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    • Northmonk forget what I said about your Notice to Hirer being the best I have seen . Though it  still may be  it is not good enough to comply with PoFA. Before looking at the NTH, we can look at the original Notice to Keeper. That is not compliant. First the period of parking as sated on their PCN is not actually the period of parking but a misstatement  since it is only the arrival and departure times of your vehicle. The parking period  is exactly that -ie the time youwere actually parked in a parking spot.  If you have to drive around to find a place to park the act of driving means that you couldn't have been parked at the same time. Likewise when you left the parking place and drove to the exit that could not be describes as parking either. So the first fail is  failing to specify the parking period. Section9 [2][a] In S9[2][f] the Act states  (ii)the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver, the creditor will (if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met) have the right to recover from the keeper so much of that amount as remains unpaid; Your PCN fails to mention the words in parentheses despite Section 9 [2]starting by saying "The notice must—..." As the Notice to Keeper fails to comply with the Act,  it follows that the Notice to Hirer cannot be pursued as they couldn't get the NTH compliant. Even if the the NTH was adjudged  as not  being affected by the non compliance of the NTK, the Notice to Hirer is itself not compliant with the Act. Once again the PCN fails to get the parking period correct. That alone is enough to have the claim dismissed as the PCN fails to comply with PoFA. Second S14 [5] states " (5)The notice to Hirer must— (a)inform the hirer that by virtue of this paragraph any unpaid parking charges (being parking charges specified in the notice to keeper) may be recovered from the hirer; ON their NTH , NPE claim "The driver of the above vehicle is liable ........" when the driver is not liable at all, only the hirer is liable. The driver and the hirer may be different people, but with a NTH, only the hirer is liable so to demand the driver pay the charge  fails to comply with PoFA and so the NPE claim must fail. I seem to remember that you have confirmed you received a copy of the original PCN sent to  the Hire company plus copies of the contract you have with the Hire company and the agreement that you are responsible for breaches of the Law etc. If not then you can add those fails too.
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    • I understand what you mean. But consider that part of the problem, and the frustration of those trying to help, is the way that questions are asked without context and without straight facts. A lot of effort was wasted discussing as a consumer issue before it was mentioned that the property was BTL. I don't think we have your history with this property. Were you the freehold owner prior to this split? Did you buy the leasehold of one half? From a family member? How was that funded (earlier loan?). How long ago was it split? Have either of the leasehold halves changed hands since? I'm wondering if the split and the leashold/freehold arrangements were set up in a way that was OK when everyone was everyone was connected. But a way that makes the leasehold virtually unsaleable to an unrelated party.
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Debt collection hell, need advice & someone to talk to...


Peepo
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I recieved a letter today from Reliable Collections. I think it basically sais they will leave me alone, but tell me what you think?

 

'Thankyou for your letter, in relation to your request for a copy of the executed agreement under section 78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

Under regulation 3(2)(b) of the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices & Copies Of Documents) Regulations 1983 there is no requirement to provide a photocopy of the agreement bearing your clients signature, it is sufficient that we supply you a 'true copy' of the agreement setting out the terms & conditions to which your client has agreed.

A 'true copy' need not bear the debtors signature or, in our case, the date of the agreement. We are therefore enclosing a 'true copy' of th credit agreement sent out to you when you opened the account in June 2006.

 

The absence of an executed agreement will affect our ability to pursue this matter through the courts, but not our right to seek payment through normal collection methods, short of court proceedings.

 

If however, it is your descision not to make any further payments to the account on the basis that the signed credit agreement has not been provided, collections activity will cease.

 

We would like to make it clear to you that should he take the descision not to make any further payments to the account, his non-payment will be reported to the relevant credit reference agencies, which will remain for a period of 6 years.

We await hearing from you,

Reliable Collections.'

 

Does thios mean that they will be allowed to keep adding defaults to my record, even though they have no copy of the credit agreement?

Strange that they referred to me in the 3rd person in places.

Any advice gratefully accepted. I finally feel like I have some breathing space :)

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Yay !! Fantastic.... file it away forever !! :D

 

They shouldn't be adding defaults, no.... you might want to tackle this one after the festive period though. Let yourself enjoy the much-needed breathing space first.

 

Note how their letter is a bit "yeah but, no but" in places.... lol.

