Huddle Utilities PAPLOC Now Claimform - Shared Student Accommodation Util resellers - Elec/Gas debt

[Myth_007]

hi guys,

Do update on status on what happened, me and my roommates are going through something similar and this is helpful information to understand.

[honeybee13]

Hello Myth, welcome to CAG.

You may or may not get a reply to your question from the OP.

As no two problems are ever the same, please also start a new thread of your own so we can advise you.

Best, HB

[Myth_007]

Hi all, Bit of a long read but any advice would be appreciated. Thanks

Background : 

From September 2022 to June 2023, my friend "A" and I shared a house in the UK with eight other people. We relied on Huddle Utilities for gas and electricity, with each of us paying around £45 per month to "X", our lead tenant, who managed the bills.

However, in November 2022, "X" and three others moved out, leaving three new tenants we didn't know. Despite this change, we continued making our payments as usual to "X" replacement tenant,"Y" who handled payments on behalf of the house.

Furthermore, Huddle changed the account number a few months after the lead tenant  "X" left and backdated bills with the new account number for the same months, creating confusion with two sets of bills for each month. Additionally, they called me when my tenancy was about to end and asked if I wanted to be the lead tenant, to which I declined since I was leaving.

Later, I found out I was "randomly" chosen, and when I reiterated that I didn't want to be named on bills or be the lead tenant, they said it didn't matter as everyone was liable. They also failed to inform us that we had the option to choose a split liability package when new tenants joined, as this was unfamiliar to us.

After moving out a couple of months later, Huddle Utilities contacted us, claiming we owed money as we had used more gas and electricity than our estimated  with a total balance pending of £2215.

Regarding this, I and five friends /tenants (total 6 people paid )paid roughly £221.5 each, stating that we were not responsible for others' debts. However, Huddle insisted it was a joint liability and wouldn't split the bill until the entire amount was cleared. We even tried contacting other tenants to pay up their part but did not receive any response.

Fearing consequences as international students and receiving court action warnings while not understanding the legal landscape, we paid the remaining amount owed of roughly £130 pounds each between 5 people and covered for others to stop receiving these emails. We then received confirmation by email that our balance was cleared, and the account was closed.

To our surprise, we later received court action notices, despite believing the matter was settled. When we questioned Huddle, they admitted an error in their system, acknowledging that one month's bill had not been tallied, and demanded an additional £1079.58.

Additionally, Huddle on multiple occasions has confirmed different amounts, asserting each time that it's the correct one.

Even the MoneyClaim they sent is for £1012.5, whereas the last email regarding the balance indicated £1079.58. It seems they are arbitrarily changing numbers, adding to the confusion and inconsistency of their claims.

What's more, only "A" and I were targeted with money claims, out of all ten tenants.

This feels unfair, as we never agreed to be jointly liable for others' payments.

We technically never even had a contract as the lead tenant "X" was making payments on behalf of the house and we paid him.

We seek advice as we have only 14 days to reply to this claim.

[Myth_007]

Thanks for the advice honeybeen and Dx .

I have made my own thread regarding our situation as International students and our current situation with huddle.

As me and my friends are international students

, any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks

[BankFodder]

You had better start off by posting up a copy of the claim form in PDF format

Also sent utilities company a subject access request. Do it now. One for each one of you. If there was some identity verification then send them a copy of your claim form

 

And also, where you giving the metre readings each month? Or is it always an estimated amount? If they were always estimated why didn't you give any proper readings?
Do you have a record of the closing readings for when you left? Do you have any records of any of the metre readings over the months?

Also you said that you are international students. Are you in the UK now or have you left?

Also, please can you break down the story into a simple chronology. We want a bullet pointed chronology. One line each – the date, what happened, date, what happened et cetera.

[dx100uk]

please complete this:

dx

[Myth_007]

Unfortunately,

we did not provide monthly meter readings and relied on estimated amounts from Huddle Utilities.

This was because we were unfamiliar with the process, having recently arrived in the country.

Yes, we are still in the UK but at a different address. 

I will also send the subject access request tomorrow.

MoneyClaim huddle.pdf

[dx100uk]

Fill out the sticky please 

You send a cpr request not an sar. No need for one

Dx

[Myth_007]

Name of the Claimant ? Huddle Utilities LTD

How many defendant's  joint or self ? 2 Me and another roommate.

Date of issue –  12 FEB

What is the claim for – 

 

1. Huddle Utilities Ltd are claiming £1012.58 from (my name) and (another roommates name) for unpaid gas and electricity bill at XXX for the period of 01/01/2023 to 30/06/2023.

