Help needed suspended from work :(

[Emmzzi]

Whoever raised the allegation against the OP.

 

the investigating officer, who raises the possible offence during the investigatory meeting. Which is a normal procedure and not grounds for suspension.

[Brownguy53]

Hi in answer to your questions:

 

(1) there is no CCTV in the union centre ..the sheets are left on a open desk that could be easily accessed by students..other staff etc and i did point this out in the meeting

(2) No one has reported it..apparently they were looking at the sheets and it's the head managers opinion's the writing match.

But in the past I've sent him emails and he's said he 'didn't like the wording of them' and i never emailed him again to be honest he said I was emailing in a 'professional manner' when there was no need to, ie i sent him a email and put dear sir etc...and he said i should email formally...i JUST THOUGHT at the time it was such a petty thing to email me and tell me off about..that i let it go.. To be honest the opinion i got was myself that he thought my job

was some low scale job and not important and so he really thought who the **** r u..go to your line manager not me..i've got better things to do but i let it go at the time..so i just thought he's never liked me. But then he went off to cover another role as that person was on maternity leave.

Since then I had a new manager who I really like that was the temp manager who came to the meeting she's alot better.

(3) i got told that ive been suspended pending investigation..although oddly on the 'meeting notes' I recieved it said this is actually pending hr decision now..and i was told in the meeting im suspended under hr advice and also to protect the union and myself apparently..

(4) I recieved the notes but don't think everything I said and signed on the piece of paper is in the notes..should i argue this or mention this do you think?? Also i noticed that on the notes they're called 'hr step 1 against xxx (my name)..' so im taking it they wanna take this further by naming it step 1?

 

To be honest guys I've thought now i only have 3 weeks left on the contract (my final work dates are june 14-17th and then 27th i believe..so i might just resign..but im wondering how it will work as they're saying right now..for may they cancelled 4 of my shifts without notifying me (they sent the email to the wrong address) but they said in the meeting they will pay me for those 4 days+ the day of suspension..if i hand in notice i don't know if ill be paid for the ahead scheduled dates or what..)

 

I just didn't like the implications that were made in the meeting..ie they told me my options are (1) resign (2) admit it or 'email them after thought'..

Like someone said to my gf on MSE Forums in my contract it states they can dismiss me without reason as long as its discriminant..

The head manager also made the suggestion and he did say 'I'm just suggesting this' but next year we want to give all students a equal opportunity so the job won't probably be open to the same candidates who did it this year..

for him to say this now to me came across to me that i won't get the job again next year..

I've emailed back just asking for the disciplinary policy and a copy of my contract..and the manager is off till 4th june. However the notes they sent me a copy off i dont agree with as they dont have everything that was written down and my defence in clear precise points..but right now im just thinking it's not worth the headache..i earn £2100 a year from the job and is it really worth the ballache of fighting? I know i haven't done anything wrong but i'll see these people as i study at the same university..

And more over i'll be completely honest with you guys..my mum has cancer and the temp manager knows about this, so I can't be stressed out with this..thats why after much thought i've just thought i'll resign..don't know if thats right but i will. Just i can't get union involved as it's too late and no doubt i can't afford a employment lawyer and to be fair i'm allowed one of the SU reps but i think they will be bias. I was thinking about emailing the case to a couple solicitors but I thought with my annual salary being so low it may not interest them...

Edited May 26, 2013 by Brownguy53

[altobelli]

the investigating officer, who raises the possible offence during the investigatory meeting. Which is a normal procedure and not grounds for suspension.

 

Whoever raised the allegation against the OP. In this case, the head manager.

[Brownguy53]

in relation to stus quesfion.

 

when staff started getting prank calls etc and texts everyones personal files were moved.

 

the feedback forms are a seperate matter and are always left on a open desk in front of students and staff. there is no cctv in this area. anyone including non staff or security or cleaners could access the feedback forms even students.

 

tbf now i think.if i resign maybe i would seem guilty

..i dont know what to do to be fair

[becky2585]

Whoever raised the allegation against the OP. In this case, the head manager.

 

Alto, I am very much pro employee rather than pro HR, and I agree with Emmzzi that suspending the complainant in a grievance investigation would be completely disproportionate.

