old HSBC debt Marlin/Restons claim form - prob already SB'd.

[gordonharris]

I have a debt that is "almost" 6 years old.

 

It's an old debt from HSBC that was bought up by Lowell and

then passed on to Marlin.

 

It was just coming up to the 6 year mark and

 

I found papers on my doormat tonight from Northampton Court.

 

My debt was due to hit the 6 year mark on the 25th of the Month and the claim was issued on the 4th.

 

Does anyone know if the claim cannot be completed because its running over the 6 years or ..

 

As I fear they got in just in time and I am indeed liable?

 

The court form is legit, but there is very very little info on it.

 

An HSBC account number (That I don't recognise).

 

What's the best thing to do here?

 

The claim was made by Restons on behalf of Marlin who bought the debt from Lowell, who in turn bought the debt from HSBC.

 

Thanks in advance

 

Gordon

 

P.S. The debt was actually due in 04/05/2006 so it's over 6 years now but the default was set on the 25/10/2007. Does this make a difference?

Edited October 8, 2013 by gordonharris
Apologies the default date was 25/10/2007 not 25/1/2007

[gordies]

A debt will be "Statute Barred" if there has been no acknowledgement of the debt by you making a payment or in writing within the relevant limitation period.

 

The debt would then be legally UNENFORCEABLE.

 

If you are in England/Wales then the limitation period is 6 years

 

If you are in Scotland then the limitation period is 5 years

 

So, it sounds like it is well and truly Statute Barred already, but others will confirm that.

[renegadeimp]

court action supercedes SB.

 

Are you 100% sure that the 6 year date ( 5 years in scotland), is on the 25th? Remember, dont go by your credit files. Go by the last payment date or written acknowledgement. This can be months before the credit file entry.

 

The debt was actually due in 04/05/2006

 

Was that the last date of payment? If so, use SB as an absolute defence. If lowell thought they had a good chance at a claim, then they would have taken you to court long ago and not sold the debt on. Marlin are pretty much chancing their luck and hoping you dont respond.

[maroondevo52]

Hello and Welcome Gordon,

 

I've moved this thread to the Financial Legal Issues Forum.

 

Regards,

 

Scott.

[dx100uk]

if the default date is 25/1/7 then its prob well SB'd

 

ring HSBC in the morning and ASK when the last payment was.

 

dx

[gordonharris]

Apologies, I made an error.

 

The default date is the 25/10/2007.

 

But, this is just the date on my credit file.

 

No payment or acknowledgement was made for almost a year prior to that.

Thanks for the advice.

 

I shall ring HSBC first thing and find out.

 

Should I then use this as my defense on the court forms or write to Marlin/Restons with the updated information first?

[dx100uk]

don't tip them off Marlin/Restons

 

ring HSBC.

 

dx

[renegadeimp]

SOunds liek its well and truely SB. AS advised, give the bank a ring and ask when the last payment was. If it was more than 6 years ago, then you have a solid defence and marlin are out of luck.

[gordonharris]

Hi there. Thanks again for all of the help. I spoke to HSBC this morning and they told me that my debt was paid off completely 7/6/2007 from another account and my account was closed.

 

This was the last recorded payment and was not made by myself. I do not recognise the account number it was paid from and the girl could not trace it. I guess the bank paid it off.

 

I also had a credit card with HSBC at the time and I wondered if it was from the balance of this but the bank have no record of the card anymore.

 

They said it was unusual, because they always keep records but it could be because the situation was over 6 years old.

 

I know this all sounds awful, but things got really tough for us back then, we lost everything.

What would be my next step?

 

Do I need more concrete proof from the bank?

 

If not, shall I acknowledge the summons and start to prepare my defense?

Edited October 9, 2013 by gordonharris
UPDATE:

[gordonharris]

UPDATE:

With more digging I discovered the debt was a managed loan.

 

The managed loan was passed onto Metropolitan (Not Lowell as I first thought) from HSBC 17th August 2007.

 

It had not been paid some months before that, and I have never paid/acknowledged Metropolitan,

 

Marlin then picked it up just about 6 months ago.

[dx100uk]

aha the old 'managed loan' HSBC dodge.

 

they usually combine a bank account [not covered by the CCA] with a credit card or loan [ that is covered by the CCA]

and give it a new number. then sell it on.

 

that's very naughty, no wonder they say they cant find the info. covering their backsides.

 

so this is prob what marlins have issued the claim form against.

 

looks like a statute barred defence

 

i'll see if someone who know these ML's game is around.

 

dx

[citizenB]

Oh noooooo, these Managed loans are a nightmare.

 

Did they do a Statement of Means (affordability).

 

Did it roll up other loans covered by the consumer credit act, such as credit cards / loans with an overdraft.

 

Was it their suggestion / insistence that you take one of these loans.

 

Was there any Payment Protection Insurance provided with the ML ?

[citizenB]

If you have not made any payments since August 2007, then I would suspect this is statute barred anyway ?

