Marston bailiff, claiming to be the police, forced entry on son debt.

[Sunsetgary]

Hi, I need some help please, this is quite involved but I will start at the beginning.

 

On Tuesday 20th at 06-50 I awoke to see someone outside on my drive fiddling with my car,

I got up and went outside to find it clamped and faced by a very aggressive bailiff from Marston Group in respect of a debt for my son,

who does not live at our address and for whom I cannot recall seeing any previous communication or correspondence in respect of this matter.

 

He advised that he had a distress warrant and openly acknowledged that althoughI was not the named person

(as he knew that the Date of Birth of my son, (he is21 whereas I am 50 !)

I advised him my son was not and did not live here and he stated he did not care as the debt £445.00 was registered to this address

and therefore he was going take the car placing a sticker on the window.

I advised that this was not going to happen, nor would I let him into the houseand that I would call the police as the car belonged to me

and I could provide proof of ownership (V5 and purchase receipt in my name).

 

I went back into the house and copied the two documents went back outside but he would not talk to me,

advising that he had called the police and would get them to sort this out.

I also called the police but they refused to attend as this was not a civil matter.

Nothing occurred for the next 2 and ½ hours

i then had to go out,

going outside my car still clamped,

I went to talk to him in his car and advised him that I needed to go out.

Fortunately we have use of two vehicles,

he manoeuvred his car to block my exit but when I reversed he did actually move his car.

I returned home later in the day to find that the clamp had been removed from my car and a Final notice letter addressed to my son placed through the letterbox.

See Copy)

 

I was clearly concerned

I wrote to Marston group and sent a letter by recorded delivery that evening.

 

Yesterday morning Saturday 06-55 I am woken by the doorbell ringing, hard knocking on the door and a female shouting through the letterbox that it is the police,

I (foolishly) opened the door and was immediately pushed passed by what I thought was a police officer (due to her comments and dress),

only to see behind her the male bailiff from the previous visit.

I immediately slammed the door preventing him entering

and then blocked the passage of the female in order to prevent her from entering any further into my house other than the entrance hall.

I advised her that she was trespassing and had fraudulently misrepresented herself and that I was calling the police,

to advise them of a break in which I did, s

he stated that she did not care and that I had

‘Invited her in and she was an enforcemen toffice from Marston Group here to collect a debt on behalf of my son and she had a distress warrant.

 

She refused to talk with me until the police arrived,

but rang her colleague on the doorstep to advise of her situation which was perfectly safe as we had both accepted that the police would sort this matter out,

two patrol cars, bluelights flashing, with four officers arrive and one asks me to move away and come and talk to him in the kitchen,

I detail what had occurred, he then goes and speaks with her and returns to say this is a civil matter and apparently according to her

‘I pulled her into the house’ therefore she had obtained peaceful entry therefore she could go about her business and enforce the distress warrant.

 

Based on the above,

my wife and I were faced with no choice other than topay the £445.00,

which we did by debit card,

advising and witnessed by the police that we were paying under duress and that for which we accepted no responsibilityfor the debt.

 

So, to summarise my position, at no time has my son been present, thebailiff forced entry into my property.

 

I should point out that I am unemployed and on Jobseekers allowance,

therefore I really cannot afford to pay this money and need advice as to what action I can take in order to recover this money.

[Bazooka Boo]

IMO, go to your local police station and ask to speak with the duty inspector, make a formal complaint and state the fact that she claimed to be a police officer (a serious criminal offence) and assaulted you by pushing past you to gain illegal entry to your property.

 

Then make a forma complaint about this corrupt companies actions to your local MP, BBC Watchdog, and http://www.advicenow.org.uk/advicenow-guides/consumer-and-money-problems/dealing-with-bailiffs/how-to-complain-about-bailiffs-html,622,FP.html

 

They are acting way out of their jurisdiction here and have acted in a criminal manner, they need shutting down.

[brassnecked]

Not another Marstons debacle. They have acted unlawfully, as they were given evidence you are not the debtor, the debtor is non resident, i would say demanding money with menaces and Fraud.

 

What sort of debt was it magistrates court?

 

Best ones for this would be wonkeydonkey and ploddertom, along with advice on criminality from oldbill. At the least send a complaint to the OFT regarding Marston's Credit fitness, and your MP

 

I will PM them now

 

Above all don't worry, I feel you will be due a refund and the bailiff had better start looking for another job imho.

[Bazooka Boo]

Get that payment refunded using the chargeback scheme http://whatconsumer.co.uk/visa-debit-chargeback/

 

Just tell the bank that the money was taken unlawfully and fraudulently, the bank WILL refund you the money, they are often unaware of the chargeback scheme so you might have to explain it too them.

[brassnecked]

Agree with BazookaBoo, try the chargeback, and insist the police give you a crime number, I have sent a PM to oldbill and wonkeydonkey, as oldbill has been helping a couple of other Caggers with these people from marstons, as at the least their clamping, and behaviour along with the threats, and intimidation are Fraud, demanding Money With menaces, and as to the early morning call, impersonation of a police officer, all are arrestable offences.

