Council Tax/Bailiffs

[Acropolis]

Hi all, am new here and just want to check some information I have been given about dealing with a bailiff.

 

Last year I moved into the house, and contacted the council to give them my details for the council tax.

 

They sent me out the bill, but it was in the wrong name, I contacted them and informed them of the correct name. This went on and on and on, and they never did do anything about it. I said I would pay when I recieved a bill through in my name and not before.

 

Well in the end it would appear as if it went to court, cause November/December time I got a letter through from Equita, saying they had the case, I immediately, within 10 minutes of getting the letter, rang the number of bailiff, and explained the situation, he said he would look into it and get back to me. He never did.

 

Anywya a couple of weeks ago, another bailiff turned up on the door step, I again explained the situation to him, he said they were not gonig to deal with it and they would pass the case back to the council, and I should contact them to deal with it. Which I did. Whilst he was here, he did not come in the house, did not ask for payment or talk about how it was going to be paid, and did not make a note of any possesions in the house.

 

Saturday morning, the council finally pulled their finger out, and a bill turned up in my name.

 

Before I had chance to ring them Monday morning, as i was stood in the living room, I saw someone walking up the drive, he looked at me and clearly saw me, walked up to the door, put a letter through and walked off again. Made no attempt to talk to me what so ever.

 

I opened the letter, and it was from the bailiffs saying, they are coming back tomorrow to take my goods, if I am in or not, and have listed the vehicle parked on the drive as what they are going to take. I immediately rang him, to try and talk to him about this. Tried explaining the situation, and that I thought from what the previous bailiff had said, that they were no longer dealing with it. to be greated by the response of "tough" basically. I explained that the vehicle isnt mine, and is a contract hire vehicle through the company. This didnt seem to bother him at all and said he would taking it anyway. He ended the call by saying "tough sh*t, I'll be back tomorrow and take you stuff" and put the phone down on me. I did try and offer to pay the debt, but he wouldnt listen to me. The debt has gone up from £839.14 to just over £1006

 

Not been too happy with this, I tried speaking to thier office, and was greated by the same response saying that I need to speak to the bailiff.

 

I tried speaking to the council and they were not very useful, saying there is nothing they can do.

 

So I went to the council neighbourhood office and spoke to someone there, she spoke to the bailiff and told him to back off, and she recieved the same treatment and attitude I had from him.

 

She has basically aadvised me that as they have not been in the property they are unable to remove any goods from the house, or force entry into the property, and they are unable to remove the vehicle as it is not mine and belongs to the contract hire company. She has said to ignore the bailiffs until they get bored and pass the debt back to the council to deal with, at which time they will contact me and I can then settle it with them in a civilised manner.

 

From what she has said and from what I have been able to find on line and here, am I correct in thinking the follow.

 

1. The maximum charge should be £881.64, from the 2 visits and the origanal debt, as no levy has been made.

 

2. Basically the bailiff can do nothing if he comes back today unless I let him in the house, which isnt going to happen.

 

3. What can I do if he attempts to remove the vehicle, which he has been told isnt mine. Do I stop him physically or just call the police and let them deal with it.

 

 

I do own another vehicle, which is at the moment registered in my name at this address, and which was until this evening at the top of the road, which is now well hidden 5 miles away i the middle of a 54 acre estate, he's got no chance of finding it there. The vehicle is also in the process of been re-registered into the company name which I own, as from the beginning of december 2009, it has been used as a company vehicle by my engineers, and is covered by the company fleet policy.

 

I called the CAB, and they said just send the council a cheque for the money and even though they say they cant take payment they will bank the anyway and therfore the problem will go away, does this sound right?

 

I can honestly say I have never been spokent to in such a disgusting manner as I have been from this sub-human species of person who I spoke to today, how they ever actually manage to get anything sorted other than by bullying people, cheating people and breaking the law is beyond me, cause it sure isnt achieved through good customer service relations that's for sure. I appreciate it probably isnt an easy job to do, and must come across people who are a real pain in the back side to get to pay etc, but surely everyone deserves to be treated with some basic respect and not spoken to like piece of sh*t on the bottom of thier shoe.

[MARTIN3030]

Welcome to the site.

Unfortunately,a story we have heard so many time.

The CAB has given you some good pointers.

You appear to have the vehicle out of sight.

Your story is is not one that smacks of evasion,you did what you thought was enough,and are taking pro active steps to sort it.

The correct thing (or best route) would have been for you to have tried to have the warrant set aside as soon as you knew,and paid the Council.

So have you been given any paperwork with the bailiffs fees on ?

