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    • I have read through a number of similar threads, but one thing i'm not sure how to proceed about is that I live abroad in the middle east and have done for several years. The claim letter was sent to my parents address and I really don't want them to be harassed about this. I am sure I sent the original creditor a registered letter with my change of address but can't find this currently. I am not in a position to pay this, and tend to come back to the UK to see family at most once a year (less since Covid), so not particular bothered about my financial score...more concerned about harassment of my parents. I have not registered on the gov gateway or anything like that.  Details below (as best as i can), and thank you for taking the time to look into it. Also redacted claim form attached: Which Court have you received the claim from ? Civil National Business Centre (Northampton) If possible please scan redact and upload a full page copy of page 1 of the claim form. (not the response page or AOS) Name of the Claimant ? PRA Group (UK) Limited   How many defendant's  joint or self ? Self   Date of issue – top right hand corner of the claim form – this in order to establish the time line you need to adhere to. 23/5/24   ^^^^^ NOTE : WHEN CALCULATING THE TIMELINE - PLEASE REMEMBER THAT THE DATE ON THE CLAIMFORM IS ONE IN THE COUNT [example: Issue date 01.03.2014 + 19 days (5 days for service + 14 days to acknowledge) = 19.03.2014 + 14 days to submit defence = 02.04.2014] = 33 days in total   Date of issue XX + 19 days ( 5 day for service + 14 days to acknowledge) = XX + 14 days to submit defence = XX (33 days in total)  if your defence filing date falls on a W/End, you must file by friday @4PM Tues, 11/6/24 (19 days)  Thurs, 25/6/24 (33 days)   Particulars of Claim   What is the claim for – the reason they have issued the claim?  The Claimant claims the sum of £7926 for an outstanding debt owed. On 20/4/18 the Defendent entered into an agreement with Lloyds Bank for a Credit Card under reference [16 numbers]. On 10/5/22 the Defendant defaulted on the agreement with an outstanding balance of £7296. On 28/11/23 the debt of £7296 was assigned to PRA Group (UK) Limited, who itself assigned the debt to PRA Group UK Portfolios Ltd on 30/12/23. Notices of assignment were sent to the Defendant in accordance with S136 Law of Property Act 1925. The Claimant has instructed PRA Group (UK) to act on its behalf and the CLAIMANT CLAIMS 1. The sum of £7925   What is the total value of the claim? £8481 Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? No   Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? Yes   Did you inform the claimant of your change of address? I believe I sent a letter by registered mail of a change in address to abroad in 2021. Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? Credit card   When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? After   Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? Online   Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Yes   Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Debt purchaser   Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? Not personally - probably sent to my parents   Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? Not personally - probably sent to my parents   Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? Not personally - probably sent to my parents Why did you cease payments? Unable to afford, living abroad   What was the date of your last payment? Unsure (probably 2021)   Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? No   Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? No     Claim form 23-5-24.pdf
    • While we wait for someone to explain how farage is any better than sunak  .. if not worse   One of many likely upcoming belly laughs   Reform chairman Richard Tice has accused the Tories of (reform like) “dirty tricks” after one of his party’s candidates withdrew his papers to stand at the last minute and endorsed former cabinet minister Sir Gavin Williamson. In a dramatic final 24 hours before nominations closed there had been fevered speculation that as many as six Tory MPs and other candidates could defect to Reform after Nigel Farage decided to stand in Clacton and become leader. But instead no Tories switched and Tom Wellings, the Reform candidate for the new seat of Stone, Great Wryly and Penkridge in Staffordshire, quit and put out a statement endorsing Sir Gavin.   Who does he think he is an Anderson, a Carswell !!! was heard at the reform HQ pub ... as Candidate brushed aside by Farage in clacton to run as an independent    Tice accuses Tories of ‘dirty tricks’ to persuade Reform candidates to stand down WWW.INDEPENDENT.CO.UK Exclusive: A furious row has broken out after a Reform candidate’s last minute defection to the Tories   :ROFL  
    • See what you think of the attached. I have to do some proofreading of an English grammar book for an Italian publisher this weekend - for money! - so I'm afraid corrections and suggestions will come in dribs & drabs.  I've totally knackered the layout, the numbering and the order of your Exhibits but there will be several versions done so don't worry about that ATM. Your arguments are superb. What is less superb is the way you jump from one to the other and back again, so I haven't changed your words, but I have moved the paragraphs around and given each section a heading. New bits are shown in red. Crossed out crossed out in black is something you've quoted from the government Code of Practice, but that has since been withdrawn so unfortunately that argument has to go. Your paras 7 & 8 don't harm your case but to me are waffle and can go.  Keeping the arguments clear & concise will always impress a judge. IMPORTANT - did you ever send Simple Simon a CPR request?   Defendant's WS - version 2.pdf
    • Björn Ulvaeus appeared on stage in East Yorkshire at a conference held at the Bridlington Spa.View the full article
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      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
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      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Welcome - illegal repo in contravention of section 92 and unfair relationship ** WON **


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Hi DofH, does that also apply to the witness statements submitted by legal managers of car finance companies?

