walton v rbos

[paulwlton]

The "router" account below contains a phantom book debt - Mr Hemsley admitted that the "book debt" was an asset at the Commons meeting.

 

Edited February 18, 2010 by paulwlton

[The GodMother]

Sparkie and myself (and others) have been liaising with a whistleblower regarding RBSs behavior on the continent - I recently received an anonymous email advising me not to take this guy seriously.....Interesting.

 

Paul

 

 

Interesting who knew u were liasing with this guy.

[paulwlton]

Debbbsy, is the book debt showing in the "router" below (which is an RBS asset) correct?.

 

 

[debbbbsy]

Well, when you say accurate.

This was the "Book Debt" as of 1999, this is the figure that the RBS litigated on, & gained a CCJ for. The £300 are our monthly payments, Duncans CCJ was £56,187.08, & mine was £57,680.27. Despite the payments the "debt ledger" is increasing.

Debs

[DandD]

Paul

 

Here's the 'Router' stuff for 2007. Remember, they don't add post judgment interest (so they say!!) and we had been paying £300 per month from 1999 for 7 Years.

 

Strange that we have paid them over £25,000 and the debt has increased even though they don't apply PJI.

 

 

 

[DandD]

Paul

 

The RBS must like us.......we have many 'Router Accounts' that add up to lots of money that we don't owe but appear as assets for them.

 

It's going to take a few minutes to blank personal details but you may find it interesting

 

Back in a bit

 

Duncan

[DandD]

Here's one of our 'Router Accounts'.

 

I've removed our address and some other personal stuff, but our full names are OK, we are pretty much known and I want to leave the full Router Account number.

 

 

 

 

[paulwlton]

Paul

 

The RBS must like us.......we have many 'Router Accounts' that add up to lots of money that we don't owe but appear as assets for them.

 

It's going to take a few minutes to blank personal details but you may find it interesting

 

Back in a bit

 

Duncan

 

Senior RBS are aware that their "recovery" system was defective but have continued to present phantom assets to auditors..... is this not a criminal offense?

[humbleman]

Senior RBS are aware that their "recovery" system was defective but have continued to present phantom assets to auditors..... is this not a criminal offense?

 

after the bailout in 2008, they know that they are indispensable, they can pretty much get away with anything. It's such a shame.

[dad]

Senior RBS are aware that their "recovery" system was defective but have continued to present phantom assets to auditors

 

So some interesting questions for the audit committee of the board and the auditors to answer.

[paulwlton]

after the bailout in 2008, they know that they are indispensable, they can pretty much get away with anything. It's such a shame.

 

I have to agree.

[Sparkie1723]

A book debt can NEVER be the same as the total indebtedness...that is how they are creating the false assetts.

 

The book debt is what a borrower has borrowed ....if you borrow £10.000.

 

That is your book debt.

 

Your Total indebtedness is the Book debt plus interest and other charges.

 

What the RBS are doing is turning the interest and charges ( i.e created money) adding these to the book debt into a total book debt....making the "assett" appear bigger than it is..... false accounting and fraud ......the total indebtedness does not become an assett until its fully paid....only the Book debt remains constant.

 

Clever aren't they???? or thought thy were.... but now they have been rumbled.

 

sparkie

[patrickq1]

after the bailout in 2008, they know that they are indispensable, they can pretty much get away with anything. It's such a shame.

they are only gettin away with it because alister darling has given them the all clear to bury the debts ? he knows about it and should be called to the house to explain his part in this massive fraud and for his trying to hoodwink the goverment as well as the select committee,looks like fodder for GEORGE OSBURN to demand MRmove over ,come to the commons this will kick up the biggest stink we have seen in years .brown must have knowledge of it this is why no one is answering any questions....

ue finance ministers is also a good bet,ive decided MORE E MAILS LOL

[caro]

Can I suggest that you contact the Future of Banking Commission. Perhaps they'd like a copy of Sparkie's DVD.

 

http://www.which.co.uk/banking/howitwillwork

There's a bit more about it here.

 

 

What Termi hasn't mentioned here, is that she and I attended the Big Banking Debate in London on 4th and what a night!!

