Anyone heard how SkintCumbrian got on today?

[lateralus]

good, about the p.o. account!

here's a very useful and informative thread: Taking back control of your finances

have a read through for any new ideas - bookworm has a couple of interesting entries and the responses from others will help you feel how wide spread this problem is.

very good luck for brighter days ahead..

[Catlover64]

SC - I too was sorry to learn what happened to you. I don't know how the powers that be at HSBC (aka Bank of Robbing Bar Stewards) can sleep easy knowing your circumstances.

 

But you know - Not all debts are paid with money. I'm looking forward to the day when the OFT win and we can all get paid.

 

Keep the faith - we're with you!

 

Lots of love and luck to you and your family

[deadzebra]

Quick question, was the offer you got the original offer (if you had one) given to you before you took court action?

 

I had an offer in the early days, but it came a few days after I had filed a claim, so I rejected it and progressed with the court route. It now appears that my claim will get stayed soon (like most people).

 

Does it appear that HSBC is giving people, who were given offers but rejected them, a second chance to claim them?

 

Kev.

[Castlebest]

Of course they are because they now have everyone over a barrel.

 

Most of the people who these charges applied to were/are in financial difficulty and they know they can save themselves a few quid by offering people who are short of cash some money now to go away rather than wait for them to stop apealing to higher courts against a judgement we all know will come eventualy.

 

I'm sure its a business strategy but against the poorer sections of our comunity and its disgusting.

 

pete

[skintcumbrian]

Quick question, was the offer you got the original offer (if you had one) given to you before you took court action?

 

 

In June/July I got a series of letters from HSBC which appeared to relate to the closing of an old joint account but because I had actually seen the offer on the computer at the meeting in the bank a few weeks earlier, I went into my branch to check as there was a letter missing that they referred to. The lady in there told me the missing letter had been the offer letter she had shown me on the computer - for the same amount they have just offered. (That offer is what they calculate my charges to be which is about £300 shy of what I calculated them at ie that *85% I saw). She said she would chase up Head Office and get the matter re-opened. Surprise, surprise, no word from anyone.

 

No mention of the offer letter in either court hearing which surprised me a tad at the second one as I thought the barrister might have brought it up but I think that HSBC were on a mission to defeat my (and any other) hardship case, not to deal with my claim particularly. I was even more surprised he hadn't mentioned in when that offer letter landed the following day, but then thinking about that too, if he had said there was an offer for that amount on the way, and that they had made it previously, I would have queried the failure to get back in touch with me after my trip to the branch, and the amount and the lack of interest. And that might have turned the judge against them maybe (?). So, it wasn't in their interest to forewarn me that an offer was on the way, or to mention it in court.

 

I'm not going to appeal the stay. I've now been asked by three others in my village to help them with their claims; I'm going to write and phone the FOS and FSA about the bank's behaviour in this case, including whether demanding that we accept the offers as full and final rather than partial, particularly with the financially vulnerable is permissible/acceptable; and I'm going to await the visit by the Money programme film crew with glee!!

 

No eggs yet from the HSBC hens.......if anyone is interested!

[Castlebest]

Hiya Skint, I think it may have been a mistake to call the hens HSBC if you want anything out of them, try renaming them CAG hens

 

pete

[freakyleaky]

Well if they live up to there names, they will only lay eggs when you have just bought some, they will cost more to feed than the value of the eggs they deliver, if you ruffle there feathers they will stop laying altogether, but at the end off the day they will end up with egg on their faces!

 

If no eggs by the end of the week, enjoy your sunday roast SC!

[pinkduchess]

you cant eat your pets!!

[Castlebest]

Dont think anyone would want to eat one of freakies sheep after what he does with them

 

pete

[Catlover64]

Ewwwwww!!!

[vandermerwe]

Very dismayed SC.

 

You don't think HSBC identified you from the info. given on your thread do you?

 

I have heard tell they (and undoubdtedly others too) monitor these threads with very powerful computers.

 

The thought struck me when I passed by GCHQ in Cheltenham (being enlarged yet again) at the weekend to visit a close friend dying in Cheltenham hospital's oncology unit.

