Ingeus

[Mr.P]

It's a lecture that is supposedly so important that I must be patronised into attending

 

Is it just for one hour, or god forbid, a whole day ?

 

Just pray that it isn't a "death by powerpoint" sentence, and if you are correctly mandated to attend, use the opportunity to "spread the word".... If, on the other hand, it is one of those NLP sessions, record it, challenge every statement, and question the qualifications of the Snake Oil Salesman in charge - But please be careful not to get thrown out for "misconduct" as that could lead to a sanction.

[Chester6]

Is it just for one hour, or god forbid, a whole day ?

 

Just pray that it isn't a "death by powerpoint" sentence, and if you are correctly mandated to attend, use the opportunity to "spread the word".... If, on the other hand, it is one of those NLP sessions, record it, challenge every statement, and question the qualifications of the Snake Oil Salesman in charge - But please be careful not to get thrown out for "misconduct" as that could lead to a sanction.

 

Probably an hour? Hope so

Get more paper to recycle - oh what fun!!!!!!

I am good at behaving but the lectures never reveal anything useful and if they are so helpful then the adviser should tell you so you can act upon the info sooner, the tutor is the lowest of the low as far as I am concerned but he fakes it with people like he's a friend

[Mr.P]

An hour isn't too bad - Just make sure travel expenses are refunded in full and upfront without any strings attached, then make him work for his money.

[jasta11]

As per posting just above, read para.34 (if you're a JSA participant) of www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/wp-pg-chapter-3a-22-october-2012.pdf - Without the correct wording, the email does not constitute a valid mandation in my opinion. But I would advise caution as a DWP DM may disagree and you'd then have to go through the appeal process.

 

Certainly worth admonishing the "adviser" for sloppy email etiquette and failure to follow correct procedures

 

Edit: reading through Chapter 3a again, it states that "a MAN can be as simple as a letter". No where does it state that email or telephone calls are acceptable alternatives. Maybe another reason to take a wet kipper with you on the 13th.

 

Too right! Show the WP people this lovely extract from the aforementioned guidance and smile smugly as you do it, for you are in the right

 

 

Method of sending the MAN

 

1. 
   
2. 38. The MAN must be either handed directly or posted to the participant. If it is posted it is deemed to have been received on the second working day after posting (see above).
   
3. 39. It is not acceptable to use electronic methods, such as text or email, to send the MANs to participants. However, it is acceptable to communicate electronically with participants to remind them of mandatory (or non mandatory) activities.
   

Also any activity must be 'reasonable in the participants circumstances' - which to me means 'Don't drag people into your office to do stuff they can do perfectly well at home'. It isn't reasonable.

 

On the subject of 'should I use Ingeus' own complaints procedure?'. Er...no, basically. I never trust a company to investigate itself. (If you were bitten by a vampire there's no use complaining to Count Dracula). Neither complain to the JC, who are powerless. Complain to senior DWP, DWP Training Contracts dept, your local MP and the media.

 

 

 

Vive La Revolution!

Edited May 2, 2013 by honeybee13
Pejorative word removed.

[Chester6]

An hour isn't too bad - Just make sure travel expenses are refunded in full and upfront without any strings attached, then make him work for his money.

Dunno if it' an hour - I think they are normally about a hour and a half plus it was due to this stupid ***** I had my money taken by them

Edited May 2, 2013 by honeybee13
Accusation removed.

[Mr.P]

The MAN must be either handed directly or posted to the participant. If it is posted it is deemed to have been received on the second working day after posting (see above).

 

Damn. Has the DWP not updated that particular section... Built in to this guidance note is a path to automatic FTA sanction. Post a MAN on the Monday for an activity on the Thursday AM, stick a second class stamp on it. Royal Mail T&C gives a three to seven day window for delivery of 2nd class mail (1st class is one to three days). Postie delivers said letter on Thursday just after lunch.

 

Chester6: You really need to get those complaints sent off to the DWP. The sooner you can get collective butts kicked and your travel expenses refunded, the better you will feel. Brooding about it will only get you down.

[jasta11]

Yes, that had occurred to me too - using 'delayed post' tactics, but I'm sure everyone - including the DWP - knows that post can arrive in the afternoons these days and I'd argue that it's up to the WP to take this into consideration when sending letters. This is in an ideal and logical world, of course! I suppose the post office could confirm the time of delivery if it came to the push - though how many forms you'd need to fill in to get that info, who knows.

 

The DWP rules as they stand could still be interpreted to mean that any letters have to arrive in a 'timely fashion'...again, assuming logic prevails.

 

Might do no harm to remind the drones that in any event of a letter arriving late you'll happily report them.

Edited June 30, 2013 by citizenB

[speedfreek]

Damn. Has the DWP not updated that particular section... Built in to this guidance note is a path to automatic FTA sanction. Post a MAN on the Monday for an activity on the Thursday AM, stick a second class stamp on it. Royal Mail T&C gives a three to seven day window for delivery of 2nd class mail (1st class is one to three days). Postie delivers said letter on Thursday just after lunch.