 

Well done !! ;)

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Looks like they're admitting they don't have a CCA but still threatening you with continuous collection hastle. Report them to Trading Standards, who I'm sure would love to see that letter :) Here's the link:

Trading Standards Central - Trading Standards and Consumer Protection information for the UK

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"We would like to make it clear to you that should he take the descision not to make any further payments to the account, his non-payment will be reported to the relevant credit reference agencies, which will remain for a period of 6 years.

We await hearing from you,

Reliable Collections.'"

 

Oh really? you think?

 

How very out of order!

 

This is defamation, as without a valid agreement they cant prove you owe anything legally and should therefore not report to CRA's

 

Once you have all the main stuff settled (all creditors taken care of) I'd be inclined to ask for them to stop the processing and give you a settlement for damages or face court action

 

Your first post really tugged my hearstrings and just further demonstrates what an absolute shower the credit industry are

 

You were one of the lucky ones in finding CAG, lors knows how many thousands are unaware of CAG and are at their wits end

 

Makes my blood boil

 

May I take the opportunity to wish you and your daughter a happy xmas and hope you look forward to a much happier new year now you have an army behind you!

omnia praesumuntur legitime facta donec probetur in contrarium

 

 

Please note: I am not a member of the legal profession, all advice given is purely my opinion, if in doubt consult a professional

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Yes, I noticed the letter contradicted itself in places. They also included in the letter print-outs of all the transactions on the account and wrote 'As a result of financial difficulties your payment rate was reduced to £20 every 28 days & all interest was suspended'.

They failed to include the fact that the payment rate was set by them, even after I told them countless times that I could not afford £5 per week, & they have been charging me £24 per month 'administration charges'.

Okie I will get in touch with trading standards.

 

All I have ever wanted is to pay these debts off without being kicked when I am down by people adding more & more fees ontop of what I owe.

Its the adding of these fees to an already seemingly unreachable goal that has made me feel like killing myself, it brings on a feeling of absolute despair when you pay off £4 in a month, only to have £15 charges added to the total. Coupled with the deep embarassment & wretchedness I feel for not being able to pay my way in life, it just ammounts to a feeling of complete worthlessness.

 

Ive worked out that the system in this country treats everyone like they are a loser that doesnt want to pay, without considering that maybe they want to pay but are unble to. And so punishes them asif they were a loser by adding charges & sending belittling letters.

 

I had someone from Littlewoods tell me on the phone once 'Well Im sorry but this is how our computer system works & we will keep adding charges until you clear your arrears' to which I replied 'Well life isnt a computer! This is real life here, with human beings & unforseen problems!'

 

Happy new year everyone, thanks for help & replies, hopefully 2008 will be a better year, I feel like I have regained a tiny ammount of strength :)

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If however, it is your descision not to make any further payments to the account on the basis that the signed credit agreement has not been provided, collections activity will cease.

 

What a load of bowlarks! Who creates this drivel?

 

Where do they get this stuff from? What are you meant to say?

If you think about it Peepo, they're talking nonsense, but they aim to scare us and they do.

If you replied to that paragraph alone - which you shouldn't - what would you be saying? Either "Yes I agree, you must cease collections activity or "No, you can carry on bullying if you want.. " Absurd! :mad:

 

In any case, what everyone's saying is spot on. You will get through all of this, and as time goes on you'll learn just how ridiculous many DCAs are.

 

If you have some spare time over the Christmas break, then reading up about assertiveness online might help. There's a free course that you can work through, that I find really helpful. DCAs seem to tap into every negative feeling, and assertiveness is a life skill that once you learn it, you never forget. It isn't anger, and takes you away from the feeling that people can just trample all over you - something the DCAs exploited - pre CAG! :)

We will not be intimidated.

'The pen is mightier than the sword'.

Petition to Outlaw Debt Sale and Purchase

- can't read/post much as eye strain's v.bad.

VIVA CAG!!! :)

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Hi Peepo.

 

Just wanted to say Merry Christmas. I hope all is well over this holiday time.

 

Best wishes ;)

I'm midway through the tunnel, but getting closer to the light.

 

 

 

Please be aware that i am not an expert in anything!

I may offer an opinion, but the final decision is yours.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Heyha, just a quick update. Although Reliable Collections sent me a letter saying they have no signed credit agreement, they are still sending me letters & adding charges.

If Im not going to be paying the money to them who am I going to be paying it to? Should I get in touch with the people the account was originally with & ask them how I can make repayments? Although there is no credit agreement, they do have statements & records that I bought items from them . Im assuming they could use this in court instead of a credit agreement?