 

Van

[skintcumbrian]

I think hsbc identified me from my account number! however seriously I think if I were any of the banks I would pay a couple of people to monitor these forums and other similar ones so that there was little need to second guess consumer strategies. for the second hearing I had no idea what that barrister was going to present and of course I have never heard of "skeleton arguments". the moment that 6 page doc came over the table at me I was back footed and struggling to catch up with the proceedings. However, the week before I had, unwittingly, done precisely the same thing to the other hsbc barrister. he had the experience (and methinks, the judge on his side) to get a time out to seek advice, followed by a week's adjournment.

each of us is an individual trying to put together a watertight claim, find the right threads and info on rapidly shifting grounds and the right people to help, and fit all of it into our daily survival regime. That is not the case with the banks who are fighting these consumer claims on purely commercial and financial grounds to generate max profits for their shareholders. you don't need to be on cag or mse for long to see that this corporate greed affects every aspect of people's lives - health, children's wellbeing, emotional, selfesteem etc etc. Personally I cannot believe how different I feel knowing that if and when hsbc pay up in the next 14 days I am close to getting rid of the overdraft and debt that this bank have had a huge hand in causing. the relief is palpable and my mental state much improved. wasted costs? I want to sue them for psychological damage for most of my adult life. debt is such a strain and for those you entrust with your money to cause it is truly horrendous. are the banks a necessary evil in our 21st century lives? I'm going to endeavour to use them as little as possible for the rest of mine.

 

I think all of us need to treat this as a battle. and they lose once and for all only when we cease to permit them to run our lives.

[jansus]

Not really familiar with HSBC or how they work - but it seems so wrong that they are putting up such a fight to avoid the stays being lifted when the FSA in their statement specifically said that hardship cases should be filtered through. That is the one area where there should be a good argument to lift the stay. I thought they were supposed to be working with the FSA to resolve matters not ignore public statements?

 

I wonder how all HSBC shareholders would feel about their money being used in this way?

 

Good on you for getting your money though . and although it must have been a difficult experience I hope you have emerged a stronger person.

 

Jan:)

[vandermerwe]

Good morning SC. I would say if anyone could be referred to as the archetypical CAGger you can.

 

That was a reasoned, eloquent and unemotional post you made which does you credit and - for what it's worth - a tip of your scales from me.

 

I must whisper this, but one of my sons is a barrister. He practices at the Criminal Bar and knows very little about civil matters, but does say he and his colleagues get all the fun whilst those at the Civil Bar make all the money.

 

I gather it is unheard of for a Member of the Bar to pass a skeleton argument direct to a lay person, particularly in the circumstances you describe. There could well be grounds for a complaint to the Bar Society. PM me if you want to discuss this further.

 

FWIW (for what it's worth) judges are usually drawn from the Bar and blood is thicker than water. In fact some may actually be practising barristers. Like Cherie Blair QC.

 

Once you've got this behind you, get a basic account (known on these threads as a parachute account) and use it just as you would cash under the floorboards. There are still many French people who keep francs under their mattress and shops that take them - they just don't trust the Euro (and who can blame them!)

 

Let's keep in touch via this thread because I think you are an inspiration to us all.

 

If you agree, give my scales a click. If you don't just say so - I shan't take offence and will shut up.

 

You're a strong person SC.

 

Good luck for the future.

 

Van

[freakyleaky]

Hi sc! Have you seen bankfodders new announcement? just thought I would point it out for you and any others that may be interested but might have missed it.

BBC Money Programme looking for claimants

[Audreygreeneyes]

I want to sue them for psychological damage for most of my adult life...............its a nice thought but Tom Brennan tried this early this year , took months and months and when eventually judgement was made in the high court..................... he lost.............. so please think long and hard if you are seriously consider that route........

 

I totally agree that they are watching these forums, this is how adn why they have got the deal from the OFT..........

 

look at the CPR and the bar assocation and the MOR...........the mroe complaints they receive the more hacked off they willget and eventually they will make the OFT do something..........

 

this all came about because we were taking over the courts system, this is or was their way of diverting the flood, its a barrier. nothing more nothing less..........

 

the more pressure put on it, the cracks will appear again and the flood defences will be breached.........

 

we are a lot closer than you realise..............

[JunkiMunki]

Hi All,

I am appalled to find that the HSBC , have now classed a complaint I first made on the 25th June 2007,as one in which they "BELIEVE" CONCERNS THE TEST CASE AND NOT as one of the Contravention of the legislation in progresss protecting benefit claimants and their benefits, their reply to my complaint was a request to send them a detailed schedule of all charges dates and amounts I was reclaiming , IN ORDER FOR THEM TO CONSIDER my request of refunding the amount stated in my first letter THEY WOULD NEED THIS INFO,I wrote and told them that according to a document published by the FSA , the requisition they are asking is an" Unfair Obstacle" placed by them in order to prolong my claim, they have never addressed the reason for my complaint, and after giving them another 10 days after I had reluctantly complied with their request, I heard NOTHING , NOTHING, NOTHING, not even the acknowledgement to my letter within 5 days which is stated in their banking codes, so I decided to ring them on the 27th July .