 

Chester6: You really need to get those complaints sent off to the DWP. The sooner you can get collective butts kicked and your travel expenses refunded, the better you will feel. Brooding about it will only get you down.

 

There's different rules for 1st n 2nd class mail and assumed receipt.

 

There's even the rule that where evidence of postage is not recorded then 2nd class is assumed in all cases.

 

There will also be the actual envelope that will be stamped or franked as 2nd class.

 

So your above example is complete scare mongering [naughty word] tbf

[Jmulv]

My advisor asked me to email him a CV,

 

I haven't had an ingeus appt in months cause they forgot about me but seems it's swung back round and they want a piece of me.

 

I sent him C.V's before when doing rewrites of my CV and such. But now down line I don't really want them having that kind of stuff to potentially send to employers on my behalf. Thinking about it now down the line.

 

I havn't signed any of their documents they presented me with only gave them misc details about my benefit / name etc.

 

I knew not to sign anything and instead of challenging advisor I just brushed it off and he forgot about it.

 

What should I do? I've not really kicked up any fuss and always very intelligently remained diplomatic just avoiding stuff I didn't want to do. I just don't want my C.V sent around forcing me into some duff job that I don't want. I may email him and pretend it didn't send and just keep using aversion tactics.

[Chester6]

My advisor asked me to email him a CV,

 

I haven't had an ingeus appt in months cause they forgot about me but seems it's swung back round and they want a piece of me.

 

I sent him C.V's before when doing rewrites of my CV and such. But now down line I don't really want them having that kind of stuff to potentially send to employers on my behalf. Thinking about it now down the line.

 

I havn't signed any of their documents they presented me with only gave them misc details about my benefit / name etc.

 

I knew not to sign anything and instead of challenging advisor I just brushed it off and he forgot about it.

 

What should I do? I've not really kicked up any fuss and always very intelligently remained diplomatic just avoiding stuff I didn't want to do. I just don't want my C.V sent around forcing me into some duff job that I don't want. I may email him and pretend it didn't send and just keep using aversion tactics.

 

Tell them they already have it so you don't see a need to resend it

they lost it

[Jmulv]

To be fair I don't really care about them having my CV if they want to discuss it look over it....... HOWEVER, sending it to crappy jobs to force me into something I don't want to do? well nah I don't want that happening...

[Chester6]

Remove your consent

[Jmulv]

Remove your consent

 

I didn't consent anyway. I think they asked u to sign form for that don't they? I didn't sign anything

[Bakatcha]

I didn't consent anyway. I think they asked u to sign form for that don't they? I didn't sign anything

 

Excellent! This means that they shouldn't be sending your CV out. But just to cover yourself refuse to give them a soft version of your CV (you don't have to). I have shown them my CV (paper format) but refused to let them photocopy it or keep it. In this way I prove that I have a CV thus avoiding unnecessary hassle. The CV I show them has no phone numbers or e-mail address. If they want to contact me they can send a letter. So far I have had no argument about this (or none that I haven't won!).

[Jmulv]

Excellent! This means that they shouldn't be sending your CV out. But just to cover yourself refuse to give them a soft version of your CV (you don't have to). I have shown them my CV (paper format) but refused to let them photocopy it or keep it. In this way I prove that I have a CV thus avoiding unnecessary hassle. The CV I show them has no phone numbers or e-mail address. If they want to contact me they can send a letter. So far I have had no argument about this (or none that I haven't won!).

 

Thanks for advice,

 

Also anyone know how part time work effects your benefits? I'd like to ideally earn JSA at 71 pound a week and not claim JSA and thus not have to attend ingeus anymore (I don't trust them with CV's and the like). I'm sure I could easily find some part time work it's full time that's problem, but loads of part time around and unskilled / easy to do. I just don't want to be worse off if I work part time.

 

Anyone got any info?

[antone]

Thanks for advice,

 

Also anyone know how part time work effects your benefits? I'd like to ideally earn JSA at 71 pound a week and not claim JSA and thus not have to attend ingeus anymore (I don't trust them with CV's and the like). I'm sure I could easily find some part time work it's full time that's problem, but loads of part time around and unskilled / easy to do. I just don't want to be worse off if I work part time.

 

Anyone got any info?

 

I'm assuming you're single, in which case part time work affects your benefits like this:

 

• You can't work more than 16 hours per week and still claim JSA
  
• The first £5 per week of your earnings will be ignored
  
• The rest will be deducted pound for pound from your JSA
  
• You would declare any earnings on the appropriate form when you go to sign on
  
• The amount taken into account is averaged over 5 weeks or 3 months, depending on how you are paid
  
• You would still be required to participate in the Work Programme
  
• You might still be entitled to HB or CTB
  

[Jmulv]

I'm assuming you're single, in which case part time work affects your benefits like this:

 

• You can't work more than 16 hours per week and still claim JSA
  
• The first £5 per week of your earnings will be ignored
  
• The rest will be deducted pound for pound from your JSA
  
• You would declare any earnings on the appropriate form when you go to sign on
  
• The amount taken into account is averaged over 5 weeks or 3 months, depending on how you are paid
  
• You would still be required to participate in the Work Programme
  
• You might still be entitled to HB or CTB
  

 

If I can earn my keep in terms of JSA and still claim HB / CTB then I'd rather least do something and feed myself from doing it than continue a gap on my C.V I'm tired of ingeus and living in fear of being sanctioned due to their idiocy (see earlier in thread not sending me letters about appts). Reason I ask is because a friend may able to find me some work part time that'd pay between 70-80 week which is basically JSA so If I earn that I can surely sign off and still claim HB?

