Article 50 Discussion

[tobyjugg2]

The UK's future with Johnson and the ERG:

Tax payer money routed through an American company while UK Customers and companies are left unpaid#

 

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/jan/26/government-plans-to-turn-england-homes-green-in-chaos-with-debt-and-job-losses

[tobyjugg2]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-jeremy-corbyn-suspension-court-b1793627.html

Labour attacks Jeremy Corbyn for ‘wasting time and money’ after court defeat over suspension from party

"Party to seek to recover legal costs from its former leader – in new deterioration in relationship"

 

Hopefully Carbuncle will now just *** off. Fat chance

Perhaps the Labour party should just take a leaf from Corbyns own book and deselect him and force a by-election?

[tobyjugg2]

LOL

as borders jam up and companies leave the UK for the EU, and EU companies stop shipping to the UK:

 

"“Tomorrow we will formally apply to join #CPTPP,” Ms Truss said in a Twitter statement on Sunday morning. “Membership will help drive an export- led, jobs-led recovery across [the UK] "

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit/brexit-news-latest-live-boris-johnson-eu-today-b1795345.html

[brassnecked]

If Liz Truss was a surgical appliance she couldn't support  a hernia.

[tobyjugg2]

It takes a special sort of deal negotiator to 'swap' the richest biggest developed market in the world 20 some miles away

for a hodgepodge of nations mainly looking to get away with some stuff 5000 miles away

 

thank god she wasn't a money market trader, she's be trading 50 pound UK taxpayer notes for a private baht.

.. mind you - they are broadly doing that too aren't they .....

Edited January 31, 2021 by tobyjugg2

[honeybee13]

She doesn't seem to know the difference, TJ. They just want to be in a club where the other nations mainly speak English, as I see it. I'm not sure the ex-colonies in there are going to be keen on the UK telling them what to do.

 

I was quite surprised that ministers and Brexiteers weren't raging about the EU invoking Article 16 which I though was an embarrassing for the EU to do.

 

What I didn't know until I read this is that Doris said in January that he wouldn't hesitate to invoke Article 50 himself. That could make it hard to take the moral highground.

 

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/brexit/watch-we-will-have-no-hesitation-in-triggering-article-16-if-necessary-says-boris-johnson-39964412.html

[tobyjugg2]

43 minutes ago, honeybee13 said:

She doesn't seem to know the difference, TJ. They just want to be in a club where the other nations mainly speak English, as I see it. I'm not sure the ex-colonies in there are going to be keen on the UK telling them what to do.

 

especially someone with a small market and 5000 mile shipping cost

 

 

Quote

I was quite surprised that ministers and Brexiteers weren't raging about the EU invoking Article 16 which I though was an embarrassing for the EU to do.

 

What I didn't know until I read this is that Doris said in January that he wouldn't hesitate to invoke Article 50 himself. That could make it hard to take the moral highground.

 

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/brexit/watch-we-will-have-no-hesitation-in-triggering-article-16-if-necessary-says-boris-johnson-39964412.html

 

Like the DUP screaming blue murder about the EU when they DEMANDED Johnson do precisely that, and supported his breaching related international agreements and law.

Still stupid of the EU to even suggest it even for less than 24 hours.

 

 

,,, and the UK seems to be saying the same as the EU did say

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/31/uk-help-eu-not-affect-vaccine-timetable-liz-truss

 

"UK will only help EU if it does not affect our vaccine timetable, says Liz Truss"

- so effectively saying no vaccines made in UK will go to EU unless they allow it

.....

Edited January 31, 2021 by tobyjugg2

[honeybee13]

I haven't seen much about this in the media, Moody's report last week on how they see the Brexit deal affecting the economy.

 

https://www.moodys.com/research/Moodys-New-Brexit-trade-agreement-confirms-macroeconomic-cost-for-UK--PBC_1262240

[tobyjugg2]

I think that the situation is going to massively deteriorate - lets not forget that the EU has not yet actually confirmed even the thin 'deal'

 

Already eu-UK is apparently down 40% with 25% of lorries leaving UK empty and many EU companies not delivering to UK due to UK vat registration issues ... So who remembers Johnson lying/claiming VAT is an EU issue?

 

Banks moving more staff/assets

Tesla building gigafactory in Germany with Nissan selling up a small potential increase in their existing battery 'manufacturing' in the UK - provided the UK-EU trade deal situation doesn't deteriorate (as they use aspects of the Japan-EU trade deal) - and undoubtedly the UK taxpayer will be paying for that - wait for it to come out.

 

There is no upside

Even the UK o/AZ 'we are keeping our vaccines' stance will backfire

Edited February 1, 2021 by tobyjugg2

[honeybee13]

David Allen Green's blog today is talking about Theresa May's decision to leave the single market and customs union without consulting the Cabinet [or at least the chancellor] or Parliament. And the consequences.

 

https://davidallengreen.com/2021/02/how-theresa-may-casually-decided-that-brexit-meant-the-united-kingdom-would-leave-the-single-market-and-customs-union-the-fascinating-and-revealing-interview-with-philip-hammond/

 

It's quite timely given what's currently happening in NI as well.