2. Despite sending invoices and payment reminders and attempting to contact the customer through letters, email and phone calls, we are yet to receive sufficient payment to clear the areas and believe legal action is the necessary next step to resolve this "

What is the total value of the claim? 1012.58

Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? Received a 30 day court action warning
 

Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? Yes
 

Did you inform the claimant of your change of address? No – They somehow found new address of all 10 tenants, im guessing because we changed address with our banks. Still is this legal and how is it possible?

Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? – Utility company
 

When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? No
 

Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? No , technically it was under a lead tenant and we were responsible of making payments to him but I understand that utilities may fall under deemed contract?

Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Not sure. I don’t think so.
 

Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Original Creditor 

Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? No, After moving out I found suddenly I was made the “lead tenant” without being notified and that the bills were in my name

Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? Not that I am aware of
 

Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? No
 

Why did you cease payments? I made my parts of the payments. Huddle mentioned everyone is responsible till the whole debt is cleared.
 

What was the date of your last payment? 20 Oct 2023 , where 5 of us tenants made the last payment to cover for others and huddle confirmed that the balance was cleared, and account was closed. Later they reopened it because of “billing error”
 

Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? Yes
 

Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? We mentioned the burden it is to cover for others as international students and were provided payment plans, we refused as we made our part of the payments.

 

Chronology to make it simpler : 

• September 2022: Moved into shared house with 9 others.
• November 2022: Lead tenant and three others moved out; 4 new tenants moved in.
• Months following: Continued making payments to new lead tenant for utilities which we later found was using the same log in details from the old lead tenant and did not change his name out of the huddles system.
• June 2023 : Contract ended, and all 10 tenants moved out.
• July 2023: Received email regarding objection to switch energy supplier. This is where I found they made a new account number months after the lead tenant left and put my name on it as the lead tenant. After multiple calls and email they refused to take my name out and said the whole balance needs to be cleared and does not matter who the lead tenant was as everyone's is equally liable.
• 26 July 2023 : Received the final bill after contract being ended for 02/02/2023 to 30/06/2023. 
• July 2023 : Me and 5 others paid nearly 220 pounds each and paid “our share” of the total bill. Over multiple emails and calls explaining we have paid our part they still said we will be liable until the whole debit is cleared.
• 5 Oct 2023: Received 30 days court action.
• Oct 19 2023: In previously emails Huddle misquoted different figures to different roommates. Fearing court action as international students, me and same 5 others paid an extra 130 pounds roughly to settle the balance and clear it. After that huddle gave confirmation that accounts closed.
• December 2023 : Received 7 day court action waring . After asked that the balance was cleared they explained , the made an error where the bill for Jan 2023 was not calculated.
• Current: Only me and another roommate who have paid our part and more are being targeted in the MoneyClaim instead of 4 others who just ignored huddles emails and did not pay anything after moving out for the remainder of the balance.

[dx100uk]

read this thread:

complete what you have not already done below.

pop up on the MCOL website detailed on the claimform.
[if mcol is not working return after the w/end or the next day if week time]
.
 register as an individual on the Gov't Gateway Site
Go to HMRC's login page.
Click the GREEN sign in button.
Click “Create sign in details”
Enter your email address where asked.
You will now be emailed a confirmation code. ...
You will now be issued with a User ID for your government gateway account.
 note down your details inc the long gateway number given, you might need it later.
 then log in to the MCOL Website
.
 select respond to a claim and select the start AOS box.
.
 then using the details required from the claimform
.
 defend all
 leave jurisdiction unticked
 you DO NOT file a defence at this time
[BUT you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 ]
click thru to the end
confirm and exit MCOL.
..
.
get a CPR  31:14  request running to the solicitors [if one is not listed send to the claimant]

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/332546-legal-cpr-3114-request-request-for-information-when-a-claim-has-been-issued/

 type your name ONLY
Do Not sign anything
.do not ever use or give an email
.
you DO NOT await the return of ANY paperwork 
you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 from the date on the claimform [1 in the count]

..............

 

 

[Myth_007]

For the CPR 31:14 request i was thinking of sending these has the main 3 points : Do I need to add or remove anything?

1)A copy of the signed agreement between the claimant and the defendant to supply said services. This includes any contracts, agreements, or terms and conditions that establish the basis of the alleged contractual relationship between the Defendants and Huddle Utilities.

2)Copies of all bills/invoices in the defendant’s name that they claim are outstanding to the claimant. Please provide copies of all invoices or bills relating to the disputed amount claimed in the MoneyClaim, including any relevant itemizations of charges or services provided. Additionally, please include any bills that were backdated or duplicated due to changes in account numbers during the tenancy period from 01/09/2022 to 30/06/2023.

