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RedPillGuy

Link/Kearns claimform - MBNA/Virgin Credit card 'debt' *** Claim Dismissed with Costs***

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Hi all,

 

I have a Virgin / MBNA credit card with a balance of around £13800

 

Due to a significant change of circumstances I have written to them to outline my financial difficulties,

they had initially agreed a reduced payment plan, but even this I am not able to meet at the moment.

 

Looking at their corresponance it does not appear that they have not actually defaulted me yet.

 

On 23/3/12 I requested copies of the CCA on the account but no reply yet.

 

I know that some of the law around CCA has changed over the last few years,

but am I right that after 14 working days,

I should write to them saying that I place the account in dispute?

The further 30 days is no longer applicable?

 

I MAY be in a position in a few months, with the generosity of a relative, to make a F&F offer,

but I wanted to confirm that they have a valid CCA before making such an offer. Any advice on this?

 

I understand my credit record will be hit for 6 years, but think I can live with that.

Just wanted to get all the pain out of the way now (if they have not yet defaulted me yet)

to start the 6 years ticking on the credit record.

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Hi Dewatt,

 

If you have received no response within 14 days then you should have sent in the account in-dispute letter, if not sent, send it now.

30 days for a CCA request no longer applies.

 

Pay what you can afford - if your on benefits or you income has dropped to a low level than £1 a month.

As Virgin are in default of your CCA request, you can legally stop payments until they comply.

 

Virgin will eventually farm it out to a DCA.

 

Any PPI or charges to claim back?

 

When offering a full and final - get everything in writing, make sure it is stated that the remainder of the debt will not be sold on, your credit file is reflected as a full settlement and even try and get the default removed.

 

Stigman

Edited by Stigman

NEVER telephone a DCA

If a DCA rings you, refuse to go through the security questions & hang up!

 

If I have helped you, click on the star & say thank you

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MBNA have sent me a reply within the 14 days.

 

They have sent:

- A copy of the executed agreement

- An "up to date terms and conditions"

- A copy of the most recent statement

 

The agreement does not have signatures, simplty a "tick box" with "I confirm that the tick in this box is a valid means of establishing the authenticity and integrity of my signature to this credit agreement. I understand MBNA will hold this acceptance data on their files" Date of signature: 9/2/2007

 

And similarly a "tick box" "Executed by Hugh Charter (Director) on behalf of MBNA. Date of Signature 9/2/2007

 

The credit limit in the agreement is 15.9% APR, however early statements are showing 1.2408% which when you run through http://www.stoozing.com/mon2yr.htm give an APR of 15.95% compounded - is this a discrepency?

 

There is no specified credit limit, simply "1a We will choose your credit limit and tell you what it is. We may vary it at any time and write to let you know." Is this not a prescribed term that is required.

 

I do understand that since 2004 online applications can include an electronic signature, but this does appear to be a reconstituted agreement rather than original (dont online agreements normally include the IP address as proof, which this one is lacking)

 

Does the fact that agreement was before the repal of s127(3) have any impact?

 

Thanks

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I have just had a phone call from MBNA in response to aF&F offer letter I had sent.

 

He asked if I could up my offer by £500 as this would then be within his delegated authority of 40%,

which i think I can do.

 

I asked for a letter accepting this ammount, but he said that because the debt is due for sale in the next month,

they are not allowed to send out acceptance letters in advance of receiving payment

as it interferes with the debt sale process.

 

 

It sounds dubious because without such a letter, because they then could just apply any payment against the debt

and continue to pursue the balance. he said I have "security" because all calls are recorded at their end.

 

I am not willing to move forward on that basis, but i do have the ability to record calls myself,

so if I called them, informed them that the call was being recorded,

make the offer and get their acceptance (including no further pursuit)

- would this sufficiently cover myslef from further pursuit?

Advice appreciated.

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I have just had a phone call from MBNA in response to a F&F offer letter I had sent.

He asked if I could up my offer by £500 as this would then be within his delegated authority of 40%, which i think I can do.

I asked for a letter accepting this amount, but he said that because the debt is due for sale in the next month, they are not allowed to send out acceptance letters in advance of receiving payment as it interferes with the debt sale process.

 

STAY OFF THE PHONE!!!

STAY OFF THE PHONE!!!

STAY OFF THE PHONE!!!

 

And just in case, STAY OFF THE PHONE!!!