 

I had hoped to have posted a full report by now, but suffice to say it was like a breath of fresh air. MPs from the 3 major parties all gave the same message, that the behaviour of the banks is not acceptable and that they wanted to hear what bank customers have to say, including what ideas they have to resolve the problems. They specifically targeted charges and irresponsible lending, as well as bonuses. We sat at tables of about 10 people with a facilitator from Which? at each table to chair discussions on a number of topics and see what were the main 2 points that came from each of them which were fed back to the room (about 250 people attended in total).

 

Among our group, more seemed concerned about the interest on their investments than charges, although by chance a Trustee of Which? was among our group, and she was very well aware of the charges issue and was interested to hear about CAG and what we do.

 

There were 3 topics:-

 

1. Experience and Perceptions of the Banks

 

2. Problems with the Banks

 

3. Solutions

 

The MPs came down from the platform as groups discussed the topics and David Davis MP joined our group for a while.

 

A common theme seemed to be how impersonal the banks are now, no managers, no direct contact by phone, and that they are more interested in selling. We reached a conclusion that they are too big now, and there's no real competition. Profits are more important than people, and they just do what they like, without any effective regulation.

 

As we talked, I realised that profit was the real problem, and our charges are not only paying bonuses to bankers, but profits to share holders. I've decided to close my bank accounts and just use a building society which works for the benefit of its members, ie it's account holders and let the banks rot.

 

David Davis admitted he'd had banked with RBS for 40 years, but really people should move banks if they aren't happy with them, and it's true. While we stay with the banks they have no incentive to improve their ways or be truly competitive to give customers a good deal and a good service.

 

There was also a concensus that regulation needed tightening up, and that the FOS and FSA were failing as they too are bankers. One idea, which I thought was brilliant was, to have some kind of panel which included customer representatives.

 

The whole event was filmed and it should be appearing on the Which? website. We were also asked to hand in notes that we had takent so that they could be put before the Commissioners. I made sure I made some salient points and provided the CAG website address, along with a suggestion that if the Commissioners want to see what dire effects the banks have on people's lives, they should look on CAG.

 

At the end of the event we had a glass of wine, and Termi and I were joined by the facilitator from our group, who is also a Which? editor. She asked if we would like to be included on future focus groups and discussions on the future of banking, an opportunity we both jumped at, and provided our names, addresses and contact details. I really hope something comes of it, and I have to say, I think it will. I don't think it will be quick, and I don't think it will be easy, but I got a real feel that there is a desire to see things change.

 

Speaking for myself, I left the event feeling very optimistic

[paulwlton]

Sparkie, Why don't you email our mate Hemsley the letter to Darling.

 

I'm under strict instruction not to wind em up.

 

PW

[Sparkie1723]

Sparkie, Why don't you email our mate Hemsley the letter to Darling.

 

I'm under strict instruction not to wind em up.

 

PW

 

Hiya Matey

 

Your wish is my command;):D of course I will add a couple of points of my own:smile:

 

I sent John Mc Fall this e-mail last week....got an automatice reply to it so I know they received it.

 

Dear Mr Mcfall,

 

I hear that Chief Executive of the RBS will be attending a meeting of the Parliamentary Treasury Select Committee in the near future.

 

Is it possible that you could ask questions to him direct regarding the content of the two letters attached, which have been sent to the FSA and the FOS respectively.

 

One letter has been sent by me to the FOS the other is a joint one with Mr Paul Walton to the FSA

 

The content of these two letters will be explanatory enough for you to formulate some questions to put to Mr Hester, we have been attempting to obtain answers from the RBS top management and Mr Hester to no avail.

It may be possible for you to obtain them ...BUT I doubt it very much.

 

It is possible Mr Hester will have personally heard of both of us.

 

Thank you

Yours sincerely

 

sparkie

[andrew1]

 

I'm under strict instruction not to wind em up.

 

PW

 

As if ????

[Sparkie1723]

Have just sent Mr Hester another E-mail and given him a link to this thread ....with Pauls permission of course ......and added a few notes for him to consider...I have attached a copy of the letter from the treasury to the Chancellor ....just in case he doesn't know about it

 

sparkie

[patrickq1]

o he will know of it sparky he has people watchin his back

the chancellor has a lot of questions to answer to he has already become part of a cover up of the TELFORDGATE FILES this is a cause for the serious fraud squad yet they have not implemented any action, it wont go away i am writing letters as we speak and asking what where and why is nothing happening such as investigation

[Sparkie1723]

I will remind peeps of what I showed on my DVD with regard to my " Router Account". and the falsely created EXTRA Book Debt and how it was done...

