The European Union.....In or Out?

[determindator]

Got voting card last week.

[Guest]

what's the threshold re when one countries' mep's (say britain for eg) object to a proposed piece of legislation. ie when wld it still go through anyway.

[obiter dictum]

We would use our VETO

[Guest]

ok. i think i've understood that.

Unanimity (veto) cf QMV?

but, in what areas is the veto still available

[obiter dictum]

Major change to Treaty law where all 28 member states need to agree.

QMV only applied to 20% of EU Law anyway

[Guest]

ok, cheers. will have a further look.

eg http://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/council-eu/voting-system/qualified-majority/

(says 'Qualified majority is the most widely used voting method in the Council. It's used when the Council takes decisions during the ordinary legislative procedure, also known as co-decision. About 80% of all EU legislation is adopted with this procedure'.)

[obiter dictum]

I think you will find if memory is correct the Treaty of Nice with QMV has now expired as it has a sunset clause

Edited May 22, 2016 by obiter dictum

[obiter dictum]

Sorry it is in your link, my mistake

[determindator]

Why does the European Union remind me of FIFA:madgrin:

[san_d]

Why does the European Union remind me of FIFA:madgrin:

 

Because they're both run by Johnny Foreigner. I'm surprised you didn't mention ISIS or the Fourth Reich.

[AndyOrch]

Is it time to close this pointless thread ?....posts are now becoming nauseating.

[unclebulgaria67]

Is it time to close this pointless thread ?....posts are now becoming nauseating.

 

I was thinking the same, but you will get people starting new threads to continue the debate. At least with one thread, it can be contained and those not interested don't have to read it.

 

This whole EU debate in the country has been dishonest with both sides making claims which are not true or a prediction to create fear.

[buckthorn]

I want to leave the EU, but just look at the people Cameron and Osbourne have

pushed forward to make their argument to persuade me to vote to stay:-

 

Christine Lagarde, she gets all her predictions wrong.

Mark Carney BofE, he will most likely go back to Goldman Saches when he retires.

Martin Sorrel, Whooooo!

The CBI, who got rid of their chairman because he told the truth about the EU.

All establishment lackeys. They want us to stay in because their lifestyle depends

on it not ours.

 

And now for the latest bunch of lackeys put up, to get you to vote to stay in.

Terry Leahy, (Tesco) he has just told us their profits have dropped, can’t take

competition have you ever tried to buy UK produce in this supermarket?

Justin King, (Sainsbury) their sales have dropped.

Marc Bolland (M&S) he lasted 6 years, now he sells Coca—Cola, he would be

better off with a hot-dog stand.

Ian Cheshire (B&Q) never heard of him, he now sells dresses in Debenhams.

 

Cameron & Osbourne really missed a top businessman who could have persuaded

me to vote to stay, but only if I had a lobotomy, talk about entrepreneur he is the

crème de la crème of the business world, they should have snapped him up.

Phillip Green, the ex-owner of British Home Stores, talk about top business men, fantastic.

[citizenB]

I see Martin Lewis is also in favour of staying !

 

 

The latest from the Treasury is a 100 page document threatening a year long recession if we leave !

 

 

Now what happens if we were to believe this and leave and... we still get the year long recession, do we get to vote again because they have lied to us ?

[Guest]

hi citb

see my post bbc link #527

apparently uk trade is already back in recession! though it is expected to perk up later this year (prob depending on the outcome of the eu vote )

[unclebulgaria67]

I see Martin Lewis is also in favour of staying !

 

 

The latest from the Treasury is a 100 page document threatening a year long recession if we leave !

 

 

Now what happens if we were to believe this and leave and... we still get the year long recession, do we get to vote again because they have lied to us ?

 

If the leave side wins by a narrow margin, Cameron or his successor are not going to negotiate exit of the EU. Instead they will try to negotiate revised membership terms and possibly hold another referendum. The reason i believe this is that there is not a majority of MP's or Lords who would vote through relevant Bills of Parliament to support exit from the EU. Brexit is not going to happen, unless there is a reasonable turnout and a very clear win for leave.

 

Brexit would be a nightmare people wish they had not voted for. It will cause political and economic instability for years. This is my assessment of the situation and not influenced by any of the remain campaign.

