Ingeus

[atum2013]

Sorry i wasnt clear enough, the complaint was made to the JCP as an employee of the WP provider the complainent is attached too had made the claim re £250 per head. As far as I am aware JCP are not incentivised in this manner. They have targets and if they miss them then they are placed on 'performance improvement plans'. I cant imagine the DWP agreeing a bonus payout scheme in the same manner as is common in commercial recruitment sector!

[Charlotte_Henderson]

Sorry i wasnt clear enough, the complaint was made to the JCP as an employee of the WP provider the complainent is attached too had made the claim re £250 per head. As far as I am aware JCP are not incentivised in this manner. They have targets and if they miss them then they are placed on 'performance improvement plans'. I cant imagine the DWP agreeing a bonus payout scheme in the same manner as is common in commercial recruitment sector!

 

This doesn't surprise me, i dont know why they should get a bonus just for doing there job right.

they especially shouldn't get one when its us that finds the job not them.

Edited August 6, 2013 by Charlotte_Henderson

[joeski]

can you get sanctioned for not telling ingeus or a sub provider about interviews etc..i been speaking to prospective employers on the phone and arranging things but not telling the WP about it as i don't want them taking credit for my hard work job searching

[atum2013]

This doesn't surprise me, i dont know why they should get a bonus just for doing there job right.

they especially shouldn't get one when its us that finds the job not them.

 

Absolutely

[jasta11]

can you get sanctioned for not telling ingeus or a sub provider about interviews etc..i been speaking to prospective employers on the phone and arranging things but not telling the WP about it as i don't want them taking credit for my hard work job searching

 

No, you can't be sanctioned for not telling them, as they're jobs you've found yourself. If you did tell the WP about them they'd immediately start pressing you for details to claim payments if you did get the job.

 

The JC can't do anything either as they only have power over vacancies they found for you and told you to officially apply for - these are 'notified vacancies'.

 

If they're your own jobs, tell nobody nothing - and good luck, hope you get something soon.

[Hitchawk]

Dear Admins, Could we please have a stickied thread/forum where people like me can easily access for tips and advice when dealing with Ingeus please? I too, have horror stories, but also have some helpful advice for people new to the whole experience: knowing them in advance would have saved me a whole lot of worry. I.E., where to look up the legislation, where to download template letters, your rights as a person regarding Freedom of Information, the tricks Ingeus will try, ect

[Mr.P]

can you get sanctioned for not telling ingeus or a sub provider about interviews etc..

 

I wouldn't put it past them to threaten such a course of action, but can you imagine the derision that such an act is likely to produce should it end up on a DM's desk ???

 

The press would also have a field day with that one - Unemployed man sanctioned for attending a job interview

[Mr.P]

Dear Admins, Could we please have a stickied thread/forum where people like me can easily access for tips and advice when dealing with Ingeus please?

 

Devious tricks and horror stories are not just the domain of Ingeus - They are just as bad as the rest of the Welfare to Work providers promising a magical fix to get everyone in to work and failing miserably.

[citizenB]

Dear Admins, Could we please have a stickied thread/forum where people like me can easily access for tips and advice when dealing with Ingeus please? I too, have horror stories, but also have some helpful advice for people new to the whole experience: knowing them in advance would have saved me a whole lot of worry. I.E., where to look up the legislation, where to download template letters, your rights as a person regarding Freedom of Information, the tricks Ingeus will try, ect

 

Could you point to specific posts that could be copied into a stikky ?

[Mr.P]

Could you point to specific posts that could be copied into a stikky ?

 

Some of the posts to http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?390024-Mandate-by-WP-provider-Guidance-notes would be candidates.

