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    • I have just read the smaller print on their signs. It says that you can pay at the end of your parking session. given that you have ten minutes grace period the 35 seconds could easily have been taken up with walking back to your car, switching on the engine and then driving out. Even in my younger days when I used to regularly exceed speed limits, I doubt I could have done that in 35 seconds even when I  had a TR5.
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    • Thank you for posting up the results from the sar. The PCN is not compliant with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4. Under Section 9 [2][a] they are supposed to specify the parking time. the photographs show your car in motion both entering and leaving the car park thus not parking. If you have to do a Witness Statement later should they finally take you to Court you will have to continue to state that even though you stayed there for several hours in a small car park and the difference between the ANPR times and the actual parking period may only be a matter of a few minutes  nevertheless the CEL have failed to comply with the Act by failing to specify the parking period. However it looks as if your appeal revealed you were the driver the deficient PCN will not help you as the driver. I suspect that it may have been an appeal from the pub that meant that CEL offered you partly a way out  by allowing you to claim you had made an error in registering your vehicle reg. number . This enabled them to reduce the charge to £20 despite them acknowledging that you hadn't registered at all. We have not seen the signs in the car park yet so we do not what is said on them and all the signs say the same thing. It would be unusual for a pub to have  a Permit Holders Only sign which may discourage casual motorists from stopping there. But if that is the sign then as it prohibits any one who doesn't have a permit, then it cannot form a contract with motorists though it may depend on how the signs are worded.
    • Defence and Counterclaim Claim number XXX Claimant Civil Enforcement Limited Defendant XXXXXXXXXXXXX   How much of the claim do you dispute? I dispute the full amount claimed as shown on the claim form.   Do you dispute this claim because you have already paid it? No, for other reasons.   Defence 1. The Defendant is the recorded keeper of XXXXXXX  2. It is denied that the Defendant entered into a contract with the Claimant. 3. As held by the Upper Tax Tribunal in Vehicle Control Services Limited v HMRC [2012] UKUT 129 (TCC), any contract requires offer and acceptance. The Claimant was simply contracted by the landowner to provide car-park management services and is not capable of entering into a contract with the Defendant on its own account, as the car park is owned by and the terms of entry set by the landowner. Accordingly, it is denied that the Claimant has authority to bring this claim. 4. In any case it is denied that the Defendant broke the terms of a contract with the Claimant. 5. The Claimant is attempting double recovery by adding an additional sum not included in the original offer. 6. In a further abuse of the legal process the Claimant is claiming £50 legal representative's costs, even though they have no legal representative. 7. The Particulars of Claim is denied in its entirety. It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief at all. Signed I am the Defendant - I believe that the facts stated in this form are true XXXXXXXXXXX 01/05/2024   Defendant's date of birth XXXXXXXXXX   Address to which notices about this claim can be sent to you  
    • pop up on the bulk court website detailed on the claimform. [if it is not working return after the w/end or the next day if week time] . When you select ‘Register’, you will be taken to a screen titled ‘Sign in using Government Gateway’.  Choose ‘Create sign in details’ to register for the first time.  You will be asked to provide your name, email address, set a password and a memorable recovery word. You will be emailed your Government Gateway 12-digit User ID.  You should make a note of your memorable word, or password as these are not included in the email.<<**IMPORTANT**  then log in to the bulk court Website .  select respond to a claim and select the start AOS box. .  then using the details required from the claimform . defend all leave jurisdiction unticked  you DO NOT file a defence at this time [BUT you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 ] click thru to the end confirm and exit the website .get a CPR 31:14 request running to the solicitors https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?486334-CPR-31.14-Request-to-use-on-receipt-of-a-PPC-(-Private-Land-Parking-Court-Claim type your name ONLY no need to sign anything .you DO NOT await the return of paperwork. you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 from the date on the claimform.
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SIP/Gladstone claimform - PCN Clippers Quay in Salford **WON+COSTS** not paid bailiffs afoot!


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Hi all,

 

Hoping you can help,

 

I received a ticket on my vehicle for staying longer than I should

however the NTK which I received stated I had the wrong ticket displayed

(I had another parking ticket displayed in the window on the other side of the car)

 

I presume the attendant saw that one and wrote up the charge.

 

I followed advice to ignore the spam letters coming through the post

 

I believe what I was ignoring related to a fine from over 4 years ago

(these letters didn't state as to what fine it was just an outstanding payment that was owed to DCBL)

 

therefore I assumed it related to my recent fine this year and as such ignored them.

 

Unfortunately I have now received the following letter from Gladstones and quite frankly Im working myself up into a bit of a panic now!

 

I have attached the letter, If someone could kindly advise on this it would be greatly appreciated!

 

letter of claim gladdys.pdf

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and their client is?