Edited November 25, 2012 by ims21

[ploddertom]

I foresee a few problems over this regarding the Bailiff's entry to your home, I accept what happened what was totally unlawful but the problem is proving it - as you have already found out. On top of this they would then probably use the excuse of being able to force entry as it is a Magistrate's Court Fine, even though they had no Order permitting this.

 

Entry by a Bailiff has to be by permission, Khazanchi v Faircharm Investments, and even after this providing no levy had commenced then if asked to leave they must, otherwise they are committing a trespass. Looking at the sums involved I have to assume the original fine outstanding would have been £115, the other £300 being made of the Bailiffs fees. I agree with the others about trying for a chargeback on the card, the Bailiff clearly knows you were not the debtor but will probably insist you made a voluntary payment.

 

What paperwork were you left? First thing tomorrow morning I would be on to the Court concerned creating havoc. If you have the Bailiffs names have you checked to see if they were even Certificated? This seems to have been a tried & tested method they have used so wonder how many times they have used it in the past.

[Bazooka Boo]

I fail to see any problem proving the unlawful trespass and criminal activity of this outfit.

 

The fact is, that someone claimed to be a police officer, a criminal offence, then when the OP opened the door, said female forced entry, again illegal, they had NO legal authority to do so, no court order and were acting fraudulently and criminally.

 

Go straight to your local police station, file a report get a crime number and then deal with whoever has advised these yo collect on this debt.

 

They have acted in a fraudulent and criminal manner, this needs addressing, inform your local MP, the media & press and BBC Watchdog, as well as your local trading standards the OFT and the link I posted above http://www.advicenow.org.uk/advicenow-guides/consumer-and-money-problems/dealing-with-bailiffs/how-to-complain-about-bailiffs-html,622,FP.html

[brassnecked]

Oldbill is dealing with a Marstons female bailiff who has form for this sort of thing along with Cry Wolf so Op is lucky bailiff didn't try to assume victimhood and claim OP assaulted her. Definitely give the court manager a tongue lashing in the morning.

[dx100uk]

OB alerted

 

dx

[lamma]

Where has the OP stated that it is a Magistrate's fine ? Ad do they know that a PCN isn't such ?.

[Sunsetgary]

Thanks for responses - A lot to think about.

 

The Distress Warrant was issued for failure to identify a driver back in 07/2010, the paperwork I was given is dated 10th October 2012.

 

Can I ask :

 

1) If I make a complaint to the police, will they take me seriously ? I say this as Four Officers were present at in my house.

 

2) In respect of complaining to the court, I rang and tried to speak with them following the first visit last week and they refused to talk to me as I am not my son and did not have his consent.

 

thanks in advance

[brassnecked]

OB alerted

 

dx

Thanks DX I also alerted him when the thread came up.

 

It is most worrying how these Marstons bailiffs are acting ultra vires, as if enforcing debt entitles them to disregard everything and collect at an address regardless of whether the debtor lives there or not

including assault on debtor or innocent third party, then doing a cry wolf accusing debtor or third party assaulting them, ro claim victimhood by lying to police among some of their tactics,

 

Time the company was closed down, as it appears to have inherited all the worse practices of the late unlamented Drakes.

[Asbestross]

2) In respect of complaining to the court, I rang and tried to speak with them following the first visit last week and they refused to talk to me as I am not my son and did not have his consent

 

The previous occasion was slightly different as no 'unlawful' enforcement activity had been conducted at the time.

 

Phone them back up, and specifically ask discuss with the court manager one of their bailiff's impersonation of a police officer, to gain unlawful access to a premises in which the debtor has never resided. Explain everything word for word, they will probably ask you to put your complaint in writing.

 

This kind of behaviour is outrageous at best, and having suffered a similar incident quite a few years ago I can fully sympathise.

 

Keep your chin up, they were completely in the wrong, and if you follow this through they will be brought to justice (so to speak)

[brassnecked]

"1) If I make a complaint to the police, will they take me seriously ? I say this as Four Officers were present at in my house.

 

2) In respect of complaining to the court, I rang and tried to speak with them following the first visit last week and they refused to talk to me as I am not my son and did not have his consent.

thanks in advance"

 

1: lodge a complaint with the local police office, then copy the complaint to the Chief Constable AND your MP copied to the Ministry Of Justice, if you check oldbill's threads the address is in one of them, marked as a Formal Complaint into the officers behaviour and support of the bailiff who was ultra vires her authority, when after the first visit it was made clear the debtor was non resident at the address the bailiff had.

 

2 Regarding the court a Formal Complaint marked also as a Letter Before Action to the Court Manager, stating that as the debtor is non resident, the bailiff knew this after the first visit, you are demanding a refund of all the charges and the fine,. as you are not the debtor, and you will be taking action in the Small Claims Court citing Marstons, AND XXX Magistrates Court as defendants if the matter is not resolved and the monies refunded within 14 days. Also indicate you are complaining to Chief Constable, MOJ and your MP regarding the unlawful actions of their agent the Marstons bailiff for whom they are wholly liable. And further that as you are a third party to the debt, hiding behind data protection once the bailiff had revealed all the details to you is not an option as the bailiff fraudulently with the active connivance of the police forced you to pay a debt that is not yours.