[Chester6]

My local onefirst mentioned placements and said its best if you findthem yourself, a adviser said similar

 

Both didn't mention they get paid for each person forced to labour in this manner

[atum2013]

If they dont ask dont tell,sanctions are raised on non compliance grounds or sometimes on a 'raising a doubt' grounds (they would do this one if they had reason to suspect you were working but were denying it)Iif they know of something and it gets you in work you will be hounded for the details so they can claim the outcome....regardless of it was all your own work or not. WP providers are supposed to maintain contact with you when you go into work as well...these contacts get logged on the system as part of your record...so expect continued attempts to get hold of you once you go into work-its in their contract to do this-although in practice this seems patchy. They will contact employer to confirm details of your job and again 6 months later to enable them to continue getting monies from you being in work. Exact contact points to employer can vary as it can be different for different PG ratings( everyone going into WP gets assigned a payment group rating..PG1, PG6 etc etc and yes some ratings are 'worth more' than others to the provider in cold hard cash terms)

Some employers are starting to get pretty annoyed with the constant calls....if you havent given your permission for them to contact your employer then they should not do so. Some employers have started asking for these contacts to be made in email form. A common wording for the reply to these emails seems to have begun surfacing.....'replying to this request in good faith and confidentiality' etc etc with the original request email contained within.

[Mr Happy77]

I've just received letter with my next appointment but it seems to be lacking the term 'This is a mandotary appointment' and also missing the sanctions bit.

 

Am I right in thinknig that this isn't an appointment I must attend?

[Mr.P]

Without the correct "mandatory appointment", the letter is just an invite. You have the choice to ignore it or treat it as a free ride in to town if you desire.

 

Be warned though - They may try to raise a Failure to Attend sanction, but without the correct (and complete) wording, it would be simple enough to appeal.

[Mr Happy77]

Without the correct "mandatory appointment", the letter is just an invite. You have the choice to ignore it or treat it as a free ride in to town if you desire.

 

Be warned though - They may try to raise a Failure to Attend sanction, but without the correct (and complete) wording, it would be simple enough to appeal.

 

So it would be advisable for me to phone them less than 48 hrs before to let them know I will not be attending because it is not a mandatory appointment.

 

Peculiar because I received a letter for another appointment 2 weeks later which is the usual format including the 'mandatory' statement and the sanction threats.

[Mr.P]

So it would be advisable for me to phone them less than 48 hrs before to let them know I will not be attending because it is not a mandatory appointment.

 

I wouldn't say anything about the missing mandation text - Wouldn't want them to know too much about their own business... I'd go with a short letter simply saying "Kindly reschedule your appointment on for another date at a convenient time as I have other matters to attend to on the day in question".

[atum2013]

I've just received letter with my next appointment but it seems to be lacking the term 'This is a mandotary appointment' and also missing the sanctions bit.

 

Am I right in thinknig that this isn't an appointment I must attend?

 

Interesting that you received the letter without the correct wording. Ingeus computer system generates the letters from pre-store definitions. Who ever generated the letter may have selected the wrong type of letter from their pre-set list. The name of the person who generated the letter is the one on the last page of the letter (it wouldnt necessarily be the name of the person you are booked to see). Someone making a mistake in WP. Whatever next.

[signmaker]

Hi all,

Still having trouble with A4Greed, can anyone find this note that my wife has been sent, in the WP guidance, I have looked and can't find any mention regarding carers, and have been threatened by DNCC/A4E, that failure to speak to the advisor when he calls WILL put her benefit at risk.

These are quotes from the e-mail, bear in mind she is now claiming carers allowance and has been for the last 3 months.

8 months would have been remaining on the WP if she was still claiming JSA.

 

"DWP still consider you to be a claimant even though you have moved your claim to the Carers Allowance. This doesn’t mean you signed off."?????

"It is imperative that you speak with the advisor when he calls and discuss your current situation at the time of the call. Failure to do this will put your benefit at risk."

Head of Training

Derbyshire and Nottinghamshire Chamber of Commerce, who apparently work along side A4E.

