Letter threat of BK - old ltd company debt - claim form received - help

[mryummy]

Thanks very much, appreciate all your help.

 

I'm going to report the accountancy firm to their regulator as this is disgusting harassment

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Good idea.

[dx100uk]

retitled and moved to legal

 

dx

[citizenB]

Responding to S.O.S. Just having a read of thread to see what is happening.

 

BRB.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Responding to S.O.S. Just having a read of thread to see what is happening.

 

BRB.

 

Thank you CB

[citizenB]

Ok, can you please let us know the date of issue on the claim form - top right hand corner of the form.

 

Also, can you please either scan in the claim form (suitably edited of personal details) or type out exactly what they say the claim is for.

 

Once you have done this, we can assess what information you need to request by way of CPR and also what your timeline is.

[mryummy]

Hi thanks for the response.

 

The issue date is the 3rd June. I haven't got a scanner here but this is what it says:

 

The claimants claim is for monies due for accountancy related services provided by the claimant to the defendant at the defendants request and upon the defendants instructions.

 

The claimant claims interest in accordance with the late payment of commercial debts (interest) act 1998 as amended and supplemented by the late payment of commercial debts regulations 2002.

 

Invoice 106799 dated 27.06.2012 # 1486.99

Interest #114.27

Compensation #70.00

 

Invoice 106991 dated 22.08.2012 # 2107.48

Interest 134.47

Compensation #70.00

 

The total claim is for £3983.21 plus £100.00

 

As you will see from the thread, I have no idea what these amounts are for and also doesn't represent any amount similar to the threatening letters that they have sent me.

 

This company was the accountancy firm from my old business

 

Thank you for all your help

[citizenB]

Righto, this is your timeline..

 

Issue date - 3rd June + 5 days for service = 8 June + 14 days to acknowledge claim = 22 June + 14 days to submit defence = 6th July 2013.

 

You will need to send a CPR request for information. I am going to ask for more advice from someone with more knowledge of this.

 

I am not quite sure which CPR request we need to use. Don't worry if I don't get back to you this evening.. Will definitely have something drafted for you by tomorrow

Edited June 5, 2013 by citizenB

[citizenB]

Can you please confirm that they have issued the claim against you personally ?

[mryummy]

Hi

 

It's in my personal name at my home address

[citizenB]

You need to send the following letter to the solicitors mentioned on the claim form. Read it carefully so you know what you are sending and why. Also there are places where you either need to add or delete information. Make sure that this is done. Send the letter either by recorded or special delivery and keep the receipt with your copy of the letter. Check Royal Mail tracking in a few days to ensure that the letter has been received by them and print off a copy of the receipt/signature.

 

 

Dear Sir,

 

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

CPR 31.14 Request

 

On (date) I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the (Name) county court.

 

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

 

Prior to the issue of proceedings I had delivered a request for the production of any copy of the contract to instruct /appoint, mentioned in the Claim Form and on which you rely.

 

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of [each of the following / the] document(s) mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

 

1 Copy of the contract to instruct /appoint/accountancy services. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

 

2 Personal Guarantees

 

3 Full breakdown of invoices, showing the service provided.

 

 

Although your claim is for a sum which is not more than £10,000.00 and will in all likelihood be allocated to the small claims track for determination upon my delivering a defence, at this moment in time I have not delivered my defence and the case has not been allocated to a track. In consequence the provisions of CPR 27(2) are of no effect and you should not seek to avoid compliance with your CPR 31 duties by claiming otherwise.

 

 

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

 

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

 

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

 

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

 

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

 

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

 

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

 

yours faithfully

 

Edited June 6, 2013 by Andyorch
Change of documents request

[mryummy]

Thankyou so much for your help. I really appreciate it

 

I will do this this evening and send tomorrow.

[citizenB]

You might want to have a read of the thread linked below.

 

if he is adamant that he has not signed a PG, then they are bluffing by way of the correspondence that states this fact and knowingly trying to recoup from him personally with the full knowledge the dissolved company is liable.