:?:

 

Is this in documents submitted to a court?

 

If not no - but if they are misrepresenting the facts - depending on the circumstances - it can be anything from a cock up to fraud.

Edited by dadofholly
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  • 1 month later...

After all these years spent fighting against them I'm phased very little by their tricks and games, in fact I expect nothing less from them. This last effort is especially despicable though, let's hope it doesn't end up backfiring on them eh?? :!:

 

Backfired! :whoo:

 

Not long now folks and this whole crazy story will be all over :-D

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Backfired! :whoo:

 

Not long now folks and this whole crazy story will be all over :-D

 

Are you going to keep us in suspenders until 'it's all over'?

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Hi wbdf

 

I used to be a regular on CAG but in starting a new business didn't really have enough time and had to give up my CAG addiction ;) I remember this case when it first started and boy oh boy do you have the patience of a saint.

 

Firstly I just wanted to say congratulations it been a hard won fight and thankfully you stuck to your guns.

 

I can't say to much in open forum however you are not the first person to deal with the delightful Mr P and his squirmy answers in court nor is this the first time he has had to answers questions on this subject in court.

 

I cannot say more than that (which I think speaks for itself) but I had a very ill baby at the time all of my welcome dramas occured and therefore could not pursue it as I wOuld have liked - the opportunity to be made whole and not have to spend years on it was just too much to turn down.

 

But the biggest WHOOP WHOOP to you

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Are you going to keep us in suspenders until 'it's all over'?

Well I don't suppose there's any real reason now why I can't say...

 

The trial window is set for 7th May to 24th May and there will be an interlocutory hearing next week to decide one or two outstanding issues :razz:

 

We received directions back in Feb with regard to the final hearing, a DJ had reviewed the case and decided that all that was required to go forward with was a very brief general round up of the issues and listing questionnaires; no court bundles or further evidence or any of that nonsense. The other side dragged their heels, failed to co-operate and ended up being late filing. When I did eventually receive their LQ I noticed that they had ticked the box for additional directions required and applications attached, but they hadn't attached anything to the copy they sent me! :-x

 

Anyway, it then transpired that they had made an application to court to get the case transferred to Mercantile court and allocated to Mulit-track. I believe that they had deliberately tried to sneak this past me, and they didn't exactly fall over themselves to deny it shall we say! It appears they were attempting to get the case heard by a different High Court judge and had included as their supporting 'evidence' that the outstanding issues to be decided were those of agency relationships and fiduciary relationships. No bloody wonder they wanted to sneak it past me! The issues of agency relationships and fiduciary relationships had already been dealt with at the appeal and the only remaining issue left to decide on is Unfair Relationship; as was decided at the case management conference back in September last year :mad2:

 

Generally speaking, (in my opinion), they have never been able to stomach the fact that they lost at High Court to an LiP and effectually tried to get a second High Court Judge to overturn the judgment!

 

Back to today....directions received from court. Application for transfer to Mercantile Court dismissed without a hearing, (they had requested a hearing to decide whether the case should be transferred). The case management is to remain with County Court :oops:

 

There's so much more to the story, I could literally go on for ages!

I made an application of my own not so long ago, a Part 18 request to clarify the exact details of the payment and receipt of secret commission. They failed to reply and so I had to apply to the court to enforce compliance. They then sent me some cobbled together nonsense which made no sense at all and labelled it a response! I told them it was limited, unsatisfactory and contradictory but they just ignored me. The court have also today decided that my application to enforce compliance under part 18 should be heard :oops:

 

I have no reason not to attend, as far as I'm concerned they haven't fully complied with my request and I am quite content to let a judge decide what needs to be disclosed and what doesn't :madgrin:

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Hi wbdf

 

I used to be a regular on CAG but in starting a new business didn't really have enough time and had to give up my CAG addiction ;) I remember this case when it first started and boy oh boy do you have the patience of a saint.