As per CABs advice I would try to pay the council directly,if you have online banking then do it this way via the Councils website.

The Council appear to have messed up here big style,I nwould be sending them a SAR to put a case together against them.

Doubtless others will be here to add more.

[seanamarts]

First thing, if you can pay the debt off now then do it asap via your local council website, or pay off as much as you can. Secondly I would write to the council heading it 'Formal Complaint'.

Talking to these people on the phone is often like hitting your head against a brick wall, they are not interested in your waffle they just want your money by hook or by crook. If the council say its not their problem its in the hands of the bailiff thats just poppycock, they Are responsible for thier bailiffs actions. If you get no joy from the council via your complaint then you can write to your local government ombudsman who will look into the matter for you. Its obvious that there has been a mistake, but its always hard to get some one from the council to admit it. Remember DONT LET THE BAILIFF IN.

[Acropolis]

I must have rnag the council about 50 times in the end to tell them, and there is only so much you can do.

 

I even rang them after I had the first letter through from the bailiffs and they still weren't intereted.

 

I tried to make payments yesterday but no one was interested at the council or Equita. I said I would pay when they would give me a breakdown of the costs which they have put on top but they wouldnt until I had paid, so I didnt pay.

 

With regards to the cars, yes the one that is still registered in my name, althoguh the log book is with DVLA been changed, has been hidden away just to make sure it doesnt get taken, and the other one is still sat on my drive at the momnet and will remain so, as it is contract hire and not in my name, therefore, from my understanding, not leagally allowed to take it. Not that I think this will have much influence over this particular bailiff.

 

I have absolutely no paperwork from the bailiff at all with any fee's on, the only thing I have is what he shoved through the door yesterday morning. Other than that and the first letter I had off them, I have had no letters or anything from them. The only thing I had from the council is the bill that arrived Saturday morning in my name, and the 2 previous bills in the wrong name.

 

Unfortunately though, I had s small fire in the house just before christmas and these were lost during the fire, so have no paper work of any description really.

 

I personally find the whole thing very entertaining to a point, it is not getting to me. I was very annoyed yesterday orignally, but after speaking to a few people and learning a bit more and relised there isnt actually anything they can really do about it, I dont care what he trys now to be honest he can try what he wants.

[Mr Worried]

Hi Acroplis

 

Firstly get that car on your drive up to the 54 acre site.

 

Martin has answerd a lot of what I was gonna say, but you really need to speak to your local council office again and get them to call him off ( they can do this ) and in your case even more so since they ' messed up' in the first place.

 

Can you pay the outstanding LO ? if not can you pay , say an amount to the council?

 

In my scenario such as yours and with the B's threatning I paid a few hundred quid asap then agreed the rest monthly, they then called the B off, I then arranged with Rossies to pay his fee £24.50 within the next few weeks they did not agree and it actually took me 9 weeks to pay them.

 

So sit tight and do not worry.

 

Mr W

[Acropolis]

I can indeed afford to pay the full amount. I am fortunate in that respect that this is not down to not been able to pay, its been not to not willing to pay until I actually recieve a bill through.

 

The car out the front needs to stay, it is works vehicle, and as i am on call and need to be getting to site, I need to keep it handy, and parking it in the street isnt an option really, as I live in a cul-de-sac and if I parked it out on the main street, I have a feeling it would have a few less parts on it by the morning if you know what I mean, and they already have the registration number of the vehicle. I have all the proof here that the vehicle is not mine, which I will happily show to them as soon as they come knocking again.

 

I have given up with the local council, they are bloody useless, I will just send them a cheque or pay on line, and keep having fun with the little git that shows up at the door.

 

He is going to have a hard time trying to bully me into anything and force me to make a mistake, as I am not the kind of person who is easily imtimidated and I certainly wont loose any sleep over it, and I dont care if the neighbours hear either so he cant try that one either lol

[Mr Worried]

Hi Acropolis

 

Listen m8, as you say you can pay the amount, so imo just do it get the receipt and ' hey presto' you have beat the bailiff.

 

Simple, then if you want to ' play with him ' then do so but your best moving on.

 

You will receive a letter from equita in a few weeks to say you have paid the LO blah blah with a request for the B's fee's, scrutinise the charges and if they are unlawfull then we'll help you let them know. but if I was you I would close up shop now.

 

Just speaking from experience!!

 

Cheers

 

Mr W

Edited January 19, 2010 by Mr Worried
Spelling

[Acropolis]

It will be getting paid this week, but straight to the council as the CAB said.