 

This may well focus their minds that something is not right here, and actually the bailiff is a criminal in this case

 

Others will be along soon, and hopefully oldbill will look in soon, as he will be able to advise how to focus the police's attention and address the muppetry and criminal action of their officers.

[tomtubby]

I have not seen this query before and will have a good read in a few moments. Have you received a response back from Marston Group to your complaint?

 

Before commenting on the behaviour of the bailiff, it is almost certainly the case that police officers have very little understanding of bailiff law. At the very least, the police officers must have requested a copy of the Distress Warrant and this would have clearly shown that the debtor was your son.

[Sunsetgary]

Tomtubby,

 

I have not yet complained to Marston Group, i wanted to get all of my facts established first.

 

With regard to the police, no the Distress Warrant was not requested or shown to them.

 

thanks for your interest

[tomtubby]

There can be no doubt at all that AT THE VERY LEAST the police officers should have satisfied themselves of the legal basis for a bailiff demanding payment from YOU. This is simply dreadful. I have sent you a PM.

[brassnecked]

There can be no doubt at all that AT THE VERY LEAST the police officers should have satisfied themselves of the legal basis for a bailiff demanding payment from YOU. This is simply dreadful. I have sent you a PM.

 

It looks like Marstons are out of control TT, they have tipped over into criminality themselves IMHO This situation is appalling, forcing a third party to pay the debt under duress.

BN

[unclebulgaria67]

There should be a health warning on some of these threads. As I read them I can feel my blood pressure increasing !

 

Complaint needs to be made to the Police about the behaviour of the bailiffs.

 

Definitely do the chargeback to get the bank to refund the amount, as it was done under duress.

[brassnecked]

There should be a health warning on some of these threads. As I read them I can feel my blood pressure increasing !

 

Complaint needs to be made to the Police about the behaviour of the bailiffs.

 

Definitely do the chargeback to get the bank to refund the amount, as it was done under duress.

 

Op must do that at the very least, also a complaint to OFT regarding Marston's Credit Fitness, will be a good thing also.

[BankFodder]

This is a serious complaint. I hope that you will have raised the matter with a senior person at Marstons and I hope that you will keep us appraised of developments.

 

Marstons were intending to implement a system of body-worn-video cameras - http://www.marstongroup.co.uk/news/marston-trials-new-video-badge-technology.html

 

It seems that they may have dropped the idea. A shame because it would have shown a lead to the industry and made these kinds of complaint a thing of the past.

It is a great shame. The technology is there. It would all be so easy and so effective. One has to conclude that if body cameras aren't carried then there must be a reason for it - and that reason probably isn't very nice.

I expect that there was a lot of resistance from the bailiffs themselves and so the industry generally doesn't have the bottle to face up to the people on the ground and grasp the integrity-nettle.

If the bailiff industry wants to improve its culture and its reputation, it will have to take some kind of action - but maybe the money is simply too important.

 

It is only a matter of time that there is another bailiff whistleblower TV programme. Last time it was Rossendales in the frame ....

[brassnecked]

@ Bankfodder, i would advocate a debtor filming the bailiff, you don't need their permission to film them no matter what fairytales they spout about data protection and permissions. This is especially important when dealing with Marstons, after several assaults on debtors, then a cry wolf to deflect blane to the victim by marstons bailiffs. if it is on your premises, even better if you have a cctv camera attached to a recording device triggered by someone entering the gate.

[citizenB]

It looks like Marstons are out of control TT, they have tipped over into criminality themselves IMHO This situation is appalling, forcing a third party to pay the debt under duress.

BN

 

Sheesh, they really are out of control arent they ? What bothers me is the response by the Police..

 

 

 

There should be a health warning on some of these threads. As I read them I can feel my blood pressure increasing !

 

Complaint needs to be made to the Police about the behaviour of the bailiffs.

 

Definitely do the chargeback to get the bank to refund the amount, as it was done under duress.

 

Absolutely - the police really need some training in this area of law.

[tomtubby]

There can be no doubt that bailiffs will be unpopular and complaints will always be made but, my concern for a very long time has been with the role undetaken by police officers.

 

I can fully appreciate that the police cannot be expected to have knowledge of bailiff law but surely, at the very least, they should ask to see a copy of the Distress Warrant.

 

In this particular case, the police knew that the person who was paying the debt was NOT the debtor... he was not making a "voluntary" payment and furthermore, the police should have known of the requirments of the Data Protection Act. This debt was against the young son. He was NOT at the property and therefore, as he was over 18 years of age, the police should NOT have even been discussing the matter and neither should the bailiff.

 

The warrant is NOT and I repeat....NOT against an address. It is against the INDIVIDUAL person named on the Distress Warrant.

 

Of serious concern, is the fact that without speaking to the debtor neither the police or bailiff would have been able to ascertain whether the son even knew about this debt.

[brassnecked]

Exactly TT Op could report the bailiff and police for DPA breaches, and should do so, along with complaint to Chief Constable regarding the unlawful behaviour of his officers aiding and abetting an unlawful extraction of money from a third party for someone elses debt under duress.