LLoyds TSB - CCA Reply?

[mancini602]

Hi,

 

I have 3 large debts with Lloyds TSB (Loans and Credit Cards). Please note that these were taken out when the TSB was still just the TSB and not owned by LLoyds. I have been paying very reduced amounts to a DCA (Credit Security Ltd) for these debts ever since (About 10 years or so).

 

These debts are from circa 1996ish. I must also state that the DCA have never asked for more money. I only pay £26.00 per month on debts of £8000

 

I decided to request CCA's for these from the DCA. The DCA did not acknowledge receipt or send CCA's. I did send the requests by Special Delivery and they were delivered and signed for (which have proof of). They defaulted on the 12+2 days (3 months ago) so I stopped paying. They then started phoning me. I ignored all voicemails and waited until a further calendar month had passed and then sent them a copy of the template letter on this site saying that unless they send the CCA I am not paying etc etc and that they had committed a summary offence etc etc.

 

I heard no more until today, when the attached letter dropped on my doormat. The letter is from the original creditor saying that they are looking into my complaint.....but I never made a complaint. I just asked the DCA for a copy of the 3 CCA's..............I also note that the letter from LLoyds does not mention account numbers or anything. They say they are investigating my complaint etc, but now we are worried that we may have shot ourselves in the foot. Maybe we should've just carried on paying £26 per month until we die....Have I now p**sed them off and they will come chasing for the whole lot? Or is it possible that they don't have the CCA's?

Lloyds.pdf

[PGH7447]

Have I now p**sed them off Most Likely and they will come chasing for the whole lot? Probably Or is it possible that they don't have the CCA's? More than a 90% chance this is correct, especially from 1996 and from a different company from what it is today, you asked for these over 3 months ago, and they still have not arrived, that must tell you something

At least you have now shown these people that you are aware of your rights, and yes if you had just left it they would have quite happily pocketed your £26 a month for the rest of your days and then probably tried to pass the debt onto your next of kin

[babybear39]

Subscribing...

 

I seriously doubt they have CCAs from 1996

[daarab]

This Might help you also.

I CCA'd Lloyds for my aunties agreement several months ago and received ineligble copies and each time I write to them they keep sending my auntie the letter you have received, her card was from early 90s, they will probably have the CCA's but they will be on micro film and they will be ineliglble, Just keep playing them at their own games, and always come here and ask for help/advice.

[harrythehawk]

Same here, CCAd Lloyds from account starting from 1980s, written confirmation from them that they DO NOT have it (Yay!!!)

[babybear39]

Oh dear...All that time spent micro fishing

[mancini602]

Update: I have had several...we apologise for the late responses in "answering your complaint" type letters until this morning............

 

The letter states that they "do not have records earlier than 1997 and as such, your accounts will have been passed to our Consumer Debt Department. However, we would like to point out that as you have been making regular payments to these accounts, as far as we are concerned, you have accepted liability for and acknowledged these debts. We therefore ask you to contact our Consumer Debt Collection Team to negiotiate payment of these debts. Failure to contact them could result in these debts being sold to a Debt Collection Company without further notice"

 

So...they acknowledge that they have no records/CCA's but still want the money and are now threatening selling these debts. Do I do nothing? Or do I contact them and offer reduced payments again???

[Multay]

Haha....They haven't got a leg to stand on...No CCA no chance of enforcing through a court...End of Story...It is up to you if you continue to pay but (as I understand things, I'm no expert) the have no Legal right to collect the money - Paying for years has nothing to do with "admitting liability"...

 

I'm sure someone will come along and give you better advice but take heart that you have something that most of would love - A letter admitting that they have no agreement!!!! It's the CCA holy Grail...

[Curlyben]

Ho hum, "admitting liability" is only really for Statute Barring and not court enforcement and certainly not on debts of this age.

Oh well, maybe they will learn to keep all relevant paperwork together

[babybear39]

Update: I have had several...we apologise for the late responses in "answering your complaint" type letters until this morning............

 

The letter states that they "do not have records earlier than 1997 and as such, your accounts will have been passed to our Consumer Debt Department. However, we would like to point out that as you have been making regular payments to these accounts, as far as we are concerned, you have accepted liability for and acknowledged these debts. We therefore ask you to contact our Consumer Debt Collection Team to negiotiate payment of these debts. Failure to contact them could result in these debts being sold to a Debt Collection Company without further notice"

 

So...they acknowledge that they have no records/CCA's but still want the money and are now threatening selling these debts. Do I do nothing? Or do I contact them and offer reduced payments again???

 

Congratulations

 

It's upto you what you do now. Keep that letter VERY safe incase they do carry out their threat to sell the accounts. You then have written evidence from the OC that even though the debts exists, they cannot be enforced

[mancini602]

Hi Everyone and thanks for your help and support so far. I can't at the moment scan in the latest letter, but will type it out below. Can you please take a look? As far as I am concerned, it confirms that they have no CCA's?

 

**************

Dear Mr and Mrs xxxx,

 

CDR References: xxxx, xxxx, xxxx

 

Thankyou for taking the time to contact us.

I think it would be helpful if I set out my understanding of your complaint.

 

The information registered with the Credit Reference Agencies for account number xxxx has not been amended.

 

Mr and Mrs xxxx, please be advised that we only store information as advised by the Data Protection Act. They advise that they only need to keep information for a set period of time. As your accounts were closed and transferred to our Consumer Debt Recovery (CDR) department in July 1997, we no longer have a copy of the relevant application forms.

 

Our records indicate that you have been making regular payments to the accounts above since they were placed with our external agents in June 2000. As you would not have been making payments to accounts that are not yours, we take this as confirmation of ownership of the debts and are therefore still due and payable.

 

Please contact our CDR department on xxxx to discuss repayment arrangments. Failure to do so may result in the debts being sold to an external agent for collection.

 

I am sorry we do not feel able to agree to your complaint but if you have any new information that you feel may lead me to reconsider my decision please let me know. If we cannot come to an agreement, I will provide you with details of the Financial Ombudsman Service so they can consider your complaint independently.

 

As long as you are happy with the way I have dealt with your complaint, there is no need for you to reply to my letter. If I have not heard from you by 09/2008 I will close my file, although I will reopen it if you come back at any point afterwards.

 

*******************************

[Captain Spaulding]

A nice letter pointing out to them that payment was made under duress and that due to the agreement being unenforceable by law that all payments made should be considered as goodwill.

 

Further attempts to collect will be in contravention of OFT guidelines which will prompt you to exhaust their internal complaints. Once thats done is off to the FOS who will pass judgement...

 

Well done, you won!

[Helmetfire]

I have had similar from Lloyds TSB, they say they can't find my CCA and don't believe they should have to keep records for 12 years but they say they are still going to pursue me for the alleged debt....I am waiting for their next move, but as I have had their final response I am compiling my complaint to the FOS and have already complained to TS.

[harrythehawk]

Yes, they may set 1st credit on you before too long, just tell them to go away too

[babybear39]

Or the 'lovely' secheari clark & mitchell

[tinkerbell20]

no enforceable CCA = Creditor cannot enforce the debt:D:D

[Multay]

I soooo hope I get one of those letters...I'm jealous...

 

But good luck to you...Just remember, paying for years doesn't prove anything - Only a signed, executed CCA can do that..