 

So, you have had a claim issued

 

Date of issue 4th October + 5 days for service = 9th October + 14 days to acknowledge = 23 October + 14 days to submit defence = 6th November.

 

You MUST acknowledge the claim by 23rd October.

[citizenB]

Can you please type out verbatim, exactly what it says on the claim form in the larger space toward the bottom, left hand side of the claim. Obviously don't put in the account number or any personal details and put (above or below £10,000) for the amount claimed.

 

Ta

[gordonharris]

Particulars of claim

The claimant claims payment of the overdue balance due from the Defendant(s) under a

contract between the Defendant(s) and

HSBC Bank Plc

dated on or about 24/05/2006 and assigned

to the claimant on 20/02/2013 in the sum of (Below 10k)

 

PARTICULARS a/c no:- xxxxxxxxxx

 

DATE ITEM VALUE

08/05/2013 Default balance (Below 10k)

Post Refri Cr NIL

 

Total (Below 10k)

 

 

To answer the questions:

 

There was no statement of means

It did roll up both an overdraft and a credit card

It was their suggestion and insistence that I took the loan

Not sure about payment protection

 

 

Thanks again for the help all.

Edited October 9, 2013 by gordonharris
Additional info

[dx100uk]

great, you need to have read around on these ML's

not usually enforceable even if it were not SB'd!

 

dx

[citizenB]

IMHO, if you are absolutely certain that you have made no payments to this account for over 6 years then your defence should be along the lines of the following.

 

 

1: The Claimant's claim was issued on (date).

 

2: The Claimant contends that the Claimant's claim so issued is a claim in contract and is statute barred pursuant to the provisions of section 5 of the Limitation Act 1980. If, which is denied, the claimant contends that the Defendant is in breach of the alleged contract, in excess of 6 years have elapsed since the date on which any cause of action for breach accrued for the benefit of the Claimant.

 

3: The Claimant's claim to be entitled to payment of £x or any other sum, or relief of any kind is denied.

 

 

 

 

 

I have asked ST with more legal knowledge to look in on you as well.

Edited October 9, 2013 by Andyorch
edited

[gordonharris]

Thanks again. It was Metropolitan that took over the debt from HSBC (They are HSBC's in house debt collectors) Should I call them and ask when the last payment was, just to make sure? I am almost positive I never paid/acknowledged them. Would they willingly give me that info? Am I putting anything at risk by calling them and should I avoid any admittance of debt?

[AndyOrch]

Thanks again. It was Metropolitan that took over the debt from HSBC (They are HSBC's in house debt collectors) Should I call them and ask when the last payment was, just to make sure? I am almost positive I never paid/acknowledged them. Would they willingly give me that info? Am I putting anything at risk by calling them and should I avoid any admittance of debt?

 

No.......stick by your defence the onus is upon the claimant to prove that its not SB....not for you to prove it is.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[gordonharris]

Thanks for all the help so far guys and girls.

 

Is it worth me preparing a defense for the Managed loan as well.

 

IE The fact that a managed loan is not enforceable as well as the SB defense?

 

Covering both bases, is that possible, advisable?

 

Once again thanks,

 

I'm going to donate to the site over the weekend .

Edited October 10, 2013 by ims21

[citizenB]

Thanks for all the help so far guys and girls. Is it worth me preparing a defense for the Managed loan as well. IE The fact that a managed loan is not enforceable as well as the SB defense? Covering both bases, is that possible, advisable? Once again thanks, I'm going to donate to the site over the weekend.

 

 

Erm.. I don't understand.. SB is a complete defence !!

[gordonharris]

Apologies, I'm probably just showing my ignorance of these systems. My thought process was that just in case the SB defense failed (99% sure it wont) I would have a backup defense in the form of the "Managed Loans are not enforceable". So, I would have all bases covered. Buy the sounds of it, this is not how things work.

[AndyOrch]

You simply submit the SB defence that has been proposed to add anything further simply dilutes your plea and shows sign that you are not convinced so here is a back up just in case...stand by your initial defence...if you are 99% sure then they have 1% chance of proving otherwise.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[gordonharris]

OK, will do. Thanks Andy.

[gordonharris]

Hi there. I have an update from Restons Solicitors. They have pulled some information that says I did in fact make a payment on this account in 2011. Now, this information comes at the end of February and their claim was put in at the beginning of October. This is what hey are asking me to do and i quote.

 

"Our instructions are to make an application to lift the stay on these proceedings, to strike out the defence/for summary Judgement and to seek an order that you pay our clients legal costs on a contractual (indemnity) basis. In order to avoid this, we invite you to withdraw your defence by completing the enclosed form N9 and returning it to this office within 14 days."

 

This is all beyond me and any advise would be most welcome.

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Gordon

 

P.S. The weird thing about this is that the HSBC account the payments in 2011 are supposed to have come out of was long closed to my knowledge. I have been using a Barclays account from 2008 onwards. The payments they have shown coming out are marked "payment via agent". Is this a cheap trick to get me to withdraw my defence?

Edited February 25, 2014 by gordonharris
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