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    • Thank-you dx, What you have written is certainly helpful to my understanding. The only thing I would say, what I found to be most worrying and led me to start this discussion is, I believe the judge did not merely admonish the defendant in the case in question, but used that point to dismiss the case in the claimants favour. To me, and I don't have your experience or knowledge, that is somewhat troubling. Again, the caveat being that we don't know exactly what went on but I think we can infer the reason for the judgement. Thank-you for your feedback. EDIT: I guess that the case I refer to is only one case and it may never happen again and the strategy not to appeal is still the best strategy even in this event, but I really did find the outcome of that case, not only extremely annoying but also worrying. Let's hope other judges are not quite so narrow minded and don't get fixated on one particular issue as FTMDave alluded to.
    • Indians, traditionally known as avid savers, are now stashing away less money and borrowing more.View the full article
    • the claimant in their WS can refer to whatever previous CC judgements they like, as we do in our WS's, but CC judgements do not set a legal precedence. however, they do often refer to judgements like Bevis, those cases do created a precedence as they were court of appeal rulings. as for if the defendant, prior to the raising of a claim, dobbed themselves in as the driver in writing during any appeal to the PPC, i don't think we've seen one case whereby the claimant referred to such in their WS.. ?? but they certainly typically include said appeal letters in their exhibits. i certainly dont think it's a good idea to 'remind' them of such at the defence stage, even if the defendant did admit such in a written appeal. i would further go as far to say, that could be even more damaging to the whole case than a judge admonishing a defendant for not appealing to the PPC in the 1st place. it sort of blows the defendant out the water before the judge reads anything else. dx  
    • Hi LFI, Your knowledge in this area is greater than I could possibly hope to have and as such I appreciate your feedback. I'm not sure that I agree the reason why a barrister would say that, only to get new customers, I'm sure he must have had professional experience in this area that qualifies him to make that point. 🙂 In your point 1 you mention: 1] there is a real danger that some part of the appeal will point out that the person appealing [the keeper ] is also the driver. I understand the point you are making but I was referring to when the keeper is also the driver and admits it later and only in this circumstance, but I understand what you are saying. I take on board the issues you raise in point 2. Is it possible that a PPC (claimant) could refer back to the case above as proof that the motorist should have appealed, like they refer back to other cases? Thanks once again for the feedback.
    • Well barristers would say that in the hope that motorists would go to them for advice -obviously paid advice.  The problem with appealing is at least twofold. 1] there is a real danger that some part of the appeal will point out that the person appealing [the keeper ] is also the driver.  And in a lot of cases the last thing the keeper wants when they are also the driver is that the parking company knows that. It makes it so much easier for them as the majority  of Judges do not accept that the keeper and the driver are the same person for obvious reasons. Often they are not the same person especially when it is a family car where the husband, wife and children are all insured to drive the same car. On top of that  just about every person who has a valid insurance policy is able to drive another person's vehicle. So there are many possibilities and it should be up to the parking company to prove it to some extent.  Most parking company's do not accept appeals under virtually any circumstances. But insist that you carry on and appeal to their so called impartial jury who are often anything but impartial. By turning down that second appeal, many motorists pay up because they don't know enough about PoFA to argue with those decisions which brings us to the second problem. 2] the major parking companies are mostly unscrupulous, lying cheating scrotes. So when you appeal and your reasons look as if they would have merit in Court, they then go about  concocting a Witness Statement to debunk that challenge. We feel that by leaving what we think are the strongest arguments to our Member's Witness Statements, it leaves insufficient time to be thwarted with their lies etc. And when the motorists defence is good enough to win, it should win regardless of when it is first produced.   
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Yes, almost certainly you need to report them to the OFT.. they will not get involved in individual cases, but they do keep a record of complaints made which are then used when a company reapplies for its licence.

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Yes, almost certainly you need to report them to the OFT.. they will not get involved in individual cases, but they do keep a record of complaints made which are then used when a company reapplies for its licence.

