Halifax Loan/Bryan Carter arguing not statute barred.***Discontinued***

[minicpi]

I want to know who registered the default in 2008 and all the info about that default. The only info I have at the moment is the 2010 update placed on file by Arrow so they must have the details. I am unsure of what and how to ask.

[minicpi]

Hi again. To update I rang Arrow Global directly and spoke to someone in their Legal Team. They tell me that they always bring defended cases back in house which is why Bryan Carter is no longer involved. I asked about the CPR 31.14 request I had sent and she said that they had not received anything from Halifax but would deal with it as soon as they had.

 

Since then we have received and N149 Allocation Questionnaire to be returned by this Friday to our local County Court. In the "Other Information" box which asks for "information I consider will help the judge to manage or clarify the claim" what should I enter?

 

To update on my requests - Part 18 request made on 6th March asking for when and how payment made - Replied giving date and amount but said they have no more records but this does not effect the claim.

 

CPR 31.14 Request on 6th March. Replied on 9th saying does not apply as will be small claim nevertheless they have requested info andwill revert shortly. We have heard nothing since.

 

DSAR request made to Halifax on 16th March, no response as yet but I spoke with them today and they are hoping to have it out this week.

 

So, what should I enter in the "Other Information" box on the Allocation Questionnaire?

[AndyOrch]

I would suggest :-

 

The Defendant contends that the Claimant's claim so issued is a claim in contract and is statute barred pursuant to the provisions of section 5 of the Limitation Act 1980. If, which is denied, the claimant contends that the Defendant is in breach of the alleged contract, in excess of 6 years have elapsed since the date on which any cause of action for breach accrued for the benefit of the Claimant.

The claimant should already be aware more than 6 years have elapsed between cause of action accrued and the court claim by their court submission.

Regards

Andy

 

 

[minicpi]

Hi Andy, thanks for that. Should I mention the lack of response to the CPR 31.14 ref the disputed payment? Your suggestion seems to be restating the defence, will he not already have that?

[AndyOrch]

There is nothing further to plead if its Statute Barred then its out of time thats the law.CPR not required.

AQ is viewed before the defence so lets reiterate it

[minicpi]

I was looking for some way to get them to prove the payment they say was made in 2009 and to draw it to the Judges attention but if you think it is not needed I will go with your suggestion. Thanks again for the invaluable support.

[AndyOrch]

Burden of proof is upon the Claimant if they have proof you did make payment rest assured they will be made to disclose.

 

Andy

[minicpi]

Brilliant, thanks Andy. I will off course update on how things progress.

[AndyOrch]

You must be assertive here Mini as much as the claimant is within their P.o.C; even fully aware of the status.Give a DJ doubt by requesting disclosure to be sure of none payment , can only give rise and cast doubt that the Claimant must be correct otherwise they would not of issued the claim.... get my point?

 

Andy

[minicpi]

I do. its like showing a bit of weakness and self doubt which could backfire.

[citizenB]

To update on my requests - Part 18 request made on 6th March asking for when and how payment made - Replied giving date and amount but said they have no more records but this does not effect the claim.

 

 

Well yes it does actually, if the payment was not and could not have been made by you - then it affects the claim.. silly b*ggers.

 

Was it a payment you recognised, was it a date that perhaps you couldnt possibly have made that payment.. say because you had an appointment somewhere or were on holiday.

 

It seems odd that anyone would make a payment pretty much in the middle of a statute barred period.. then no more.. dont you think ?

[minicpi]

It was the most random amount and date you can imagine. We have got all of our bank and credit card statements together for that date and no payment was made. Maybe they will say we paid cash or milk tokens to a bloke in the street. I am looking forward to getting the DSAR from Halifax to see what is says about it or if it even mentions it. I am intriqued to find out if they have made a mistake or if they or Arrow Global are just lying.

 

Just to thicken the plot a little I have had a letter from a different company demanding payment on a different HBOS loan, again Statute Barred. Have I popped up on an idiot list somewhere

[citizenB]

The fact is that you can almost certainly prove that you DIDNT make the payment...

 

mistake or misleading.. they are the ones in the hot seat

[minicpi]

An aside adn on a different debt from the same period - I love this site and what you can learn here. The confidence it gives you is brilliant. As evidence I had a call this afternoon at work (how they got this number baffles me)

 

Caller - May I speak to minicpi please?

Me - Thats me, how may I help?

Caller - I am from some company or other and we may have an account of yours here. May I ask some security questions.

Me - I gave date of birth etc

Caller - I am ringing about an account you have with HBOS. The balance is £7400 and I would like to help you make arrangements to pay this off.

Me - I have no knowledge of any debt to anyone. What is it for?

Caller - A credit card

Me - When was the account opened?

Caller - 14/05/2001

Me - Nope, no nothing about that. Is it in default?

Caller - Yes

Me - What is the default date?

Caller - 23/12/2004

Me - So, although I don't know about the debt and don't acknowedge any debt, it is Statute Barred!

