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    • Firstly, I would like to thank everyone for their help in this matter. Since my last post I have received a reply from Plymouth Council Insurance Team concerning my wife’s accident (please see enclosed letter and photo of the offending Badminton post) which they deny any responsibility for the said accident. I feel that the Council is in breach of their statutory duties under the following acts: The Leisure Centre was negligent in its duty of care and therefore, in breach of the statutory duty owed under section 2 of the Occupiers’ Liability Act 1957. Health and Safety at Work Act 1974 (the Act) to ensure, so far as is reasonably practicable, the health, safety and welfare at work of all their employees, and others who might be affected by its undertaking, e.g. members of the public visiting the Leisure Centre to use the facilities. The Management of Health and Safety at Work Regulations 1999 that requires employers to assess risks (including slip and trip risks) and, where necessary, take action to address them. The Provision and Use of Work Equipment Regulations (PUWER) require the risk to people’s health and safety from equipment that is used at a Leisure Centre be prevented or controlled. I would like some advice to see if my assumptions are correct and my approach to obtaining satisfactory outcome to this matter are accurate. Many thanks   PLM23000150 - Copy Correspondence.pdf post docx.docx
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Hfc - Restons - Charging order hearing


CBR600F
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I have just about prepared myself mentally for this on Wednesday.

 

I know what I got to say about why this should not be made final:-

 

  1. Unfair to other unsecured creditors 10+
    Particularly if I made myself bankrupt or was made bankrupt
  2. Son suffers from ADHD and Aspergers.
  3. Son finishing A levels
  4. Daughter finishing GCSE
  5. Spouse paid the majority of deposit
  6. Spouse currently paying the majority of our mortgages.
  7. An unsecured debt benefiting from a high rate of interest compared to a secured debt.

There are few other bits and pieces.

 

I am not unduly worried about the charging order as they seem pritty pointless for jointly owned family homes and I actually have a far more serious problem that I need to find money for by 11/4/10 or we will be evicted anyway....

 

 

But at present I can't see past Wednesday......

 

 

What I really need to know is whether the hearing is the time to mention about a defective DN and collection charges (2K+) being added to a credit card debt.

 

Also the original paper work missed off the first four digits of the credit card number.

 

thanks

Hindsight is wonderful......

 

But now knowledge and advice are life savers:D

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although this thread is in relations to PPI

 

the last bit might be of int.

 

the judge has allowed a delay to allow pete to put in his claim.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/235540-pete-hfc-restons-now.html

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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yep

 

his was ppi but i cant see yours being considered any diff [re charges]

 

and if in their process [of the co] their dn must be correctly administered [which i'm sure must be so for this to move fwd to a co] if it is defective then the whole thing is unlawful?

 

just a thought

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hi CBR600F

 

How much is owing here?

 

You say they have added charges of £2000?

 

Is this a loan or a credit card debt?

 

Your court date is very close so fill in an income and expenditure spreadsheet to take with you :

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=17158&d=1268687658

WARNING TO ALL

Please be aware of acting on advice given by PM .Anyone can make mistakes and if advice is given on the main forum people can see it to correct it ,if given privately then no one can see it to correct it. Please also be aware of giving your personal details to strangers

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Unfortunately, the Charging Order hearing is not the place to mention about defective Default Notices or Collection Charges.

A Judge will advise that you should have mentioned this at the judgment hearing or at a Set Aside hearing.

 

If you did apply for a Set Aside of the CCJ then this would defer the Charging Order hearing but you would have to move quick.

 

Have a look at the links below on Setting Aside a CCJ -

 

A Guide To Setting Aside CCJ's You Never Received

CCJ removal inc. step by step guide

Applying for a Set-aside

Spamalot - CCJ and interest on debt. ***WON***

Setting aside the original CCJ of your CCA

 

Thereis a fee of £75.00 for the Set Aside application but you may be eligible for Fee Remission. Do a search for Court Form EX160.

 

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The reason why I believe the Default Notice is defective is that there is insufficient time allowed for delivery.

 

DN date Friday 21/08/2009

Remedy date by Monday the 07/09/2009

 

Up until last week I had not realised what day the 21st was!

 

Everything else looks spot on including the underlining so I didn't think I had a leg to stand on.

Hindsight is wonderful......

 

But now knowledge and advice are life savers:D

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dont think a DN is working days.??

so its ok.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

Link to post
Share on other sites

No the 14 days is not working days but they have to allow time for delivery !

 

1st class is 2 working days

2nd class is 4 working days

 

So by 1st class the DN would have been served Tuesday and 2nd class on Thursday.

 

So even IF HFC could prove they posted it on the Friday by 1st Class it would not have been served until Tuesday - 14 clear days I believe is Tuesday 8/9/9 or Thursday if they can't prove 1st Class and later if they can't prove they posted the same day.

Hindsight is wonderful......

 

But now knowledge and advice are life savers:D

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Also I have been looking at the copy of the agreement I have.

The agreement is dated 1/2/95 yet on the DN it says the agreement dated 25/1/95 ?

Hindsight is wonderful......

 

But now knowledge and advice are life savers:D

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oh i love HFC bashing!

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

If the DN is defective it will come out of the blue to them as they have so far not had my full attention due to many many other problems over the last 7 months.

Edited by CBR600F
One day I will learn how to tepy oops type!