 

Firstly I just wanted to say congratulations it been a hard won fight and thankfully you stuck to your guns.

 

I can't say to much in open forum however you are not the first person to deal with the delightful Mr P and his squirmy answers in court nor is this the first time he has had to answers questions on this subject in court.

 

I cannot say more than that (which I think speaks for itself) but I had a very ill baby at the time all of my welcome dramas occured and therefore could not pursue it as I wOuld have liked - the opportunity to be made whole and not have to spend years on it was just too much to turn down.

 

But the biggest WHOOP WHOOP to you

Andie it's so good to hear from you, you were always an inspiration to us :-) I honestly don't blame you at all for settling, I can tell you that this case has damn near killed me at times! It has engulfed my life for the last 2 and a half years and deprived me of times I can never get back.

 

The ironic thing is that I would've been happy to walk away after the appeal, I considered that my victory and I needed nothing else, but the other side were too contemptuous to agree. Well that was a one time offer and they threw it back in my face, they know they are wrong, they know they broke the law, they know they still have so much to hide but still they refuse to show remorse or an ounce of decency or integrity.

It's mainly their arrogance that spurs me to go on, he still deliberately addresses me in lower case letters just to show his disdain for me! Needless to say I return the courtesy :razz: Today he asked me to withdraw my Part 18 app. but after he addressed me in lower case I felt ill-inclined to assist him! :-x

 

What the Hell I've come this far I might as well see it through to the end :oops:

 

As for Mr P, I haven't heard hide nor hair of him since the trial! He didn't even show up for the appeal! I'm fairly sure I've got the measure of him; another keyboard warrior that has plenty to say on paper...

Oh well, 2 more hearings to go and I can put this behind me, although I will always be on hand to assist anybody that finds themselves in a similar situation and I suspect that is welcome's biggest worry.....:!:

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That is ABSOLUTELY their worry and something that I can't do - that was one of the main reasons for removing myself from CAG for so long as I couldn't bear to see things that I would like to advise or respond too but am not allowed .

 

But at the end of the day I was right and its been 2.5 years since I've been welcome free there's absolutely no trace of them for me and my sons hospital got a nice donation out of it so good can come from crap ;) x

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That is ABSOLUTELY their worry and something that I can't do - that was one of the main reasons for removing myself from CAG for so long as I couldn't bear to see things that I would like to advise or respond too but am not allowed .

 

But at the end of the day I was right and its been 2.5 years since I've been welcome free there's absolutely no trace of them for me and my sons hospital got a nice donation out of it so good can come from crap ;) x

I'm so genuinely pleased for you x

You did what was right for you and your family and we mustn't forget that that is more important than anything else. Being welcome free is only something I can dream of at the mo! :madgrin:

I honestly believe you have helped a lot more people than you think, when welcome offered what they did to you it was clearly because you were on to something that they didn't want made public, in my book that's a win! Just shows that if you make a stand against their dodgy antics you can succeed, you just need to be a bit brave :-)

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Hi Andie - and great to see you here again.

 

I learnt something recentley after being in court myself concerning so called confidentiality clauses. (Comes under the Human rights Act - and was mentioned by the judge in the case).

 

Can i just ask you if your case reached court - or was settled out of court?

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  • 2 weeks later...
looking forward to hear final result of this,as i also have commission complaint with them.good luck

Now therein lies the problem - for them that is! I strongly suspect they have only taken this case so far to try and make an example of me to anybody else wanting to make a commission claim. I bet they're regretting that decision right now, if only they picked on someone less stubborn eh??! :-)

Not long now....

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Hope all goes well this week wannabe. This whole sorry story will soon be totally over.

Hello! I think this weeks antics have been delayed a little, I spoke to court this morning and they have said an order is currently being raised and I should soon receive notification of directions on what the judge has decided to do with it.

If you remember the other side failed to co-operate with me when we were to file our case summaries, schedules of issues and LQs and so I filed my own without them. They eventually got round to filing their own stuff, late as usual, and it turned out to be different to what I had put forward. The court will now have decided which proposal to go with or whether to make an order of its own initiative, I've just got to wait a few more days for it to be written up and sent out.

 

Also we had a little hearing a couple of weeks back to hear my application on my Part 18 request, turns out their response was inadequate as their legal team had failed to sign it or verify it with a statement of truth as is outlined in Part 18 subsections 2.1 & 3. The judge had no option then but to make an order against them :-D

 

I don't know what he was more bothered about - the fact that I had said it or the fact that I knew it!