 

Suspension may be a neutral act, but the fact remains that it almost always falls under an employers disciplinary policy. If someone makes a complaint, they should be able to reasonably expect to continue to attend work and not effectively be accused of some level of wrongdoing themselves - or it's a complete disincentive to bring any complaints to management attention. Plus, no formal complaint has been raised against the person in question. If the OP raised a formal grievance then that could be different, but it's highly unlikely that any Tribunal would expect management to be suspended without very good reason!

[Emmzzi]

OP, leaving aside the question of fairness and looking at just the impact on your future

 

I think you have been given a clear steer that you aren't getting hired next year. I think that is very common with student employment by student unions.

 

I think you hve been given a choice of "go quietly" or "sit the investigation out", and I think option one implied the investigation would end.

 

2 weeks to go on your contract now? What are yo on, one week's notice? I might be inclined to resign a week before contract end just giving my notice period, so I still got paid.

 

I 100% agree that sounds unfair; but it may be pragmatic. Also you want to know what kind of reference you would get.

[altobelli]

Alto, I am very much pro employee rather than pro HR, and I agree with Emmzzi that suspending the complainant in a grievance investigation would be completely disproportionate.

 

Suspension may be a neutral act, but the fact remains that it almost always falls under an employers disciplinary policy. If someone makes a complaint, they should be able to reasonably expect to continue to attend work and not effectively be accused of some level of wrongdoing themselves - or it's a complete disincentive to bring any complaints to management attention. Plus, no formal complaint has been raised against the person in question. If the OP raised a formal grievance then that could be different, but it's highly unlikely that any Tribunal would expect management to be suspended without very good reason!

 

But Becky, suspension can't then be neutral if is not applied evenly, i.e. if it is more difficult to suspend management than anyone else. You're saying yourself that if someone is suspended for making a complaint, then they're 'effectively...accused of some level of wrongdoing themselves'. The same must apply to the accused. So in that case suspension isn't neutral. And complaints shouldn't be incentivised or disincentivised, they should be raised naturally as the need arises. If a complaint is made and the accused denies it, the complainant is being accused of wrongdoing, in fact it can be gross misconduct. If only one part is suspended in situations where a complaint is made, all it does is incentivise false accusations. And the accused in this case, although suspended, appears to have had no formal complaint made against him.

 

For suspension to be neutral it must be fair and proportionate, it must be applied to both parties in a dispute otherwise it is inherently unfair.

[altobelli]

in relation to stus quesfion.

 

when staff started getting prank calls etc and texts everyones personal files were moved.

 

the feedback forms are a seperate matter and are always left on a open desk in front of students and staff. there is no cctv in this area. anyone including non staff or security or cleaners could access the feedback forms even students.

 

tbf now i think.if i resign maybe i would seem guilty

..i dont know what to do to be fair

 

Brownguy53, one question I have to ask is, did you do what you were accused of?

 

If yes, I would resign.

 

If not, I would definitely not resign as it will give the appearance of guilt.

 

Its obvious from your posts that you're under a lot of stress. I think part of that is to do with the fact that you've been suspended and are being kept hanging, and I would reoeat what I've said previously - I don't think you should have been suspended and certainly if you are then your accuser should be as well. I would write to someone senior at the employer (not HR) and request that either your suspension is lifted or that your accuser is suspended as well. It might be worth putting in a formal complaint, as Becky says that might make a difference as to how your employer views the possibility of suspending your accuser.

 

Another thought - there are handwriting experts who may be able to prove to a degree of certainty whether or not you wrote the notes. This could be something you could raise with the person heading up the investigation.

[Brownguy53]

Brownguy53, one question I have to ask is, did you do what you were accused of?

 

If yes, I would resign.

 

If not, I would definitely not resign as it will give the appearance of guilt.

 

Its obvious from your posts that you're under a lot of stress. I think part of that is to do with the fact that you've been suspended and are being kept hanging, and I would reoeat what I've said previously - I don't think you should have been suspended and certainly if you are then your accuser should be as well. I would write to someone senior at the employer (not HR) and request that either your suspension is lifted or that your accuser is suspended as well. It might be worth putting in a formal complaint, as Becky says that might make a difference as to how your employer views the possibility of suspending your accuser.

 

Another thought - there are handwriting experts who may be able to prove to a degree of certainty whether or not you wrote the notes. This could be something you could raise with the person heading up the investigation.

 

 

no i didnt do what am accused of.

 

the issue.i have is i just dont know who i would complain to? would it be my head managers line manager or who?