[citizenB]

the bank warns of recession if out (above).

but, according to to the beeb the uk industry is already back in recession?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36266178

 

hi citb

see my post bbc link #527

apparently uk trade is already back in recession! though it is expected to perk up later this year (prob depending on the outcome of the eu vote )

 

 

Sorry Ford missed that - so again they are relying on the short term memory of the British Public !

[citizenB]

If the leave side wins by a narrow margin, Cameron or his successor are not going to negotiate exit of the EU. Instead they will try to negotiate revised membership terms and possibly hold another referendum. The reason i believe this is that there is not a majority of MP's or Lords who would vote through relevant Bills of Parliament to support exit from the EU. Brexit is not going to happen, unless there is a reasonable turnout and a very clear win for leave.

 

Brexit would be a nightmare people wish they had not voted for. It will cause political and economic instability for years. This is my assessment of the situation and not influenced by any of the remain campaign.

 

 

I am with you on this one, Uncle B. I think this will be relevant whichever side wins if it is a narrow margin - it needs to be a massive yes/no.

 

 

I was looking at the news earlier on and it would appear there is a clear divide between age groups. 18-24 year group will vote to stay (that is if they can be bothered to vote at all) and those over 58 will most likely vote to leave and it is this age group that do tend to vote.

 

 

Now if it is true there is a glut of people in the latter age group and older, then it is likely those that voted originally to go into the Common Market will very likely bring us out of the EU

[obiter dictum]

I myself think it will be the BAME vote that will decide this with Third or 4th Generation

[unclebulgaria67]

This might be a controversial question.

 

Should those currently aged say 70 or older be eligible to vote in the EU referendum, when any EU exit date might be 10 years into the future ?

 

Why should those older be voting on something, which has far more of an effect on younger generations ?

 

If i were aged 70 or over, i don't think i would vote, because the decision should be taken by younger generations, who are going to be far more affected.

[obiter dictum]

Then that is denying a democratic processs to a section of the community. Where do you draw the line. Do you take away a persons driving licence just because they turn 70? Should people over 70 be made to retire for the younger Generation

[determindator]

Because they're both run by Johnny Foreigner. I'm surprised you didn't mention ISIS or the Fourth Reich.

 

Not quite sure how to take that but I was referring to the inner workings of a club which may not be in our favour.

 

We weathered the bank crash in 2008 where we were hours away from banks not having any cash and no service at the cash points. Would it be like that if we left, I doubt it.

[silverfox1961]

Having read quite a lot of the posts on this thread whilst ignoring the stupid point scoring, one thing does come to me.

 

Predictions! That is all we have been given. Nobody has a crystal ball which would say what WILL happen, only what 'could'. The people that have made predictions have been wrong before and no doubt will be wrong again so how can we believe anyone who has an agenda.

 

The stay campaign say one thing which is rubbished by the leave group and vice versa. At least the famous (infamous) BBC have a Reality Check which delves into the claims and tries to give an impartial view. I would trust them more than any group with a certain agenda.

 

I have said it before and I will say it again. The BBC get panned from all sides of the political spectrum as being too far right or too far left. By virtue of that suggests to me that the BBC must be impartial.

 

Until we get someone who can see into the future, I will trust my gut (and the BBC)

[Conniff]

Having read quite a lot of the posts on this thread whilst ignoring the stupid point scoring, one thing does come to me.

 

Predictions! That is all we have been given. Nobody has a crystal ball which would say what WILL happen, only what 'could'. The people that have made predictions have been wrong before and no doubt will be wrong again so how can we believe anyone who has an agenda.

 

The stay campaign say one thing which is rubbished by the leave group and vice versa. At least the famous (infamous) BBC have a Reality Check which delves into the claims and tries to give an impartial view. I would trust them more than any group with a certain agenda.

 

I have said it before and I will say it again. The BBC get panned from all sides of the political spectrum as being too far right or too far left. By virtue of that suggests to me that the BBC must be impartial.

 

Until we get someone who can see into the future, I will trust my gut (and the BBC)

 

Smashing post. It's what I have been trying to get through since the OP. Claims that this or that 'will' happen are simply not founded and cannot be backed up and that goes for both sides, although with some of the silly claims made by Cameron and Osborne they are pushing the boundaries of improbability, fantasy and fear too far and it would seem a lot are falling for it.

[Conniff]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbXdDJ3phu0

 

 

Like him or not, he is the only one who has the guts to tell it like it really is.

Edited May 24, 2016 by Conniff