Caller - erm, yes. Just let me check what I should do about it. (2 minutes of silence)

Caller - This file is Statute Barred and I will amend our records.

Me - You bought a pup, didnt you?

Caller - erm, we don't buy debt, we just have files to deal with. Thanks for your time. Bye

 

Hopefully they will now vanish.

 

CAG, thank you

[AndyOrch]

Knowledge is power.

 

Andy

[minicpi]

We have just received the DSAR paperwork from Halifax and I have had a quick scan through. On the list of transactions for the account there are 5 transactions within 15 days which all look internal to me. Does anyone have any ideas? The usual branch number for all previous transactions was 660, the last being made in May 2005. The last 5 are Branch 1505.

The appear on the list as -

Branch C/S Date Reference As date Notation Amount Debt Remarks

660 28/5/05 MRB/121 IDX 10.02CR 321.72

1505 13/7/09 73 MIBX 170.00CR 151.72 Matched K

1505 13/7/09 73 INT2 151.72 303.44

1505 27/7/09 62 13/7/09 MIBXX 170.00 473.44 Matched K

1505 28/7/09 62 MISX 473.44CR NIL

1505 28/7/09 62 REP NIL NIL

 

Can anyone with some experience explain the above to me. The one thing which jumps out is that why would they sell a debt on the 28th (I assume that is what heppened), if I had made a payment on the 13th?

[AndyOrch]

Internal gobbledygook Mini the debt is SB

 

Andy

[minicpi]

Brilliant, I thought as much. Thanks Andy.

[citizenB]

Is there not a list of their codes within the SAR ?

 

 

Those payments are too close together to be payments made by you.. they were probably internal adjustments made by HBoS prior to the sale.. When was it assigned ?

[minicpi]

Hi CB. Having had a bit more time to study the info the payment on the 13th of July 2009 which they earler stated was the reason this is not SB was actually HBOS writing off interest due. According to other paperwork they passed it to be written off in April 2009 and July 2009. The debt was sold on 23rd July 2010. (I think, this paperwork takes some deciphering )

[citizenB]

Hi CB. Having had a bit more time to study the info the payment on the 13th of July 2009 which they earler stated was the reason this is not SB was actually HBOS writing off interest due. According to other paperwork they passed it to be written off in April 2009 and July 2009. The debt was sold on 23rd July 2010. (I think, this paperwork takes some deciphering )

 

Well done for sticking with it.. yes they dont make it easy for us to decipher. It looks like you have resolved the mystery.. and your assertion of it being SB'd is accurate.

 

 

The only other thing I can suggest you do is to telephone HBoS and ask on what date was the last payment made to the account ? You dont have to tell them why you are asking.. and dont get drawn into any other issues.

[minicpi]

Update -

 

As the court case got closer I decided to contact the Legal Department at Arrow Global directly. I got through to the Senior Solicitor dealing with the case and asked them what they intended to do. I was worried about how the conversation would go but to be honest they were very helpful and told me everything they had and even emailed me over copies. The statement they had been given by Hbos only showed the last payment and did not show the internal moving around they had done. They said that they would need further clarification from Hbos and would get in touch with them. They also asked if we could send our copies over and agreed to use them if Hbos were not forthcoming.

 

Over the next few weeks we had several conversations, each time Hbos didn't supply them with what they needed ie proof that we had made a payment. As the date got closer for the hearing Arrow said that they agreed that it was Statute Barred and decided to discontinue. They also agreed to remove the Default from my wifes Credit History.

 

I do not know if it would work for everyone but speaking to them directly worked well for me. I am confident on the phone and I made sure that I knew what I was saying before I called (thanks CAG). It also meant that we did not have to go to Court.

 

I am now debating wether to send them a Bill for my time and expenses. Will they pay up?

[AndyOrch]

" Over the next few weeks we had several conversations, each time Hbos didn't supply them with what they needed ie proof that we had made a payment. As the date got closer for the hearing Arrow said that they agreed that it was statute barredand decided to discontinue. They also agreed to remove the Default from my wifes Credit History.

 

I do not know if it would work for everyone but speaking to them directly worked well for me. I am confident on the phone and I made sure that I knew what I was saying before I called (thanks CAG). It also meant that we did not have to go to Court.

 

I am now debating wether to send them a Bill for my time and expenses. Will they pay up? "

 

Excellent Mini well done, have you received the NoD?

Technically you can only claims wasted costs on fast track (above 5K) I cant recall which track this was.

 

I have amended your thread title to reflect your result.

 

Again well done and I am delighted that this has been resolved for you.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[minicpi]

Hi Andy,

We got the NoD within a week from the Court. Have to say I was amazed how friendly and helpful the Arrow Legal team were although if this would have been the case if I had not been so sure and well informed I don't know.

 

Definately a massive thank you to all of you here on CAG, the support was superb.

[citizenB]

Well done mnicpi.

 

I agree, if a person feels confident they can keep things on track and are absolutely certain of their facts, then telephoning and speaking to someone direct can usually obtain results.

 

I am really pleased that it has worked.