 

He may as well pick up the Sunday sport and read you the headlines for all the truth it holds, seriously, if you have the facility to record your phonecalls, then do so every time, there is NO need to inform them you are recording your call.

 

Next thing is to ignore EVERYTHING you have been told over the phone, he is on commission, and you agreeing to up your offer by another £500 will go straight into his pocket, if you had paid it!

 

And as for the recording of the conversation at their end.......pah! :flypig:

 

If they are not prepared to commit anything in writing, then you don't pay anything.


Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Thanks Bazooka, I know I should stay off the phone

- he got me at work so I was thinking about something else.

 

 

Still, its worrying that they think they can trick you into making a payment

under the guise of accepting your F&F offer, but wont agree in writing

(and will them probably pursue you for the balance).

Seems like a really dodgy [problem].

 

I have just checked Equifax and CallCredit - both showing as defaulted 31/5/2012

so he was probably right that the account is due for sale to a DCA

- but surely it makes more sense for them to accept a 40% F&F

from me that sell it for less than 10% to a DCA??

 

I did have to laugh at the letter I got acknowledging receipt of my F&F offer dated June 1st

"as a goodwill gesture we have suppressed all interest and charges on your account" .

... surely thats what happens upon default.

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" I did have to laugh at the letter I got acknowledging receipt of my F&F offer dated June 1st "as a goodwill gesture we have suppressed all interest and charges on your account" .... surely thats what happens upon default."

 

Not necessarily interest and unfair charges can continue subject to the T&Cs of the agreement.

 

Andy


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Issue date 4 Dec 16

POC:

 

The Claimant ('C') claims the whole of the balance due & payable under an agreement referenced 1234567890, opened effective from 12/02/2007.

The agreement is regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974, was signed by the Defendant ('D')

& from which credit was extended to D.

d has not made payment as required & by 31/05/2012 a default was recorded. On 29/08/2012

 

D owed the sum of 14XXXXX TO MBNA Limited who, by and agreement in writing assigned the benefit of the debt to Link Financial Outsourcing Limited ('Link') effective 29/08/2012.

By an agreement in writing, Link assigned the benefit of the debt to C effective 28/02/2013.

 

Each assignment was made regular upon a Notice of Assignment being served upon D shortly after.

 

And C claims-

1. 14XXXXXX, AND

2. Interest Persians so s69 County Court Act 1984 at a rate of 8% per annum form 29/08/12 to 03/12/2015

of 3XXXXX and at a daily rate of 298 unit any judgment or sooner payment.

DATED 03/12/2015

What is the value of the claim? 18.5k

 

Is the claim for a current account (Overdraft) or credit/loan account or mobile phone account? credit Card

 

When did you enter into the original agreement before or after 2007? Feb 2007

 

Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim.

 

Original debt Virgin/MBNA, assigned to Link Financial Outsourcing, then assigned to IDR FINANCE UK II LIMITED (claimant). Kearns acting as solicitors.

 

Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? Yes from MBNA To Link, but no from Link to IDR.

 

Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? YES

 

Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? YES

 

Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Default sums” – at least once a year ? NO

 

Why did you cease payments? Inability to pay

 

What was the date of your last payment? DEC 2011

 

Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? NO

 

Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? YES, 2012.

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Given the date of the agreement (Feb 2007) doe this still mean that they are required to provide an original agreement with a signature?

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Thread moved to Financial Legal Issues Forum.


 
 

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If in doubt, you should seek the opinion of a Qualified Professional.

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Given the date of the agreement (Feb 2007) doe this still mean that they are required to provide an original agreement with a signature?

 

Yes I do believe that pre Apr 07 agreements will need the original to enforce in court, but it's all down to the DJ lottery at the end of the day.

 

Have you acknowledged the claim?


Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Yes I do believe that pre Apr 07 agreements will need the original to enforce in court, but it's all down to the DJ lottery at the end of the day.

 

Have you acknowledged the claim?

 

Only received the claim this mornings, so will wait a week then acknowledge

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please read the following and fill out the info required. Best to have all the info together

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?419198-You-have-received-a-Claim-What-you-need-to-do.-**UPDATED-December-2014**


PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING

EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 

 

 

Any help I am able to give is from my own experience only. Should you have any doubt you should contact a qualified professional.

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Have you demanded the CCA?

 

How much of that O/D is made up of the banks fees/charges?

 

Have you ever reclaimed any of them?


Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Just got the claim today so will be asking for CCA tomorrow

 

No fees or charges to reclaim

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Get a CPR letter off to the solicitors too. CCA request to the claimant.