 

None of the other companies have gotten back to me. Probobaly letters got caught in the Christmas mail & I will get 50 letters through door tomorrow.

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As there is NO CREDIT AGREEMENT they CANNOT enforce this debt through the courts. If they try they will be in big trouble. Take the letters from this company to the OFT and Trading Standards as Reliable are now in breach of a legal CCA request and are still demanding money they cannot substantiate by an agreement.

 

This is one debt you can forget for a while. Other people will be around to give more advice on this.

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  • 2 weeks later...

OK, that is one weight off my mind for the time being.

 

It would appear that in order to wriggle out of supplying me with a copy of signed credit agreement Littlewoods have passed my account onto a different agency. 'SDFS'

Should I send littlewoods the follow up letter telling them they failed to supply credit agreement within the specified timeframe & are now in breach of the law?

 

Its a never ending spiral of letters & worry :-|

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yeah.

 

If littlewoods have passed it to a new DCA, that means that they haven't got an enforceable credit agreement, so I would cross them off my list of people to worry about.

i will be off site for the next month or so. if you have any problems, feel free to report the post so a moderator can help you.

 

I am not a qualified or practicing lawyer.

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Peepo, don't worry about Littlewoods. I and many others have been in the same position. My acc. was passed to 2 DCAs but L'woods eventually took it back because i kept requesting the credit agreement.

 

I have had my SAR info since Nov. I was looking through it all this morning and it says the acc was going to be sent to Phoenix but had to be bought back because of CCA request and their lack of agreement!

 

I will deal with this eventually, but i will deal with more important matters 1st. Without the CA there is NOTHING they can do to me or you ;)

I'm midway through the tunnel, but getting closer to the light.

 

 

 

Please be aware that i am not an expert in anything!

I may offer an opinion, but the final decision is yours.

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  • 2 months later...

Do I take it you are still getting hassle Peepo? It is not good if these b*stards are making you feel like quitting your job. What has happened to make you feel so bad?

BANK CHARGES

Nat West Bus Acct £1750 reclaim - WON

 

LTSB Bus Acct £1650 charges w/o against o/s balance - WON

 

Halifax Pers Acct £1650 charges taken from benefits - WON

 

Others

 

GE Money sec loan - £1900 in charges - settlement agreed

GE Money sec loan - ERC of £2.5K valid for 15 years - on standby

FirstPlus - missold PPI of £20K for friends - WON

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I am going to citizens advice, and if they cant help me I am going to sign off sick & quit my job.

I really cant take any of this anymore.

 

 

Hi Peepo. I'm sorry to hear you sound so fed up. As GL has said,let us know what's happened so we can try to help.

I'm midway through the tunnel, but getting closer to the light.

 

 

 

Please be aware that i am not an expert in anything!

I may offer an opinion, but the final decision is yours.

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I am going to citizens advice, and if they cant help me I am going to sign off sick & quit my job.

I really cant take any of this anymore.

What's happening Peepo?

Have you spoken to anyone else about how you're feeling?

CAB sounds like a really good idea. xx

We will not be intimidated.

'The pen is mightier than the sword'.

Petition to Outlaw Debt Sale and Purchase

- can't read/post much as eye strain's v.bad.

VIVA CAG!!! :)

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  • 2 months later...

Hello, a quick update, as it happens my employer let me go a week after I made this post, so I am now unemployed & too ill to go back to work.

 

Being unemployed has gotten me no respite from the hounds, & now part of my rent money from the council is being witheld from me each month, meaning I have to find £80 per month towards my rent. They are witholding it beacuse of an overpayment mistake on their part 3 months ago when I was working. Ive told them I cannot live if I am expected to find £20 per week towards my rent, ontop of everything else, but they just tell me 'the government says this is enough for you to live on'.

 

The citizens advice are never available. I call, I leave messages, and still no help from them.

 

So, as the hounds snarl, the vultures circle, & this country kicks another one of its citizens into the dirt.

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Hi Peepo

 

Sorry to hear about your situation and how it is making you feel, I really know what you are going through, been there myself. But, please do not allow these RATS to keep you down, turn it round and be a fighter, rather than them making you a victim of their antics.

 

In time you will back on this as a winner by not allowing them to get to you. Keep your chin up and keep smiling :). It only takes a smile to make a dark day seem bright.

 

With the help on this site from the marvellous advice you will continue to get I am sure you will be in a much better position in the future.

 

Kal :)

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