 

who issued the ticket

 

its NOT A FINE

stop using that word

 

its a speculative invoice

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?462118-Have-you-received-a-Parking-Ticket

 

doesn't matter if they read these forums

 

can you fill this out please

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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1 The date of infringement? 23/03/2016

2 Did you appeal to the parking company?

 

If yes, has there been any response?

If no, have you received a Notice To Keeper? (NTK) Did the NTK provide photographic evidence?

 

Did not appeal, received NTK no photographic evidence.

3 Did the NTK mention Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA)

 

No

4 If you appealed after receiving the NTK, did the parking company give you any information regarding the further appeals process?

[it is well known that parking companies will reject any appeal whatever the circumstances]

 

5 Who is the parking company? SIP Parking Limited

Also on the NTK there is no offer for a discount if paid before a certain date,

I did read that this must be included on a NTK?

 

Thanks

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can you post up the NTK with your personal details omitted but the dates and place it relates to left in so we can pick holes in it.

 

Generally the parking co's get the letter wrong so it doesnt create a keeper liability but they will still carry on badgering you but wont try their luck at court as they know they will automatically lose a defended claim as they have no cause for action.

Edited by honeybee13
Paras.
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well,

they are obliged to offer a discount period but the written law on this is a little vague when applying it to NTK's after a screen ticket but Hansard does mention it so that is the law.

 

 

Same applies to the appeals time

so in short the NTK is not compliant but typical of the IPC scheme, which is a Kangaroo court.

 

Now next question is on the sigange at the site you were parked

was there a specific clause saying that you could be in breach of the conditions for displaying the wrong ticket?

If not how can there be a breach?

 

 

The sign that displays these terms must be at the entrance to the private land,

not some randomly placed sign

 

 

We cant tell where the event was because you have blanked that out

so tell us where the car park was and if more than one entrance which one you used from the public highway.

 

once we have this we can suggest the best form of words to Gladdys.

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being IPC members they dont think the law applies to them as Gladstones/IPC/IAS always tell them that they can assume the driver and keeper are the same person. The POFA again, doesnt specifically say that you have to say that a keeper laibility may be created under that legislation, so wording is again vague but intention clear

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Hi all please see the attached photos, unfortunately I have now realised I'm two days out of the 14 days response period to Gladstones. Personal issues of recent have diverted my attention.

 

I am determined to beat these guys; I trust a letter of defence is the next course of action?

 

 

signs.pdf

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I guess it depends on the interpretation of the term "valid" pay and display ticket!

 

I think they would struggle getting the "additional charges per 24 hour period" through the court, as that goes against the judgment in the Beavis case

- the fact that Parking Eye didn't incur any additional costs for someone overstaying for much longer means they couldn't charge more, or that would have been a penalty.

They didn't, which was one of the reasons why they won.

 

 

Be interesting to know an expert's view on whether Simpleton Parking would be able to get away with that one (but that probably doesn't apply to your defence).

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their signage is not a contract but an "invitation to treat" and you cannot be held to it as a unilateral would contract bind you.

tell them that. just to create a paper trail and show that you arent ignoring them completely

 

dont say anything else though, you dont want to enter into an argument on how long is a piece of string

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Who said you had to respond in 14 days? Ignore their timelines and follow erics advice. Short letter or not, he knows EXACTLY what he's doing.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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theres that word again - legal.

 

THEY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

 

a DCA is NOT A BAILIFF

they have NO SUCH LEGAL POWERS

 

you or I have MORE.

 

their 'solicitors' are merely a different letterhead in the same printer!!

we call them fake/tame sols

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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send that short letter saying no contract offered as signage isnt a contract

but an invitation to treat so no monies due to your client to Gladdys and leave it at that.

 

Gladstones are the IPC in a different frock so there is naked self interest

and possible criminality about this rash of claims they are issuing

 

 

but this short letter may well be enough to persuade the parking co it isnt worth spending hundreds of pounds just to be humiliated in public.

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tough you call the shots not some powerless sols.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 4 weeks later...

Afternoon all, unfortunately, the letter I did send to Gladstones proved unsuccessful.

 

I have now received court papers, please can you advise on what I should do now regarding defending the claim?

 

Your help is much appreciated!

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please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Date of issue – 12 September 2016

What is the claim for – Total due £150

AND THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS

The claimant claims the sum of £154.44 for Parking charges and indemnity costs if applicable including £4.44 interest pursuant to S.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 Rate 8.00% pa from dates above to 05/09/16

Same rate to Judgment or (sooner) payment

Daily rate to Judgment £0.03

Total debt and interest £154.44

 

What is the value of the claim? £154.44

Has the claim been issued by the original creditor

or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim ? SIP Parking

Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment?

 

No,

I recieved a windscreen ticket,

notice to keeper, and

then a letter before claim (attached in previous post)

 

Location was Clippers Quay in Salford

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go ack the claim on MCOL website

defend all

leave jurisdiction unticked

 

 

get our parking CPR 31:14 running to gladdy's

 

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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