3)Detailed statements of said accounts of how the claimant has calculated the sum claimed. We request detailed statements or breakdowns of the accounts in question, outlining how the Claimant has calculated the sum claimed. This should include explanations of any charges, adjustments, or calculations made by the Claimant.

[dx100uk]

send as is

dx

 

[Myth_007]

This is the most recent email I got from them when I said they should put the claim on tenants who have not paid their part.

Should i reply saying i was never the lead tenant and putting my name on the bill after i moved out does not make me the lead tenant? or just ignore their emails. For reference:

"Thanks for your response.

As you were in a shared accommodation during this period, it is responsibility of all tenants to arrange between themselves payment towards the account. We have attempted to contact each customer for payments but it is now the responsibility of yourselves to finalise payment for the outstanding balance on the account. Please reference the link I have provided from citizens advice and in particular the segment on tenants not paying their share:

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/consumer/energy/energy-supply/problems-with-your-energy-bill/check-if-youre-responsible-for-paying-an-energy-bill/

We can see that you and other tenants have made payments throughout this tenancy but we are unsure how much each tenant contributed towards this and whether other tenants were making payments to yourself to cover their shares as you were the lead tenant on the account.

I'd also like to reference your tenancy agreement under tenant obligations section 8: "To pay or be liable to pay for all utilities during the tenancy dates. If you have a bills package with a separate company, payments must be paid directly to them."

We highly encourage you now to contact the other tenants and arrange payment for the outstanding balance and for this we're going to place your account on hold for two weeks.

If you have anymore questions or queries, don't hesitate to get back in touch."
 

[dx100uk]

how have they got your email.???

send one further email in reply 

simply stating that Email is NO Longer to be used for anything to do with our mutual court claim. number xxxx

dx

[dx100uk]

can you please now scan up to ONE MULTIPAGE PDF all comms , everything (bar the claimform/CPR) in or out from day one please. in date order.

please read our upload guide carefully

[Myth_007]

Hi, This may be a long read but I've added most relevant email comms by huddle in a pdf. 

I've color-coded it to make it simpler to read.Huddle email Correspondence.pdf

[dx100uk]

is that everything?

dx

[Myth_007]

Hi dx, Yes that’s most of it. I’m guessing they were sending post regarding the same to the previous address but I have no access to those.

[dx100uk]

You've gotta get out of the notion your daughter is not liable, she is and that it is not illegal for them to demand she pays the sum. at best if there were something 'wrong' it would be deemed unlawful, as debt is not a criminal matter in the uk , but a civil one hence the county court claim.

the only thing that is not acceptable are extra fixed sum penalty charges for late/missed payment etc and charges for debt agent visits, letters/phonecalls etcb. only actual usage/standing charges  can be claimed for the period she was resident.

keep a close eye and total those up as you are not liable for them and they should  be removed from any total you might have to pay IF you lose.

its a shame you entered into an extended bout of email tennis with them which in all cases is utterly pointless.

the important things here are what huddle produce in reply to your CPR ( if they do they dont have too) and what is contained in their witness statement latter on if the claim gets that far.

billing wise, what you hold to date is immaterial as such, but do redact the bills and scan them up .

you will notice in the court Q&A sticky you were asked to type out the particulars of claim verbatim, but appear to have only typed out an abridged brief of them. we need to full poc please

 

 

[Myth_007]

My daughter?

Dx i think you may have mixed up my thread with someone else's.

Yes I have sent out CPR request via post.

POC " Huddle Utilities Ltd are claiming £1012.58 from (my name) and (another roommates name) for unpaid gas and electricity bill at XXX for the period of 01/01/2023 to 30/06/2023.

Despite sending invoices and payment reminders and attempting to contact the customer through letters, email and phone calls, we are yet to receive sufficient payment to clear the areas and believe legal action is the necessary next step to resolve this "

I have already uploaded POC above for your reference.

[dx100uk]

yea sorry i had that other huddle thread open too.

were you resident for the whole of the time period stated in the POC?

 

[Myth_007]

Yes I was, along with 9 other individuals. Actually we were residents at the address even before than stated in the poc.

[dx100uk]

forget the others, they can go after you sadly, 

dont miss your defence filing date no matter what happens.

post it up here well in advance for checking.

dx

[dx100uk]

claim struck out

dx

 

[Myth_007]

I read, thats great! .

I will start preparing my defence soon.

Edited March 3 by dx100uk
unnecessary previous post quote removed