 

To me it's better than nothing.

[antone]

If I can earn my keep in terms of JSA and still claim HB / CTB then I'd rather least do something and feed myself from doing it than continue a gap on my C.V I'm tired of ingeus and living in fear of being sanctioned due to their idiocy (see earlier in thread not sending me letters about appts). Reason I ask is because a friend may able to find me some work part time that'd pay between 70-80 week which is basically JSA so If I earn that I can surely sign off and still claim HB?

 

To me it's better than nothing.

 

Yes, you can do that - you can sign off JSA and still claim HB/CTB. You'd need to make the claim direct with your council, and they will likely want to see wage slips and so on. That would remove you from the WP.

[dyfed]

But just to cover yourself refuse to give them a soft version of your CV (you don't have to). I have shown them my CV (paper format) but refused to let them photocopy it or keep it. In this way I prove that I have a CV thus avoiding unnecessary hassle. The CV I show them has no phone numbers or e-mail address. If they want to contact me they can send a letter. So far I have had no argument about this (or none that I haven't won!).

 

If you hand over your cv for them to look at what is stopping them just taking it to the photocopier and taking copies?

Do you keep hold of your CV?

Also I have never done a CV so would more than likely be sent on a CV course and I bet they would try and take a copy whilst on the course plus get you to upload it onto UJmash.

[Jmulv]

Yes, you can do that - you can sign off JSA and still claim HB/CTB. You'd need to make the claim direct with your council, and they will likely want to see wage slips and so on. That would remove you from the WP.

 

I checked entitleto.co.uk and typed in all the info it seems I could earn up to 80 a week without it cutting into HB/CTB, if I earn more they just remove HB proportional the extra amount you earn. So basically if I'm needed to do extra hours seems I can do them that week and just tell council I earnt more that week and they pay me less that week I guess in HB. It's pain to sort out but I'd rather do it than continue to live in fear of starving to death. Had enough of the WP now.

[scousereject]

My advisor rang me last week and asked me to come tomorrow to do jobsearches at Ingeus. I did not receive a letter in writing telling me to come with the time etc but he told me over the phone last week, he said I will get an automated text the day before to remind me.

 

Suppose I 'forgot' about the interview and did not go, could I be in any trouble?

[Jmulv]

My advisor rang me last week and asked me to come tomorrow to do jobsearches at Ingeus. I did not receive a letter in writing telling me to come with the time etc but he told me over the phone last week, he said I will get an automated text the day before to remind me.

 

Suppose I 'forgot' about the interview and did not go, could I be in any trouble?

 

Wouldn't risk it,

 

They can just sanction you and say to JSA you didn't turn up and they told you too. It's so easy for them to do.

[antone]

My advisor rang me last week and asked me to come tomorrow to do jobsearches at Ingeus. I did not receive a letter in writing telling me to come with the time etc but he told me over the phone last week, he said I will get an automated text the day before to remind me.

 

Suppose I 'forgot' about the interview and did not go, could I be in any trouble?

 

If you didn't receive a MAN (Mandatory Activity Notification) through the post or handed to you in person then you can treat the appointment as voluntary. If you don't attend and a doubt is raised against your claim, point out that no MAN was issued.

 

Whether you want the hassle, though, is a different question.

[Jmulv]

If you didn't receive a MAN (Mandatory Activity Notification) through the post or handed to you in person then you can treat the appointment as voluntary. If you don't attend and a doubt is raised against your claim, point out that no MAN was issued.

 

Whether you want the hassle, though, is a different question.

 

I had this issue,

 

They were sending letters to my old address I think, what do you think would have happened to me if I continued to ignore them? (they used to phone leave voicemails i'd never phone back not sure if he forgot to make appts and actually sent letters). I didn't go to ingeus for 7 months roughly it seems JSA didn't give ingeus my new address and they said they aren't allowed to update it on their system only JSA can send them something to do so. Reason I phoned them today is this time I think he did actually make me an Appt and then phoned me on day saying I had missed it which he never did in past so I was like oh crapp I better sort it now and ring them back.

 

I thought if they leave voicemail on your phone etc. or anything like that means they've made you an appointment and if you miss it you are in for a sanction? Only reason I phoned them today because I was worried of a sanction but they have my old address on their system still so I was worried that they would say oh well we sent a letter but you didn't attend boom sanction.

[Chester6]

At a4e I lost touch because they abandoned me at a useless placement then I moved and after a month or something I ended up phoning them

 

A4e couldn't find their arse with a map as far as I was concerned