 

We had recent thread on the same matter which we won...I will try to get you a link

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?341527-N149-AQ-FOR-A-DEBT-i-DONT-THINK-i-OWE.***Claim-Dismissed***&highlight=suewell

 

Claim dismissed

[mryummy]

Thanks so much for all your help so far. Today i have sent the acknowledgement of service and also posted the above letter to the claimant.

 

I will keep you informed of what happens next. I am so determined to fight this!

[citizenB]

[Desperate Daniella]

I don't reckon they have a guarantee. If they had one they would have produced it. As they haven't, they are trying it on through the Courts.

 

Depending on what you get in response from the solicitors, and there is no guarantee provided, you can apply to the court to say that you are not personally liable, and then they will write to the accountants telling them to make an application to amend their claim and make it against the limited company .....

[citizenB]

Righto, we have until the 6th July for you to submit a defence. So if you could give us a nudge around the 25th June to advise if you have received a response to your CPR request, we can set about plotting your next move

[DonkeyB]

The likelihood is that, when you engaged the accountant, they would have sent you an engagement letter outlining their services, their duty of care and your responsibilities. They would not have been able to act for you without your signing a copy of this. It would be somewhat unusual for this to include a clause that stated you were personally liable for the company’s debt, but it is possible.

 

So you should be asking for a copy of this engagement letter.

[AndyOrch]

The likelihood is that, when you engaged the accountant, they would have sent you an engagement letter outlining their services, their duty of care and your responsibilities. They would not have been able to act for you without your signing a copy of this. It would be somewhat unusual for this to include a clause that stated you were personally liable for the company’s debt, but it is possible.

 

So you should be asking for a copy of this engagement letter.

 

Already done DB CPR 31.14:-

 

Dear Sir,

 

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

CPR 31.14 Request

 

On (date) I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the (Name) county court.

 

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

 

Prior to the issue of proceedings I had delivered a request for the production of any copy of the contract to instruct /appoint, mentioned in the Claim Form and on which you rely.

 

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of [each of the following / the] document(s) mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

 

1 . A Copy of the contract to instruct /appoint/accountancy services.

 

Andy

[DonkeyB]

Coat. Taxi.

[citizenB]

[AndyOrch]

[mryummy]

Hi Citizen B

 

Just returned back from a holiday and raring to go with this.

 

I have found a bit more information. The claim relates to alleged bills incurred due to the closing of the company. The accountancy firm offered to close the company down and write to creditors, companies house etc instead of appointing liquidators. They quoted that this would be "about £500", yet the debt is alleged at over £4500.

 

They have sent a packet by recorded delivery but it has gone back to them as no one was there to sign for it.

 

I can recall at the time saying that i would personally pay the £500 to close the company down, however at no time did i say i would pay £4500 and wouldnt in any case as a liquidator would only charge circa £2k and, as the accountant knew my financial position totally, they were aware that I wouldn't be able to pay any more than this.

 

So, is it the situation that to the court I admit a part debt, or, as i still haven't received the information and the invoice breakdowns etc, that I defend the entire claim? It would make sense in my opinion to admit to teh £500, which I have always offered to pay, to the courts.

 

Also, out of note, the company ISNT closed down and is still showing on companies house, so the accountancy firm havent even done what they are over charging for?

[Still_surviving]

Can I ask what kind of accountants this firm were? Are they Licensed Insolvency Practitioners? Rather naughty to be offering those kind of services if they arent.

 

As an accountant myself, I have seen some unscrupulous firms try it on with directors when they know their fees arent going to be covered. In my opinion however it would be highly unusual for any accountant to undertake £4500 of work for an insolvent company without any guarantee of getting paid.

 

Ive seen many a director agree to pay fees personally becauise they simply wouldnt get the service otherwise. Ive also seen people try to wriggle out of guarantees once the work is completed (no offence intended to you).

 

Might I also suggest that you ask for detailed time costing records in respect of the invoices. They should at least be able to tell you who worked on your case, for how long and at what hourly rate.

[citizenB]

Your submission date is 6th July isn't it ?

 

You will need to contact the opposition to get that package sent out again.