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Hello! I think this weeks antics have been delayed a little, I spoke to court this morning and they have said an order is currently being raised and I should soon receive notification of directions on what the judge has decided to do with it.

If you remember the other side failed to co-operate with me when we were to file our case summaries, schedules of issues and LQs and so I filed my own without them. They eventually got round to filing their own stuff, late as usual, and it turned out to be different to what I had put forward. The court will now have decided which proposal to go with or whether to make an order of its own initiative, I've just got to wait a few more days for it to be written up and sent out.

 

Also we had a little hearing a couple of weeks back to hear my application on my Part 18 request, turns out their response was inadequate as their legal team had failed to sign it or verify it with a statement of truth as is outlined in Part 18 subsections 2.1 & 3. The judge had no option then but to make an order against them :-D

 

I don't know what he was more bothered about - the fact that I had said it or the fact that I knew it!

 

:lol: love it

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Don't panic, this thread looks set to continue for a little while longer yet :razz:

 

Does anybody know where my mate dbabylon went?? Looks like all his previous posts have been removed and any further input is not welcome-d....

Hmmm.... bye then, I'll miss our little chats :pout:

 

Anyway back to the order of the day; which came in the post from court this morning :-)

 

It is ordered that we attend a CMC on 29th May, time estimate 30 mins.

I think the last trial window has gone out the window!

 

I'm so pleased :eyebrows:

 

Another CMC, the last one was so much fun I can't wait to go back and do exactly the same thing all over again! Doh...hang on a minute... isn't that called wasting the court's time???! If only welcome could stick to one story, eh?

It was already decided at the last CMC way back in September that the issues to form the basis of the rehearing are whether the defendant paid a secret commission and whether the relationship was unfair. But then the defendant submitted a completely different set of issues to the court in February that haven't been agreed by anybody at all and contradict what was decided before! Why am I not surprised??

Looking forward to this one :lol:

 

The best thing is that with a little time extension the other side have got plenty of time to respond to my 2nd Part 18 request and I'll have enough time to ensure they do :razz:

 

It shouldn't take them too long to reply really, they only have to tell me which of their 2 latest versions of events is the truth and which one is the lie..

I'll be damned if I'm going to fall for that old trick again :-x Their written defence denied all knowledge of any commission but then come the trial day they decide to act as if they hadn't even written that defence! The "new" defence was full of all sorts of different numbers and percentages that they've never mentioned before, never mind they had no evidence or that it contradicted the evidence already present :mad2:

No chance this time...they are going to tell me exactly what they will be relying on at trial and I am going to hold them to that like you wouldn't believe!!

The filthy, dirty, underhand lawyer tricks are not going to wash with me any more.

 

Let's hope they have realised that their lies are causing them more trouble than it's worth and they just decide to be honest and tell the truth this time :flypig:

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Has this not technicaly gone to trial once already - and they still keep changing their version?

 

Maybe time to look at a possible strike out application - as they are clearly wasting the Courts, and your time, and are clerly clutching at straws by continuing to try something that works - rather than provide a true reflection of events.

Edited by dadofholly
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I know a good Barrister who has the measure of Welcome and was going to call Palmer as a witness, in a case i know of very well - but the opposition discontinued and paid nealry £2K of costs rather than allow him to be called.

 

Also have evidence of what you can descirbe as a conspiracey to pervert the course of justice, files being drawn up, OFT informed and interested and Police next in line.

 

The Barrister may well work on a CFA basis.

 

Would report your case to the Office of Fair Trading - have contact details if you would like them.

 

Oh and if there brief is stating evidence that he knows cannot be true - report him to the SRA.

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Wow, there's a lot to think about!

Sometimes I genuinely don't know what to do for the best, all I ever wanted was to see was some justice.

As much as they deserve a strike out I can't help but feel it would be exactly what they are hoping for; a quick exit with no judgment and no blame and no answers. I think after everything they've put me through I owe it to myself at least to see it through to the end.

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Please don't give up by letting them have a strike out! I've watched you thread from the start and think you are a true "warrior of justice" you have do so so well, you've got my full respect!

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  • 3 weeks later...

You go after them girl....never again will you fell this empowered.Its a long hard road but you get there in the end..I had litigation in the queens bench that took 9 years to complete..i won out of court for what i wanted.Good luck and remember you are right....

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