 

Just been looking at something though, the bailiff that came out yesterday is indeed a certified bailiff, but when doing an online check he shows are working another company and Equita, showing as working for Global Certified Bailiff Services, does this matter? or is it simply he is in effect a sub contractor carrying out work on behalf of Equita, or should his certficiate say Equita?

[fluffy_bunny]

Should say either equita or be in just his name - i.e. he should only appear once!

 

Call MOJ to clarify as the online search is not always up to date

[seanamarts]

I really wouldnt send the council a cheque they might send it back to you and tell you to pay the bailiff and you will be back to square one, paying online is the best way to go at this stage, but be warned the council may take out the charges for the bailiff which will still leave you x amount to pay on your council tax. Write to the bailiff company and request a breakdown of charges.. at this point they can only charge you at most for two visits, 1st visit £24.00 2nd visit £18.50 and only that if no levy has been made, if they have levied on a car and is on HP etc then the levy is void.

[jimbo45]

Hi all

Not ROSSIES again

 

I must have letters being prepared to around 50 Councils now with FORMAL COMPLAINTS about these ****.

 

How they STILL manage to retain their contracts with councils must only be due to either "The Golf Course" or some "Lodge meeting talk" .

 

 

Many Many post on this about Council Tax collections.

 

I repeat again.

 

1) YOU DO NOT EVER EVER have to speak or deal with the bailiff in ANY WAY whatsoever.

 

2) Under no Circumstances EVER EVER EVER EVER ( X 10,0000) LET THEM IN

 

3) Keep all cars etc away from your street.

 

4) WRITE (Recorded Delivery) to the council enclosing a cheque for something and offer to pay off the debt -- even if the council refuse at first THEY MUST EVENTUALLY TAKE BACK THE DEBT

 

5) Don't waste your time phoning the council -- even if its not an Indian Call centre the phone answering robots will just mouth over and over again "You must deal with the Bailiff's". -- Utter 100% PURE BOVINE SCATOLOGY or B/S in our language.

 

6) MAXIMUM FEES a Baliff can charge is 24.50 GBP First visit, 18.00 GBP for 2nd visit -- and THAT'S ALL -- even if they attempt to visit again and again. If they know they aren't getting in they won't bother --why do it when there are other "Victims" who haven't read this Forum who they can charge 110 GBP or more in "Van fees" etc etc.

 

7) The council can and probably will add this 42.50 GBP to the bill -- you'll have to pay it - but its a lot better than the OUTRAGOUS and EXTORTIONATE fees THESE SHEER **** try and get away with.

 

8) If it DOES go to court --ignore any threats of Prison -- another favourite scare tactic these SCUMBAGS use - you've offered to pay (keep copies of the recorded delivery letters sent to the council) - the magistrate will only make you pay what you can afford. -- It's HIGHLY UNLIKELY that it will go to court. What usually happens is that the bailiff's give up and return the debt to the council.

Depending on the council you'll get another "Threatogram" - this time pounce again with another (reduced) pay scheme offer.

 

 

THE GOLDEN RULE IS NEVER LET THESE DIRTBAGS IN -- NO LEVY NO CHARGES OTHER THAN THE LEGALLY PROSCRIBED 2 VISIT CHARGES.

 

 

It's DISGUSTING tax collection resorts to this 1100 year old totally FEUDAL system.

 

No wonder we are the laughing stock of Europe in these matters.

 

Good luck and ANOTHER NAIL IN ROSSIES COFFIN.

 

Please pass details about CAG to all your colleagues -- it's about time we ENDED the use of Bailiff's for harassing people over Council Tax problems.

 

Cheers

jimbo

[Acropolis]

The debt will be paid by the end of the week, there is no question of that.

 

I tried paying it yesterday with the bailiffs but they were not interested in taking it, the office was saying you need to speak to the bailiff and all he was saying was he wanted to take the car.

 

Just out of interest, and i know he cant take the car, but if it went for auction, as it is brand new and only 4 months old, it will fetch considerably more than the debt is worth, what happens to the excess money from the auction?

 

Just checking about the certificate thing. If there is a company listed on his certificate, am I correct in thinking he can only collect debts for that company and no others? Therefore if he turns back up, and his certificate does indeed state another company, then in that circumstance he is not as far as that debt is concerned a cerftified bailiff, and therefore has no rights what so ever, and it would be safe to open the door to him etc? Not that I plan on doing so, but useful to know where I stand with it.

If the certificate has just his name on it, then he can collect debts for whoever he likes?

