

doubt we can do Court

Son not coped

tried to explain delicately that contact has been received from mediation and if that isn`t the way forward then Court

he freaked out and smashed his kitchen up,

his carer has been dealing with him today I

just can`t hack this much longer

dare not speak to him anymore about any of this

god knows what I am going to do

[FTMDave]

OK, things you have going for you.

1.  Your son could not possibly have been the driver.  LFI has pointed out that Bank have not properly followed the protocols to transfer liability from the driver to the keeper.

2.  He paid.  Legally, getting the registration number wrong is "de minimis" and every time that we know about when the matter boiled down to inputting the wrong registration number the motorist won.

3.  Sure he can't prove absolutely that he paid.  Neither can Bank prove he didn't pay.  However, Bank have admitted that there is a payment which doesn't correspond to a registration number entered.  It's not difficult to work out that that is your son's payment.

Only you can know the situation with your son.

Legally you don't owe a penny.  Therefore we would normally say to refuse mediation.  However, if you think paying something is the price to pay for safeguarding your son's mental health than take part in mediation.

Another thing to consider is that it is a tactic of these disgusting companies to issue court claims, when they have absolutely no intention of turning up in court, as a means of intimidating the motorist into paying.  Therefore if you hold firm they might discontinue the claim later on.  It's a possibility, not a probability.

There must be some safeguard in place to protect someone like your son in court and allow you to represent him, you will need to look into this, but that will have to wait until the case is allocated to your local court.

 

[dx100uk]

On 07/06/2022 at 17:39, Laura Cooke said:

The ticketing data for the day has been extracted and analysed. The ticketing data has been attached. We are unable to locate a valid payment made for the appellant's vehicle. There were 71 tickets obtained between the appellant's entry and exit. None of the tickets correspond to the appellant's vehicle

i hark you back to post 1

here the PPC state they have a list of entered reg numbers for that period.

i would let this run and refuse mediation.

your WS will specifically mention and exhibit wherever this list came from...email..letter etc . and demand they produce it. it could be a case of a simple character mis entry in the machine or an old reg number. BUT the list will prove a reg was entered for the time you were there AND a bank statement will prove the payment made. it's worthy to note.... we've not lost a wrong reg claim yet, in fact i believe those that were ...and defended were discontinued.??

just musing

dx

 

[Nicky Boy]

This is a very significant comment by the IAS "adjudicator"...

On 24/06/2022 at 23:52, Laura Cooke said:

The Operator's evidence shows no payment for the Appellant's vehicle, or anything similar. It does show two payments for the same registration in quick succession. I would take a reasonable guess, based on the circumstances described, that the person paying has paid for the registration of the person they assisted again.

If they have paid for the incorrect registration they have my sympathy, but the guidance to the appeal is clear that I may only consider legal issues not extenuating circumstances. The Operator has this discretion, but they are unlikely to exercise it in the Appellant's favour, in the absence of evidence to support the claim.

I think it's extremely damning and should certainly be used in any Witness Statement!

[lookinforinfo]

Laura don't forget that even the IAS appeal officer more or less suggested that your son had paid -

"The Operator's evidence shows no payment for the Appellant's vehicle, or anything similar. It does show two payments for the same registration in quick succession. I would take a reasonable guess, based on the circumstances described, that the person paying has paid for the registration of the person they assisted again."

Simple mistake that many people make-inputting the wrong registration number. Baroness Walmsley took TFL to Court and won over a similar case as yours son's. The Judge pointed out that the Law was designed to punish those who didn't pay, not those who had paid.

You have a difficult decision to make over whether to go to Court or not. It cannot be easy for you knowing that perhaps the best way to not have to pay the PCN is to go to Court and yet you can only guess how it may affect your son.

i was looking back at your thread and saw that you had crossed out the address of the car park that the alleged breach occurred. I wonder if you would be good enough to include the whole address that is on he original PCN including the postcode to see if there is anything further to help you and your son.

[Nicky Boy]

From the OP's posts and the PCN, it looks like this is the place LFI, but Google streetview doesn't really get close enough to see much...

https://www.google.com/maps/@53.1435834,-1.1990174,3a,75y,197.67h,93.78t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sU4ug6ZpsUr_w0ht4cXGiMw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

The only comment I'll make is that the entrance sign is dubious and isn't compliant with ATA's COP.

Just noticed that it's train and bus parking... could be subject to bye laws?

[Laura Cooke]

IAS adjudicators response does not have it down that two payments were made?

I registered a certificate of suitability of litigation friend, the person who paid the parking fee also submitted a witness statement and proof of my sons disability etc were sent to the County Court and the claimants solicitor. What would the procedure be to go to Court please?

The IAS letter mentions nothing about 2 payments made, I did originally put the whole address up of the car park but I think admin removed it

[Nicky Boy]

@Andyorch

Does this "certificate of suitability of litigation friend", mentioned above, allow the OP to act on behalf of her son from the moment she obtains it Andy? Or just in the courtroom?