 

Well I will definitely report them, they won't be bullying me that's for sure ;)

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It is well worth reporting them, they like to take liberties and the more reports the so called regulatory authorities get the better.

 

Try to stay off the phone with them, I know it is tempting to wind them up but it doesn't really help much.

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It is well worth reporting them, they like to take liberties and the more reports the so called regulatory authorities get the better.

 

Try to stay off the phone with them, I know it is tempting to wind them up but it doesn't really help much.

 

I know, I just lost it, had bad news and their letter was the straw etc... I will report them for sure, should have done it earlier this year! Thanks for replying x :)

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It might also be Harassment which is a criminal offense.

Best one of the more senior members think that one over for you and give a better answer.

 

If feels like it.... still nothing from them in the post after our conversation. hmmm

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They most likely to use 2nd class post so don't fret, at present I would say this has not reached harassment level but is getting close.

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They most likely to use 2nd class post so don't fret, at present I would say this has not reached harassment level but is getting close.

 

Thanks... yeah they took about 2 weeks to get back to me earlier in the year when I told them it was Statute barred. I've still got all copies and proof of postage / signed for copies etc. I shall wait and see what happens next.. ;)

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Write back to the compliance Manager saying

 

Dear Sir or Madam,

 

I have received your letter dated xx xx xxxx asking how Robinson Way have failed in dealing with this allged debt, I would think it is quite palin to anyone who has read my previous letters : PLEASE NOTE THIS ALLGED DEBT IS STATUTE BARRED AND I WILL NOT BE MAKING ANY PAYMENT OR OFFER OF PAYMENT.

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Write back to the compliance Manager saying

 

Dear Sir or Madam,

 

I have received your letter dated xx xx xxxx asking how Robinson Way have failed in dealing with this allged debt, I would think it is quite palin to anyone who has read my previous letters : PLEASE NOTE THIS ALLGED DEBT IS STATUTE BARRED AND I WILL NOT BE MAKING ANY PAYMENT OR OFFER OF PAYMENT.

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Thanks... would I be best sending it "signed for", so they can't claim they never received it?

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Thanks... would I be best sending it "signed for", so they can't claim they never received it?

yes so it there on Monday for them.

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This is where you reply using their headings

 

WHERE HAVE WE GONE WRONG

 

You have not stopped your harrassment of myself, so a full report is going to the relevant authorities.

 

This alleged debt is statute barred, if you do not know the legal meaning of statute barring I suggest you ask a qualified legal representative.

 

For clarification, on my part this means I am not going to make any payment for this alleged debt now or in the future and you must stop harrassing me.

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LETTER BEFORE ACTION

 

Dear Sir / Madam

 

I am in receipt of your recent letter entitled 'WHERE HAVE WE GONE WRONG'

 

I will state for the record

 

I will not be making any kind of payment towards a debt that is statute barred, you claim to have received 'payments' that imply that the alleged debt is NOT statute barred. If you feel your case has any kind of merit then you will have no hesitation informing me just how these payments were made, the dates and times and what method of payment was made and where. I have previously told you my situation by recorded delivery mail.

 

Your letter is headed "WHERE HAVE WE GONE WRONG" I will categorically state that this is the question you will be asking yourselves after:

 

a) A harrassment case in court

 

b) When the Office Of Fair Trading see that you are clearly in breach of not only their guidelines, but also your 'governing body' (The CSA), and more seriously the Consumer Protection From Unfair Trading Regulations 2008, You will be asking the same question when you have 'requirements' imposed on you or a fine.

 

After the date on this letter above, if I have to continue to write to you then I will charge you £20 per letter. Also if it is your intention to issue a court claim, then it will be defended most vehemently, and when the issue of costs arises I will have no hesitation in showing this letter and previous correspondence to the judge.

 

I would also quote to you the well known case of Arkell vs Pressdram.

 

I trust this makes my position completely clear.

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