HELP! XMAS Claim from CABOT / WRIGHT HASSALL CLAIM for old EGG Card

[gforce2k]

Ok thanks Andy, so anything disclosed later cannot be relied on, has to be now or never

(I think that's what you were saying?)

 

cheers,

gf2k

[AndyOrch]

Ok thanks Andy, so anything disclosed later cannot be relied on, has to be now or never

(I think that's what you were saying?)

 

cheers,

gf2k

 

Disclosed later ? later than what?

[gforce2k]

Disclosed later ? later than what?

 

Sorry, disclosed later than/after Standard Disclosure today.

I understand there is a running requirement to disclose right up until the trial hearing?

If so I imagine there must be a mechanism in place to file/submit/disclose new docs that come to light even after the Standard Disclosure deadline?

 

thanks

 

gf2k

[AndyOrch]

Okay with you...well its called a Supplemental Disclosure...but it has to be by application with fee and consent of the other party and it will require a further witness statement (supplemental)

 

So tricky and costly

 

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part31#31.13

[gforce2k]

Okay with you...well its called a Supplemental Disclosure...but it has to be by application with fee and consent of the other party and it will require a further witness statement (supplemental)

 

So tricky and costly

 

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part31#31.13

 

ok thanks Andy, back to you later if I have any other questions.

Cheers,

gf2k

[gforce2k]

Hi Andy,

I had terrible issues submitting my N264,

 

 

I completed it in good time but couldnt print it until yesterday at the library as my home printer didn't work.

 

As a result I had to email but it didn;t allow electronic signature so I still had to find a way to print it.

 

I downloaded the completed N264 to a usb and took it to the library

but their systems didn;t recognise it,

the N264 was blank and I was stuck at the library with an hour to go and no information to complete a new one.

I couldn't get back home in time

 

 

the only way I could redo the N264 was get my wife to send photos of the completed version on my pc at home.

 

She did this and I re-typed the form, printed it, signed it and re-scanned it

but throughout this the library system kept logging me out repeatedly and closing what was working on

so although I did finally email the court and WH it was pretty much dead on 4pm so slightly over time when they got it.

 

I've emailed a letter to the court tonight with a full explanation of the technical issues/extenuating circumstances which were a comedy of errors,

but I don't know if it'll do any good.

 

Am I scuppered irrevocably or is it possible the court will take into account those circumstances

and the fact that I'm LiP without the financial & technical resources of a solicitors?

 

Frustrated.

Thanks,

GF2k

[AndyOrch]

N265 GF...dont worry time is not as critical as the actual Witness Statement and Disclosure itself.

[gforce2k]

Thanks for coming back to me so quickly Andy,

That's good to hear but I'm going to go back to the library to scan/copy their receipt from yesterday and also print a hardcopy of a Screen Print of the printer problem.

 

Oops, N265, noticed that this morning too so corrected my letter, I'll email it again with everything when I have the receipt scanned in and print it off at the library too.

 

If I take that all in to the Court and submit it physically over the counter will that be dealt with/seen by the judge quicker than my emails?

I understand emails and post are usually running 10 days behind due to the backlog but perhaps over the counter is different?

 

Thanks,

gf2k

[AndyOrch]

GF the N265 is between you and the claimant only in the main...the court will not be too concerned what is actually on that list...as long as disclosure happens at the appropriate time.

You must serve copies on the court of your actual disclosure and witness statement

[gforce2k]

Thanks Andy should i just send everything voluntarily to save time?

[AndyOrch]

Thanks Andy should i just send everything voluntarily to save time?

 

If this were smalls claim track I would say yes GF...but as we are in Fast Track you must follow the directions.

 

Disclosure List by xxxxxxx

 

Disclosure exchange by xxxxxxxxx

 

Witness Statement by xxxxxxxxx

[gforce2k]

Thanks Andy,

My concern is that WH may use my being 3 mins over to use this strike out my defence.

The Order has a warning in bold at the top:

Warning: you must comply with the terms imposed upon you by this order otherwise your case is liable to be struck out or some other sanction imposed. If you cannot comply you are expected to make a formal application to the court before any deadline imposed upon you expires.

 

Also, when I got their N265 last week they had enclosed the only document in their Disclosure List that I had not already received, so i have nothing to request now.

 

Surely I may as well do the same proactively to be safe? They will most likely ask for the docs anyway this week (they have until next Monday) and at the least if I file everything in the list proactively it will dissuade the court from agreeing to any application they may make to Strike out?

 

Surely I won;t be penalised for providing everything voluntarily?

 

Thanks,

Gf2k

[AndyOrch]

Well visa versa they may not require anything you have on your list...the 265 as stated is not a stringent part of the directions...in fact some parties do not even use it in Fast Track.