 

i was just planning to resign and put in my resignation that imm not resigning because i did the action but because it has become pbvious that i am no longer wanted and wether found guilty or not i will still be dismissed because my contract states it can.br terminated at any time.

[Brownguy53]

i had a look on the udsu website and the head managers role is 'senior manager of student union ' and the temp is development manager. so im unsure who i would complain to.

[Brownguy53]

the other thing i was going to say was if i complain wont they jusat say the manager acted rigjt because he consulted human resources and theyre advice was to suspend??

[Emmzzi]

the other thing i was going to say was if i complain wont they jusat say the manager acted rigjt because he consulted human resources and theyre advice was to suspend??

 

Yes!

[Brownguy53]

So Emzii your advice is it's best to resign? Just I thought the same really..I want a reference.. I think if am right the notice is 2 weeks..but unsure how it'd work with me being suspended because normally i'd have to work any shifts..i've contacted a few solicitors anyway going to get an opinion as it's clear that my manager isnt back till 4th june..so got a bit of time

[Emmzzi]

I can't tell you if it is best for you. If clearing your name from the job is going to be worth the effort. I'd check on references before deciding.

[altobelli]

the other thing i was going to say was if i complain wont they jusat say the manager acted rigjt because he consulted human resources and theyre advice was to suspend??

 

They might, but that doesn't mean the manager actually was right or that HR dealt with the suspension fairly. If you do write to them, I'd write to the person handling the investigation. Put down your concerns - that you feel your suspension is unfair (if you feel it is), that you feel the manager who made the allegation should also be suspended (if you feel he should be), raise any complaint about the manager that you wish to raise, and make any suggestions which might clear your name, e.g. handwriting analysis. If you are going to stay at the moment, its important that you raise any concerns you have just now, otherwise you could be accused of not complaining at the time.

[Brownguy53]

I've emailed both the managers and suggested that they send the writing off if they feel it was me. Both managers are off until 4th June I believe which is this Tuesday.

I'm thinking that for 3 weeks contract which is left its just not worth the headache. Rang a few solicitors and they said i can't act or take action until they dismiss me. However they advised me to ring ACAS is it..ACAS? Yeah them about it as they may know more. So I was just going to resign on Friday 7th June and i'm told by someone else who left my work that the notice is 3 weeks. If I do this am going to put in my resignation that I am resigning because I feel that wether or not am guilty I will still be dismissed. And further i will not allow or accept any info to be passed to my uni as i advised that it be sent off and was never found guilty.

 

The issue i have is that i have shifts scheduled for june so if i hand in notice should they still pay me for this time?

[altobelli]

I would advise not resigning, I think they're probably trying to pressure you into doing that.

 

Speaking to ACAS might be a good idea though.

[Atlas01]

You must also consider if you resign your employer can give a reference stating "left during a disciplinary investigation for fabrication of racist comments" switching the burden from them having to have reasonable belief you did it and going through a full dismissal process just before your leaving anyway (I agree this seems a highly tenuous accusation from your comments) to you having to prove you didn't to any subsequent employer.

 

No employer would touch you with that as it will read as "this person will sue me for racial discrimination", it's no better in the long run than being dismissed in my view

 

I have never advised anyone to resign and never will as the day after that person leaves i would become the person to blame for them not being in work (trust me i've seen it too many times) but on this occasion i would be pushing them to conclude the matter or drop it before i went.

 

Your employer if they have much sense should be letting you walk without going into who's writing they believe it to be without any validation.

[Brownguy53]

I agree with the above, it just seems that its all too much headache right now that I don't need espically since my mother has cancer and I'm forced to look after her.

 

The advice of all solicitors has been as I have 3 weeks left its not cost effective to me or 'ethical' for them to start a case for me.

 

I've spoke to ACAS today, they told me that (1) i can be dismissed at anytime but as this is relating to racism the employer has to tread very carefully.. this is due to the fact that the employer does not have to give a reason for dismissal if you work under 2 years in any job (2) The above is right..they can't give me a negative reference now but they can put like what Atlas01 has said..(3) ACAS said to me in their opinion if I feel that the manager who has accused me of this has a grudge/bias I should file a grievance against him to HR directly. (4) Even if i resign..again as Atlas01 put they can do this. But the minimum period of notice is 1 week.

(5) According to ACAS if I am dismissed i cannot go to a tribunal because I have worked less than 1 year.