[tobyjugg2]

She had nowhere to turn, not that I'm sympathetic to her plight she was far too light with the handbag, and far too free with meaningless jargon

Her issues are exactly the same as why Useless liar Johnson is spinning and u-turning like a top .. except she was smarter and more politically aware and competent - despite the failures

 

and Hammonds views are hardly 'unbiased' despite that I largely agreed with him .. from his limited perspective.

 

The 'Tory' Party is in the same boat the US Republican party is ... they aren't (Tory or Republican)

Edited February 3, 2021 by tobyjugg2

[honeybee13]

I wasn't particularly keen on Hammond either but he has a point about how the decision to leave the SM and CU was made.

[tobyjugg2]

Seems to me that was evident the second Johnson and Gove were allowed to spout their rubbish and lies in their campaign

Confirmed when Gove and Johnson weren't unequivocally consigned to the back benches with their lies trounced

Inescapable when Cameron resigned after his utter twatishness ... at the latest.

 

absolute pre-defined destiny given Corbyn

 

... As is Scottish independence and a (probably federal) unified Ireland in the EU

Edited February 3, 2021 by tobyjugg2

[unclebulgaria67]

Problems will come when the UK Government signs up to international agreements that sections of the UK public are against.  Or trade terms allow foreign competition etc, which directly impacts UK businesses and jobs. 

 

Government previously blamed the EU, when in secret they agreed with the EU and participated in the decision making process.   But following Brexit, the UK Government will be 100% responsible for the  decisions it makes and will find it very difficult to blame outside organisations. 

 

By the next election in 2024, will there be enough evidence that Brexit has improved life of most UK citizens ?   

[tobyjugg2]

12 minutes ago, unclebulgaria67 said:

Problems will come when the UK Government signs up to international agreements that sections of the UK public are against.  Or trade terms allow foreign competition etc, which directly impacts UK businesses and jobs. 

 

Government previously blamed the EU, when in secret they agreed with the EU and participated in the decision making process.   But following Brexit, the UK Government will be 100% responsible for the  decisions it makes and will find it very difficult to blame outside organisations. 

 

By the next election in 2024, will there be enough evidence that Brexit has improved life of most UK citizens ?   

 

Huh?

How has opinion changed anything, Johnson is happy to whip to starve kids.

Since when will Johnson do anything but lie and blame the EU? 'Reason' doesn't enter the fray

 

That last one .. LOL

I'm not even sure most of the ERG's lives will have been improved let alone ordinary folk.

 

 

Edited February 3, 2021 by tobyjugg2

[unclebulgaria67]

All of the Government efforts appear aimed at Northern England voters who voted Tory for the first time  They must think keeping these voters will keep them in power.

 

Disappointment is bound to be experienced before next election, as Government has racked up large debts. Not sure how they can keep these new voters happy. 

[tobyjugg2]

Years away yet

Just rewrite history on the run up to elections

 

Apparently polls have Johnson recovering on the 'effectiveness' of the vaccine rollout despite continuing record deaths every day.

 

 

 

[honeybee13]

So Gove has admitted the problems at the borders are permanent and wants concessions extended by the EU. Was this meant to be covered by the transition period which GB refused to extend?

 

It's looking difficult in Northern Irish and I can see why they might think they've been stitched up by Johnson.

 

https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/brexit-news/europe-news/michael-gove-brexit-grace-period-extension-northern-ireland-7301058

[London1971]

Looks like my car has been 'Brexited' off the road.  MOT dues end of March, needs a new part by then or it fails. New part needs to come form EU, none left in stock in the UK. Nobody has a clue when it will be available.

[honeybee13]

What make of car is it, London?

[London1971]

It's a Volvo, it's quite a rare one too.  The mechanic told me that it's not just Volvo, there were no clutch assembly's left in the UK for a 2013 Fiesta either.  In his words 'This is getting stupid now'.

 

 

[tobyjugg2]

1 hour ago, honeybee13 said:

So Gove has admitted the problems at the borders are permanent and wants concessions extended by the EU. Was this meant to be covered by the transition period which GB refused to extend?

 

It's looking difficult in Northern Irish and I can see why they might think they've been stitched up by Johnson.

 

https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/brexit-news/europe-news/michael-gove-brexit-grace-period-extension-northern-ireland-7301058

 

yes they want an extension to the cake and eat it relaxing of rules while they do what they like - including doing sweet fanny adams themselves to address the issue they created.

[honeybee13]

I couldn't have put it better myself, TJ.

[honeybee13]

David Allen Green is blogging today on how Doris created the border in the Irish sea using Prime Ministerial powers. It's interesting on constitutional stuff IMO.

 

https://davidallengreen.com/2021/02/four-examples-of-prime-ministerial-power-how-boris-johnson-in-fact-did-everything-he-could-for-there-to-be-a-trade-barrier-down-the-irish-sea/

[brassnecked]

Johnson took MayBot's mess and made it worse.