[gforce2k]

I understand it's not the done thing, in fact it's overkill but the letter of the Order hasn't been adhered to so I'm thinking overkill might help mitigate the risk of Strike Out on a technicality.

 

If I was in their position I would try any opportunity to Strike out given that there is a clear warning in the Order but do you think the court would see that as overkill on their part given that the 265 was only 3 minutes late, albeit by email?

 

I know it's my own little storm in a tea cup but I'd rather go overboard to be safe, I just keep remembering how unforgiving the judge was.

[gforce2k]

perhaps I should call them to check receipt/intentions?

[AndyOrch]

I personally would leave it...sanctions imposed for a 3 min delay on a N265 exchange...you would be the first ever GF:-)

[gforce2k]

I personally would leave it...sanctions imposed for a 3 min delay on a N265 exchange...you would be the first ever GF:-)

 

Thanks Andy, at least I'm ready for any request which may reach me tomorrow. fingers crossed...

[gforce2k]

Hi Andy/everyone,

An update and some questions if anyone can help please:

 

Disclosure

I've had no bounceback from WH's email address after submitting my N265 Disclosure List on Monday, but also no confirmation of receipt which I find odd/worrying.

I've still not sent any hardcopies, money is extremely tight so posting hardcopies (which I have to pay to produce too) means I can't unless absolutely unavoidable, however I'm wondering if I need to send hardcopies today to be safe?

 

Less urgently but also important some questions that may affect my Witness Statement:

Interest:

Since C@b0t bought the balance from egg c£14k in 2009 they have added interest "at a rate of 12% per annum on a simple basis." so they estimate now c£22k with legal costs.

This is despite not providing a Signed agreement at any time for an account opened in May 2004.

Do I have grounds to dispute this interest given the account is in dispute?

 

No Signed Agreement

I have always understood a signed agreement is needed for pre-2007 agreements but they seem to think not?

Could anyone clarify what the limits of this defence might be for me?

 

Many thanks everyone,

gf2k

[AndyOrch]

" Less urgently but also important some questions that may affect my Witness Statement:

Interest:

Since C@b0t bought the balance from Eggicon c£14k in 2009 they have added interest "at a rate of 12% per annum on a simple basis." so they estimate now c£22k with legal costs.

This is despite not providing a Signed agreement at any time for an account opened in May 2004.

Do I have grounds to dispute this interest given the account is in dispute?"

 

Given that the account has been terminated...how can they add interest ?

 

A reconstituted is fine with regards to complying to a section 77/78 request.....but if the agreement is pre 2007 they need the signed executed agreement to enforce it in Court

[gforce2k]

Thanks Andy,

That's very much my view but WH are increasingly firm that it's reasonable for their client to charge interest and that they only need reconstituted docs.

As regards Termination would a "Your Egg Card account has been cancelled...", cut up your cards etc. letter be sufficient?

As regards Signed agreement what point of law may I quote in future/on my WS?

 

One last thing...WH have drafted a letter to request docs from my disclosed list but haven't sent it yet (apparently pending approval?) and the deadline is monday for requests to be in.

Their rep may give me a call to go make the request verbally.

Is this acceptable or is it a strict enough deadline that I should try an application to strike?

 

thanks,

gf2k

[AndyOrch]

Okay here is an upload which will tell you all about enforceability and section 77/8 requests...so glean from this what ever you need for your ws.

 

Guidanceonsections77_78_79oftheConsumerCreditAct1974.pdf

 

Parties are encouraged to discuss and agree disclosure so its fine to proceed with that.

[gforce2k]

thanks Andy, I'll have a good read through but just on the question of the letter is cancellation essentially termination?

if as I hope it is then do I need to try to include it in disclosure in some way or is referring to cancellation in my WS enough?

 

cheers,

gf2k

[citizenB]

As regards Termination would a "Your Eggicon Card account has been cancelled...", cut up your cards etc. letter be sufficient?

 

 

I would say that any reasonable person would be under the impression that their account had been terminated - yes !

[gforce2k]

thanks CB,

Egg definitely stopped charging interest from that point yet as soon as C@b0t bought the debt 3 years later they started to add interest.

Their claim includes c£6k+ interest which from what you and Andy have affirmed they have no right to charge.

 

Is this a potential claim killer or just a negotiation point?

Either way do I have to present the letter to prove the point? it isn't in the disclosure list.

 

Cheers,

gf2k

 

 

 

Also CB I'd appreciate your view regarding

[gforce2k]

Also CB I'd appreciate your view regarding the signed agreement question.

Particularly if you know what case law I could quote to shut them down?

 

At the CMC their rep only provided reconstituted agreements but the judge lapped it up saying that it was a long time ago and the court accepts that sometimes in these situations original documentation gets lost/can't be found, the docs are all that the claimant has been able to find so they are acceptable...which completely contradicted my understanding.

 

Thanks,

gf2k