 

Are you sure there are no charges for missed payments, letters issued, etc? It would be rare for an account to fall into default without incurring any charges.

 

What sort of outcome are you hoping for here, as a worst case scenario?

 

Sham

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CCA Letter to claimant and CPR letter to solicitors sent recorded delivery today.

AOS completed via MCOL

 

If issue date is 4/12/15 can I confirm defence must be submitted by 6th January?

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33 days - 4th Dec counts as one. I make it 4pm on 5th Jan for your defence. Go for a day or two earlier just to be on the safe side.

 

There are plenty of defences within other threads you can use and adapt. It will basically push them to substantiate their POCs. Make sure to post it up here for Andyorch to check before you submit it.

 

In the meantime, have a read of HSBC v Carey which will give you a good grounding on the s.78 aspect of your defence. Let's also see what they disclose in terms of agreement, default notice, and statements and how they can help you.

 

Sham

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Link Financial have come back regarding the CCA 77/78 request saying they dont have the documents and are requesting from MBNA which can take 30 days.

 

Nothing from the CPR request to Kearns Solicitors. I guess that they are just going to ignore the request over Christmas.

 

Should I just submit an embarrassed defence or wait a week to see if anything comes back?

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4pm Tuesday 5th jan deadline.as Sham says,...

 

 

no you don't file an embarrassed defence

that's old hat now.

 

 

if they provide no paperwork by the time you need to file

use the no paperwork/holding one

available on many credit card claim threads here and in the successes forum off this one.

 

 

dx


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Not sure who will be on these boards over Christmas, so here is my draft (no documents) defence for any comment. Thanks

 

In the Northampton (CCBC) county court

 

Claim number XXXXXXXX

 

Between

 

IRD Finance UK II Limited - Claimant

 

and

 

Me – Defendant

 

DEFENCE

 

[removed emb def - dx]

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if you are filing by mcol you don't need most of the ending stuff

 

 

id also keep things very simplistic

like their poc is.

 

 

POClink3.gif:

 

1.The Claimant ('C') claims the whole of the balance due & payable under an agreement referenced 1234567890, opened effective from 12/02/2007.

The agreement is regulated by the consumer creditlink3.gif Act 1974, was signed by the Defendant ('D')

& from which credit was extended to D.

2.d has not made payment as required & by 31/05/2012 a default was recorded. On 29/08/2012

 

3.D owed the sum of 14XXXXX TO MBNAlink3.gif Limited who, by and agreement in writing

assigned the benefit of the debt to Link Financial Outsourcing Limited ('Link') effective 29/08/2012.

4.By an agreement in writing, Link assigned the benefit of the debt to C effective 28/02/2013.

 

Each assignment was made regular upon a Notice of Assignment being served upon D shortly after.

 

5. And C claims-

1. 14XXXXXX, AND

2. Interest Persians so s69 county courtlink3.gif Act 1984 at a rate of 8% per annum form 29/08/12 to 03/12/2015

of 3XXXXX and at a daily rate of 298 unit any judgment or sooner payment.

DATED 03/12/2015

something like this:

1.Paragraph 1 is denied. The Defendant has no knowledge of, or has in their possession any agreement pertaining to the account number referred to in its Particulars of Claim.

2. Paragraph 2 is denied I have no knowledge of any legal assignment.I have never been served any Notice of Assignment from either the original creditor or the claimant pursuant to the Law of Property Act 1925.

3. Paragraph 3 is denied It is not accepted with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant and the Claimant is put to strict proof to:

a) show how the Defendant has entered into an agreement with the original creditor; and

b) show how the Defendant has reached the amount claimed for; and

c) Show or evidence a Default Notice /Notice of Sums in Arrears,

d) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim;

4. As per Civil Procedureicon Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed.

5.Despite a request being made under the consumer crediticon Act 1974, for the agreement and the other documents referred to in the Statement of Particulars, and on payment of the statutory fee of £1.00; the Claimant remains in breach of the sec78 request.

6.A further request made via CPR 31.14, after the claim had been issued, has also failed to elicit a copy of the agreement and other documents on which the Claimant claim relies upon.

7.Until such time the claimant can comply with the above sec78 request is therefore prevented from enforcing or seeking the relief claimed or any relief.


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Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

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Still no response from Kearns re the CPR request, and a standard "it will take time" response from IDR to the CCA request.

 

Defence submitted similar to the one above (thanks dx100uk)

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