 

I've since sent the 'head manager' who made these accusations a email stating this (I sent this a few weeks ago but got a automated message stating he's away till today):

 

Following the formal interview that took place leading to my suspension as a Youth Worker I have had the email of 'notes' from XXXX.

I would like to point out that I am unhappy with the notes on the basis that I do not believe they are fully correct and what was said in the interview, neither what I

signed on the piece of paper at the end of the interview.

For example the document states that I only stated the writing was unlike my own because the 'a' was different. I actually stated that I believe the writing was different in spacing and format and letters of 'a' and 'g'. This has not been clearly elaborated in the word document you have produced and in my eyes is not what what said by myself in the formal interview, neither does it state in a non bias way what I stated.

 

Furthermore I asked for a copy of the writings I am falsely accused of forging and I still have not recieved this.

I would like to put to yourself and HR that if you feel so strongly that I am guilty of this, even though you are going purely on visual assumption, that a fair solution is that we send the writings off to a independent graphology expert.

 

My final question is, one option you put to me is that I can 'resign'. If I wished to do this how much notice do I have to give?

Also what would happened to any scheduled shifts that i am meant to work in this time?

 

^^^^^

I got no response from the head manager about this. However I have had a response from his temporary replacement saying if i resign it's with immediate effect.

I find this unusual as i asked someone else who worked for me before what notice he had to give and i was told it was 3 weeks. ACAS told me it can be mutully agreed as most employment contracts in this situation state that. Normally it's 1 week.

 

As for what you said Atlas from what I believe as I outlined earlier this head manager said that if i resign they would have to cancel the investigation as there is no risk involved..so am unsure what to do now.

 

ACAS's advice was to file a grievance on the basis of inappropriate behaviour of the head manager, and send in proof of the email I recieved which was blown out of proportion by himself and shows bias. This email happened in September (before any of the outlined incidents) and what happeneded was this- as I have checked to refresh my memory via my email system.

I basically could not work a shift, so my contract states i must give at least 48 hours notice. I gave 7 days notice, but recieved no response from my line manager. As he is the head manager I sent him a email explaining I needed to change a shift and i had been unable to contact my manager. I titled the letter 'Dear Mr xxxx' as I was new then. he sent me a email back saying 'theres no need for the formality in a email..a simple email will suffice in future. Your line manager is busy but will note in a few days your shift of changes'. I thought this was slightly rude as i had no been rude to him just professional. I believe from this incident he has had a bias against me since..as my opinion from this email was 'i'm busy **** off your some low level worker'. Don't know if thats just me but thats what I feel

 

I'm thinking now to maybe put in the grievance letter but am unsure what to say..furthermore I can't find any email or address for HR only a telephone number at the central campus

Edited June 4, 2013 by Brownguy53

[Brownguy53]

^^ This is all it says about HR a telephone number. So I gave them a ring..they said they don't know themselves who would deal with this as it's students union so they're going to give me a call back..

 

Funnily enough I got a message back saying this from the head manager:

 

Dear XXXXX,

 

Many thanks for feeding this information back to me.

 

I understand that you have also been in recent liaison with the University and would like to remind you that as a separate organisation to the University it is only appropriate for you to liaise directly with the xxx.

 

I have been on leave for the past week and so unable to access emails. What I have done in the meantime is send this email directly to Lamont Jones, our HR provider, for their information and for them to investigate on our behalf.

 

Without going into the semantics of your suggestion that the notes are incorrect, I can confirm that the notes which were typed up reflect what was agreed in the meeting and furthermore, what you agreed to.

 

I will take forward your suggestions to HR and in the meantime, I appreciate your patience.

 

Kind regards

 

XXXX

 

^

The issue I have with that is that I signed a piece of paper to agree what was said. I don't agree with what has been typed up,as I recieved a word document which I feel as outlined doesn't eleborate into it.

Edited June 4, 2013 by honeybee13

[Emmzzi]

I'd edit that post so you aren't 100% identifiable and dismissed for bringing the organisation into disrepute

[Brownguy53]

Edited it

[Emmzzi]

Take out the initials of the student union too. There's only one with that name.

[honeybee13]

Take out the initials of the student union too. There's only one with that name.

 

As the OP isn't around, I've done it. Thanks for being vigilant, Emmzzi.

 

HB

[Brownguy53]

Sorry wasn't aware of that thanks Honey..am awaiting advise as am unsure now whats going on