VCS PCN Claimform - no stopping - spycar CCTV - Liverpool Airport "offence"

[nightnajjers]

Why Can't Hobnail go to court with his partner and speak on her behalf ?

 

Using a lay representative in civil legal action

WWW.CITIZENSADVICE.ORG.UK

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Information about who may be a lay representative and how they can help you prepare and conduct a civil legal case.

 

[dx100uk]

Prepare and conduct does not equal speaking for them.

 

Read it properly and thats for Scotland too!!

 

Dx

[AndyOrch]

litigation friend | MoneyClaimsUK

WWW.MONEYCLAIMSUK.CO.UK

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get the answer to the question: what is a litigation friend?

 

[nightnajjers]

A Lay Representative or litigant's friend can present a case in court as long as the claimant is also present.

[whitelist]

Believe you to be in error unless that representative is say a debt or charity worker or a representative from a local authority given permission to speak by the judge.

 

What you are talking about is a McKenzie Friend 

 

A McKenzie Friend cannot speak in court, let alone present a case on behalf of an individual

[nightnajjers]

 I have no idea how or who. I just thought from what I read, it might be an option  for hobnail to represent his partner with her at any  hearing.  I was just trying to be helpful, apologies for the error.

[whitelist]

The great thing about this forum is that everybody learns from their mistakes so no need to apologise

 

https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/JCO/Documents/Guidance/mckenzie-friends-practice-guidance-july-2010.pdf

[FruitSalad1010]

A lay representative can present a case on the small claims track provided the claimant is present.

 

All laid out in the practice directions here at 3.2.

Edited March 31, 2022 by FruitSalad1010

[whitelist]

As stated by the link previously referenced by myself with the Court and Tribunal Service guidance. You need the permission of the court for a right of audience. They have no right to conduct any form of litigation or act as an advocate

 

What McKenzie Friends may not do 4)

 

MFs may not: i) act as the litigants’ agent in relation to the proceedings; ii) manage litigants’ cases outside court, for example by signing court documents; or iii) address the court, make oral submissions or examine witnesses.

Edited March 31, 2022 by whitelist

[Hobnail]

Yes some good ideas there. 

I will be defo trying to get the amount down as much as possible.

Just gonna wait see if they pay the court fee first.

[FTMDave]

So what happened Hobnail?

 

Were you able to negotiate a settlement with the fleecers?

[Hobnail]

No we had to pay £245 quid!

I couldn't go to court this was our only option

To think we could have just paid £60 when we first got the ticket too!

As you are asking & just for the record, I feel the advice I received here was very poor.

And some of the people "helping" where just damn right obnoxious.

I always thought it's best to stay out of their court system and stupidly thought this site could help us do just that.

Call me a conspiracy theorist but it's almost like the they are on these boards.

If I had to do it again I would just ignore the letters completely.

As it was only once we engaged after the LBA that it escalated to court.

I now know of people who have done just that numerous times and never had it get that far.

Very expensive lesson learned.

Be very careful from where you take advice!

[FTMDave]

Firstly, thanks for coming back and telling us what happened.  Lots of people don't bother.

 

My own experience of the site is somewhat different.  i came here to get information about private parking companies, liked what I saw, and decided to stay around and try to help a bit.

 

I think you're being pretty unfair in your distribution of blame when you don't even mention that in your case the person in legal dispute refused to attend the court hearing.  That made it impossible to win the case.  In the "PPC Successes" thread there is victory after victory after victory in VCS-arirport-no-stopping cases.  At a guestimate, 90%.  That seems pretty good advice to me.  However, in all those cases the motorist prepared a Witness Statement and stood up to VCS in court.

 

Had you liaised with the site before the hearing then there was still something that could have been done.  if you inform the court more than seven days before of non-attendance than you are not "penalised".  You will still, almost certainly, lose the case.  However, the court will read your Witness Statement and it's highly likely the judge would have refused the extra £60 made-up fees and also a part of the interest.

 

As for just ignoring an LBA.  I bet your the people you mention's cases weren't with VCS.  VCS are the most litigious of the PPCs and, although it disgusts me to say so, "experts" at low-cost litigation.  They take most people who don't pay them to court.  There is no avoiding the "court system" with VCS save giving in to them all the time.  We have a case at the moment - I kid you not - where they are taking someone to court, again in an airport-no-stopping case, for stopping their taxi to avoid killing a pedestrian.  They actually expect someone to not stop the vehicle and to murder a pedestrian.  Because they use court as a weapon to intimidate motorists into paying money they don't owe.  The only solution is to call their bluff, turn up at court and hammer them.

[FTMDave]

You've pushed me to look properly at how court cases between VCS/Excel and Caggers have turned out over the last two years.  I've ignored cases where the person didn't file a defence or didn't turn up in court, and where we think motorists won but they never came back to tell us.  In short results known of defended VCS or Excel court claims:

VCS/Excel victories - 6
CAG victories - 25
81% success rate.

Looking at just airport-no-stopping cases like yours:
VCS/Excel victories - 3
CAG victories - 7
70% success rate.

 

I think that illustrates the quality of the advice, whether some Caggers are in bed with the fleecers or not,  and the chances of beating VCS in court.