Note from the DWP Work Programme Guidance:

Light Touch Customers

Even if a customer moves out of the Contract Package Area, Signs off benefits but is not working, moves to a different benefit, becomes a carer on carers allowance, they will remain attached to A4e Provision and therefore on your caseload.

These are not inactive customers and you have to maintain contact with the customer. This can be ‘light-touch support’ or “remote support” i.e. keep in touch review phone calls rather than face to face appointments.

Light touch support may be considered in the following customer circumstances: Claiming pension credits,

Customer has no live claim,

A Joint Claim – where the partners of a participant is automatically referred to Work Programme due to them having a joint claim

Full time education (university or college)

Army Pension

Carers Allowance

You are to note in communications the customer’s circumstances and then schedule a Review. This can be a telephone appointment rather than a face to face review.

To meet our Minimum Service Levels the customer’s Employment Plan should be reviewed every 4 weeks, however in some circumstances where the customer is considered for light-touch or remote support, this could be every less often for example every 12 weeks but you must consider the customer's circumstances in deciding the time between calls and document clearly in the Communication the reason for this.

It is important you schedule these appointments so that we do not loose contact with the customer as their circumstances may change in the future.

Or are they just coming a quick one to secure outcome payments?

This is now become a battle between them and us regarding "No contact by any means", which A4E and DNCC are totally ignoring.

just thought that I'd point out their deliberate mistakes:oops:

Edited August 9, 2013 by signmaker
Personal abuse removed.

[Mr Happy77]

Interesting that you received the letter without the correct wording. Ingeus computer system generates the letters from pre-store definitions. Who ever generated the letter may have selected the wrong type of letter from their pre-set list. The name of the person who generated the letter is the one on the last page of the letter (it wouldnt necessarily be the name of the person you are booked to see). Someone making a mistake in WP. Whatever next.

 

It had two dots, one underneath the other similar to when you put bullet points in Word. The name on the letter was my advisor. The 2nd letter was correctly formatted however.

[signmaker]

Hi moderators, since when has calling wp advisors pimps been personal abuse? if you think this is abuse you should read the rest of the comments that refer to wp advisors.

[ims21]

Hi moderators, since when has calling wp advisors pimps been personal abuse? if you think this is abuse you should read the rest of the comments that refer to wp advisors.

 

It has been decided that it is not an acceptable description to use on this forum and all such references will be edited.

[jasta11]

Interesting that you received the letter without the correct wording. Ingeus computer system generates the letters from pre-store definitions. Who ever generated the letter may have selected the wrong type of letter from their pre-set list. The name of the person who generated the letter is the one on the last page of the letter (it wouldnt necessarily be the name of the person you are booked to see). Someone making a mistake in WP. Whatever next.

 

My lazy Ingeus advisor tried to make verbal mandatory appointments, which I told her were not acceptable and not allowed anyway. Trying to be clever, she grabbed a compliments slip, turned it over and scrawled the appointment on the back in biro. 'There you go, it's now in writing and correct' she said nastily.

'Could you sign and date it as well please?' I said, which she did.

 

As I put it in my pocket I said 'By the way, as it doesn't give full details of the appointment and contains no required DWP wording on benefits it's still incorrect ..and you've just signed it' From then on, she made sure to give me correctly worded and formatted letters. (and I did send her hand-written one in as part of my complaint to the WP heads)

[osdset]

I would be inclined to let the WP 'pejoratives' carry on making errors, less appointments to attend until someone kicks them up the proverbial.

[citizenB]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?399454-Job-Centre-Terms

 

Have any of the participants on this thread heard of the term "Rainbow Client" as used by a Job Centre advisor to a claimant/client. If so, could they please advise Daisy on the thread linked above.

[dyfed]

It has been decided that it is not an acceptable description to use on this forum and all such references will be edited.

 

Its a collective term. Its just an adjective. If you ban this word then why not ban every derogatory word on here.

I think the word desribes them well myself seeing as they send us off doing horrible things and they get money from it.