[Laura Cooke]

I am inclined to agree with everything you are saying @dx100uk, but what would be the procedure to go to Court?

I did register as a litigation friend,

how do you know if this was accepted for me to represent my son?

it was sent to Northampton March 2023 along with a witness statement from the person who paid for the parking ticket

[Nicky Boy]

Laura,

The mention of the two payments I (and LFI) quoted earlier, were taken from your own post on the 24th June.. post number 17 or thereabouts.

if it's not right, could you please upload the original response from IAS?

 

5 hours ago, Laura Cooke said:

the person who paid the parking fee also submitted a witness statement and proof of my sons disability etc were sent to the County Court and the claimants solicitor

You've not mentioned this so far?

Why are you writing to the claimant's solicitor?

Please keep us in the loop about what you're doing.

[AndyOrch]

39 minutes ago, Nicky Boy said:

@Andyorch

Does this "certificate of suitability of litigation friend", mentioned above, allow the OP to act on behalf of her son from the moment she obtains it Andy? Or just in the courtroom?

The whole process Nick once its/if granted and accepted.

[FTMDave]

The problem is that at the moment you are dealing with an anonymous bulk processing system in Northampton.  The case hasn't been allocated yet to your local court.

Did you ever get a reply from Northampton about the litigation friend angle?

[Nicky Boy]

So Laura,

It appears that if you have this certificate, you can effectively take him out of the process.

This should help with his stress problems.

But, referring to my last post above, you really should not be doing anything without letting the team know first!

Can you please upload all the correspondence youve had with their solicitors... And stopcommunicating with them!

[Laura Cooke]

It was in March 2023 that I sent copies of my sons condition to the solicitor and Court at Northampton, I cannot remember if I was advised to do this got so much going off not sure.

Not communicated with Solicitor since other than admin writing a snotty letter to send to Bank which I did.

I cannot upload any papers as I have no idea how to do it as previously stated, hence why the online MCOL was never done as it simply would not accept anything all passwords kept saying void.

I sent a Certificate of Suitability to the Court at Northampton March 2023, no idea if you are meant to receive anything back to say they accepted this, I have had nothing back from them up until recently. 

a letter came from Northampton 12th October 2023, A general form of Judgement, saying we failed to file the directions questionnaire, we failed because we never received anything, this order said we had to file the directions questionnaire within 7 days which I did, then this week's letter came about mediation which is 20th December 

5 hours ago, Nicky Boy said:

Laura,

The mention of the two payments I (and LFI) quoted earlier, were taken from your own post on the 24th June.. post number 17 or thereabouts. if it's not right, could you please upload the original response from IAS?

The admin added this about 2 tickets purchased, nowhere in the IAS appeal does it state this, only that 71 tickets were purchased on the day and that my sons vehicle was not one of them

the IAS response had the vehicle registration as CY08JCJ which I have no idea who that belongs to but not one number or letter is similar to my sons registration

[honeybee13]

Who do you mean by 'the admin' please?

HB

[Laura Cooke]

Whoever was advising me at the time, I didn`t feel I could put that in a letter as it wasn`t correct well it wasn`t on the IAS response

[honeybee13]

I'm sorry, I don't understand what you mean.

Which organisation did 'the admin' work for please?

HB

[FTMDave]

You seem to have worked out how to sort out this certificate much better than anyone on CAG!

However, you have written to a bulk processing centre, not a real court in the normal sense of the term.  Probably they've lost your letter-

Once the case gets allocated to your local court, write there, and all will be sorted out quickly.

On 24/06/2022 at 23:52, Laura Cooke said:

The Operator's evidence shows no payment for the Appellant's vehicle, or anything similar. It does show two payments for the same registration in quick succession. I would take a reasonable guess, based on the circumstances described, that the person paying has paid for the registration of the person they assisted again.

There it is, as clear as clear can be.  An extra payment which can't be matched to a vehicle - obviously made by your son.  It backs up your story right from the start that you helped an elderly lady too.  Two payments were made with her registration.

[Laura Cooke]

Bank have the correct vehicle registration but the IAS doesn`t perhaps the other vehicle was the elderly ladies, both paid by cash.

I looked the certificate up on the internet as I have power of attorney for another relative and have had to do something similar previously

[lookinforinfo]

The registration number you  quoted belongs to a Ford Kuga. Was that the car that your grandson was helping the owner of?

[FTMDave]

Laura, we've seen you've reported a post.

Is there something you want to add to the thread?

[Laura Cooke]

I wanted to comment to Lookinginforinfo but it wouldn`t let me comment as I am on page 7 and there are no more pages so I wasn`t able to comment,

I will ask my grandson f he knows what vehicle the elderly lady had that he helped pay for her parking

Edited December 16, 2023 by dx100uk
unnecessary previous post quote removed