 

MOJ was mentioned to ring and check, does anyone have a number, and what is MOJ, i am guessing Ministry of Justice?

 

 

 

Just to point out this is with Equita.

[hallowitch]

Ministry of Justice Public Register of Bailiffs on 020 3334 6355

[seanamarts]

he wants your car so that he can bump his charges up more. If he does take the car then you have 5 days to pay the debt plus bailiff fees plus other costs to get it back or it goes to auction. when car is sold which will be for a ridiculous amount and once fees are taken out plus auction costs then you will get whats left. lets say for a £10000 car you will be lucky if you get £3000 back.

[seanamarts]

Going a little off topic here but its an interesting question I have if any one can answer it. Now some one told me and I cant say who at this point, that some bailiffs take debtors car to auction, buy the said cars at a very very low price and then resell them on at private sales. My question is, can they do this? and is this a reason for why they are so intent of getting cars off debtors as quick as they can?

[fluffy_bunny]

No they cannot do this - it is illegal.

 

I'm sure it's stated in the laws of distress.

 

This is why very few have their own auction facilities (B&S do) as it is seen by many as a conflict of interest.

[ploddertom]

If you are having hassle with the Council, either escalate higher up the chain as those at the front cannot do anything. In conjunction with this contact your local Councillor ASAP and appraise him of the situation. I am sure the local press would love a story like this.

 

Going back a bit and am not quite sure whether I got this right. You say this was for the wrong name - was this substantially different or just a slight spelling mistake eg Brown instead of Grey or Smyth instead of Smith - the first can be taken to be he wrong person but the second on the basis of probabilities could be taken to be correct Initially demand was for the wrong name, I assume this is now sorted but they have now immediately handed it to the Bailiff without giving you chance to pay or come to an arrangement.

 

Demand from the Council how much the LO was for in your correct name, how much is still outstanding and when they passed it to the Bailiff. Demand from the Bailiff company a statement of your account including screenshot - this is not a request for personal info under the data Protection Act so no £10 fee for a SAR is payable. They are obliged to give you this.

 

PT

[Acropolis]

Well despite his adamant threats yesterday that we would be back today and taking my goods, no show so far.

 

He'd better hurry up as I'm going out in a bit for the evening, well unless he wants a conversation with the dog lol

[josephbloggs]

would it be possible for the company to email the details of the car then you can print it out and show him IF he comes back, which i doubt he will.

 

seanamarts, any reputable firm would want the vehicle to fetch the most amount of money because it pays their fees, and obviously the more of the debt it pays off the better it looks for the council/authority.

although, i too heard a similar story about a car repo firm, they would take it to auction after taking all the added extras off it, get their mate to buy it as though it was a bog standard, then give him all the parts for it so he could put it on his forecourt as the original top of the range model it was when repo'd. it was on the news a few years ago... somewhere in the north east i think.

[cosmaximum]

Pop down to the council office and pay off the debt as you said you are financially able to do. Get a receipt and pop in to your local library or shop that has a photocpopier. Expand the receipt to A3 size - the size of your door window. Stick it in your door window and smile when the bailiff turns up tomorrow.

[MARTIN3030]

Seems there is now a plan of action - good to hear it.50 phone calls ?????

Acropolis once things are sorted,get that SAR off to the council.

Make sure that you ask for transcripts or call logs of all telephone calls that you have made between XXX and XXX they are obliged to include them..if you request it.

The reason that Councils keep getting away with this is because no one takes them to book.

Your SAR should give you all the ammo that you need to do this-then take it to your Local Ombudsman and/ or MP and get their A**** kicked.

[MARTIN3030]

BTW-Acropolis,I happen to know what you have done for your local community-to be treated like this is an absolute disgrace.

[wonkeydonkey]

As I see it you had a bill correctly addressed to you (finally), which you received yesterday if the date on that bill is recent and you pay it asap then surely you have paid the bill on receipt? this then has to be seen as an admission by the Council that the previous bills sent were as you say addressed to the wrong person and therefore not your responsibility ?

Is this logic or lunacy

WD

[MARTIN3030]

As I see it you had a bill correctly addressed to you (finally), which you received yesterday if the date on that bill is recent and you pay it asap then surely you have paid the bill on receipt? this then has to be seen as an admission by the Council that the previous bills sent were as you say addressed to the wrong person and therefore not your responsibility ?

Is this logic or lunacy

WD

 

 

Depends on which side of the fence you are on.

I would call it neither logic nor lunacy,moreso obligation...albeit a little late in the day.

[MARTIN3030]

Any news further on this,dont forget to keep us updated.