Hindsight is wonderful......

 

But now knowledge and advice are life savers:D

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Also I have been looking at the copy of the agreement I have.

The agreement is dated 1/2/95 yet on the DN it says the agreement dated 25/1/95 ?

Any comments on this would be more than welcome.

 

Oh the agreement is actually the application for the card with a little box saying agreement date.

Hindsight is wonderful......

 

But now knowledge and advice are life savers:D

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Hi CBR600F how did it go today, have seen your postings too on http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/203298-guide-charging-orders-orders-6.html#post2840873

 

I hope it all went ok & look forward to your write up.

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Well I knew that it was not going to be easy!

 

The judge was all very polite but dispite all arguments finalized the CO.

 

BUT she made it very clear that it is a CO NOT an order for sale.

 

She also got the sol to say that HFC are not intending to try and force a sale.

 

More importantly she actually said that it is a good thing because although it becomes a secured debt there is no interest and that the court charges are added to the debt again with no interest sol confirmed this.

 

I have to stress that she made it clear that this was actually a good thing as it maybe many years before we sell our property and that HFC have in effect, given me an interest free loan!

 

The comments that my wife made in her letter that we sent were noted but were insufficient to stop the CO.

 

HOWEVER she then said that if HFC did try to force a sale that comments were VERY serious and relevant.

 

Reading between the lines in this she was basically saying that HFC would not see a penny until the time that I wanted them to.

 

I am going to have a few more beers and hopefully a good nights sleep don't actually think I need any beer to sleep as I do feel relieved that the worst a CC company can do does not actually do themselves any good!

 

I did mention about the DN being probably defective but as on other posts she was very clear that the hearing was for the CO and if I wanted to submit any objections then go to the FSO (I think) or apply for a set aside.

 

The sol was very quiet during the hearing but I am sure I saw him cringe when I mentioned the DN....

 

I am now going to put this behind me for next few days and consider my options.

 

2 down 13 to go!

Hindsight is wonderful......

 

But now knowledge and advice are life savers:D

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Glad to hear your update after all the worry you have gone through, you definitely deserve a beer this evening . Shame these things are becoming more & more freely given though :mad:

 

Did you get the judge to set a "no further enforcement" condition to this CO so that later on down the line they dont sneak back in to try to force the sale? All advice like this will help us all enormously. thanks

CAG NEEDS FUNDS PLEASE DONATE AS MUCH OR AS LITTLE WHERE POSSIBLE

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The judge made it very very clear to the sol that the objections made by my wife were extremely serious and if HFC change there mind at a future date they would be taken into account - I think she was basically warning the sol not to waste the courts time as they would not grant a force sale order.

 

So I doubt I will be hearing from them for a while.

 

Objections were

Wife paid a high percentage of the deposit 80-90%.

Her income is currently paying 80% of the mortgage

Sons taking his A levels

Daughters taking her O levels

Son Suffers from ADHD and Aspergers.

Edited by CBR600F
Spelling again and the objections

Hindsight is wonderful......

 

But now knowledge and advice are life savers:D

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When I tried to get a variation order for original summary judgment I wrote a covering letter that included in it a comment along lines of "short of a miracle we are about to be evicted by London Mortgages". We came within 24 hours of this actually happening which was just one of the reasons we ended up in a mess with HFC's CCA.

 

I am just wondering whether that letter addressed to the court manager would have been passed on to HFC???

Edited by CBR600F

Hindsight is wonderful......

 

But now knowledge and advice are life savers:D

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  • 2 weeks later...

When this all started I was in a bad place father-in-law terminally ill, mortgage problems other priority debt problems.

 

But I am back now and have several scores to settle.

 

So I want to get this sorted and I am therefore considering my various options for a setaside.

 

1. Charges and interest.

2. Defective DN - no service time as was dated on a Friday.

3. Collection charges added.

4. Original POC only had 12 digits of a 16 digit account no.

5. It now appear that the T&Cs may be defective as there is no mention of default charges or interest after default.

 

I have uploaded the T&Cs, although a poor copy, I believe it is a copy of the original as it had mirrored marks that coincide with the application.

I have had to do a bit of processing on this as the original scanned picture was way to big!

 

Could someone have a look: -

HFC :: GMCardTCsLowRes.jpg picture by cbr600fs1985 - Photobucket

Hindsight is wonderful......

 

But now knowledge and advice are life savers:D

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Oh and I just realised by reading the following: -

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-2848490.html

 

That they had got bored with the photo copier and only went back 3 years of statements or so not the 15years that they say I had the account for....

 

I have no idea what the significance of that is.

 

As money permits I will SAR them but at present I am letting sleeping dogs lie. Mums got a minor op to remove a tumor on Friday, got to sort out mortgage arrears and son's, fingers crossed, is off to Uni in September so I have enough *real* problems as it is!

 

Probably more info than people want to know but a "problem etc etc etc

Hindsight is wonderful......

 

But now knowledge and advice are life savers:D

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Hi, thanks for replying to my post. Just had a look at your case as you mentioned it. Cant really offer any concrete help as pretty green with all this stuff but you have my support and best wishes. Totally agree with you... a problem shared. The guys and gals on here who are clued up are a godsend and i am sure will help you as much as they can. Good luck

 

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where is the agreement?

thats rubbish t&c's

 

dx

  • Haha 1

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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