 

.I had an alleged original " Book Debt" of £171.57 after 15 months had reached an alleged total debt of £645....this was made up of the alleged Original book debt plus £474 of charges...RBS then created another " book debt" for these charges...............which cannot be a book debt............a book debt is only the initial fixed sum borrowed.

 

In Pauls case his Router account "BOOK DEBT" was made up of the total indebtedness which RBS confirm(ed) are Assetts..........but they are falsly created and fraudulently presented assetts.

 

Beacuse they are " Internal accounts" in Telford alone..... no one outside RBS Telford knew of their existance......they have come to light by errors made by the RBS..............there must be 10's maybe 100's of thousands of these Router Accounts but only 3 or 4 of us have discovered they exist.

 

In Pauls court case RBS stated that his Router account documents were sent to him in "error".

In my court case they were with held from my SDAR but presented in the RBS defence bundle....because Courts never give an LIP a chance RBS got away with it all

 

RBS conceal them from account holders who have them at Telford

 

sparkie

[lookinforinfo]

Paul, Sparkie, Patrick et al I think you should all bear one important thing in mind. You are talking about a possible fraud involving a large bank and some of its senior management and perhaps Directors too. This Country is in the middle of a huge financial crisis thanks mainly to the actions of certain banks so the last thing the Government needs is for this to come out as well. It could set RBS into freefall and bring down other banks into the bargain and make our financial institutions the laughing stock in World affairs.

You only have to look at how probably a far bigger scandal involving HBOS

was handled back in 2008 where amounts of losses there amounted anywhere between £250 million and £1 billion depending on which report you read. Very few heads rolled, no prosecutions and one of the overseers of it all now is head of the FSA. You will note the comment that since he has been in charge, the FSA appear to have stopped levying fines on HBOS.

Ian Fraser - Business and Financial Journalist Ian Fraser Blog Archive HBOS: When did the rot set in? And were shareholders asleep at the wheel?

[Sparkie1723]

lookinforinfo,

 

Are you saying that we should go away ...having suffered monetarily mental distress aggravation at the hands of the RBS.......if RBS had compensated us for this a long time ago instaed of abusing its position of monetary power ...again which they never had in the first place....should all others also the ones who have had their homes posseded on the basis of these router accounts

 

 

I made the PM. aware of what had gone way back in August 2007 ...if the Govt and authorities has acted then RBS would not be in such a bad position as it is now and nor would the Govt...........sorry mate I do not agree what we shoud consider.....no -one considered us.

 

 

I must log off now or I will get angry and the sie team do not like me when I get angry :D ....ONly joking site team I understand the situation well

 

sparkie

[banker_rhymes_with]

It could set RBS into freefall and bring down other banks into the bargain and make our financial institutions the laughing stock in World affairs.

 

I do rather like the sound of that.

 

Excellent, keep at it then.

 

Cheers,

BRW

[emandcole]

Far as I'm concerned the fact that they're huge and have such a highly inflated sense of self worth is all the more reason to ask them to account for their activities. By allowing such activities we condone their actions and only set ourselves up for another bail out the next time one of their great money making schemes fails.

 

The recession, caused by such reckless financial gambling in the first place, is no excuse to allow them to get away with anything else that comes to light. If they go under so be it, all of their legitimate interests will be passed to more trustworthy institutions who it could be argued are more deserving of any bonuses now and in the future.

 

This is the security of the economy we are talking about, I feel it's not a big ask to let grown ups handle such an important task and anyone who isn't up to scratch, entirely reputable and morally responsible should quite rightly have no say in such matters.

 

I understand that the country is struggling and I too have suffered greatly because of it but equally I will never be content to let the kind of practices RBS and others have engaged in to go unaddressed. I fully support those on here who are clearly fighting to get some very serious concerns raised and dealt with in the proper manner and with their persistence and the intervention of the right people the public will come to learn more about the institution they have supported with their hard earned money.

[mkb]

This is the security of the economy we are talking about, I feel it's not a big ask to let grown ups handle such an important task and anyone who isn't up to scratch, entirely reputable and morally responsible should quite rightly have no say in such matters.

 

I fully support those on here who are clearly fighting to get some very serious concerns raised and dealt with in the proper manner and with their persistence and the intervention of the right people the public will come to learn more about the institution they have supported with their hard earned money.

 

 

Hear, hear!!