 

I am sure it was a pre programmed ROBOT I was speaking to as all she kept reiterating was that "ALL BANK CHARGE CLAIMS HAD BEEN STAYED", I asked if I could explain my situation, and was told ALL BANK CHARGE CLAIMS HAVE BEEN STAYED. I then contacted the Ombudsman regarding this and after explaining the situation was given a claim number and told that they would contact the HSBC regarding this matter and that the bank would be in touch with me.

 

They phoned me regarding the Ombudsman contact with them and assured me they would look into it.

I then received a letter dated 8th AUGUST 2007 , from the HSBC , stating as follows : We believe your complaint concerns the level, fairness, or lawfulness of the charges.

 

We do not agree that our charges are in any way unfair or unenforceable.

 

Since we last wrote to you, the bank [with several other banks] has become involved in legal proceedings with the OFT on bank charges which we believe will resolve the legal issues about fairness and legality of your bank charges.

 

It would be our normal approach to resolve your complaint through our internal complaints process as quickly as possible. However, until the determination of the legal issues in the above proceedings, we have asked the FSA to suspend the normal timetable for dealing with bank charge complaints, and the FSA has agreed to this request subject to conditions that protect your rights.

 

The letter is 1 1/2 pages long and in that letter they have used the WORD LEGAL [7X] AND LEGALITY [1] ,I sent them a letter in reply stating that I do not know how they have got the nerve to even contemplate using the word "LEGAL" OR "LEGALITY", as it is quite clear they DO NOT know the meaning of the word or its implication, as all members of the BBA are aware of the Legislation in place but choose to blatantly disregard it for their own benefit, their audacious behaviour over the last year towards its customers and the courts is beyond belief.

 

I have stated my complaint as one to do with the disregard of the legislation in place and the illegal deduction of their charges from my benefit account causing me considerable hardship, and stress over the last year, and the illegal taking of £1,236, despite requesting twice NOT TO deduct the charges, which they chose to ignore, and now state that "THEY BELIEVE" .

I told them if they could show me in any correspondence, any reference to anything apart from the contravention of the legislation in place , I would be very interested in seeing it, I told them that the Ombudsman had stipulated that it was in no way connected to the pending court case and that the outcome of the case would have nothing at all to do with my complaint.

 

They also stated in that letter that I should be aware that if I were to contact the Ombudsman or courts with this matter that they have already asked both not to proceed with any claims until after the test case is resolved.

 

In reply to this statement I told them that I did not believe how they could be so audacious towards the Courts , after they have been "QUITE BLATANTLY IGNORING COURT ORDERS FOR THE LAST YEAR, " and yet now want the very same Courts to uphold their requests to stay all claims until after the test case is preposterous.

I also pointed out to them that the FOS has indicated that it will not proceed with cases which rely on the legal issues being considered in the test case , this quite clearly does not mean me as my complaint is NOTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH THE TEST CASE, and is quite clearly one of hardship and legislation no matter what they believe.

I have stated that to prevaricate my complaint to one of their own belief, is IMO another one of their underhanded deceitful and deceptive actions that they are continuing to use in order to stay all claims until after the test case, and that the above is clearly an infringement of my rights, and shows how low they are willing to stoop in order to prolong claims of this nature.

I am now awaiting a reply from them before 30th Sept , if not the Ombudsman has agreed to step in for me . :rolleyes:

[jailbird]

WELL DONE JUNKI

 

A great letter and response to their bloodymindedness. I too have been in touch with FO.

 

Wishing you all the very best of luck:p

 

Chris:D

[JunkiMunki]

Hiya Jailbird,

thanks for the vote of confidence , rceived 2 letters dated 29th August 2007 today, [1] actually acknowledged the Fax I sent to Mr Bill Stephens, on Wednesday 29th August, as I have not learnt how to fax yet I took all the documents to the local branch all 11 pages and asked them to fax them all over to Mr Bill Stephens, as he wanted to gather information as to exactly what had happened so far with my complaint, and why I had involved the FOS.

It stated within this letter that they are considering the Merits of this dispute and that they will be in touch very soon, but certainly within the next 30 working days, which gives them until the 10th October 2007, and by that time they will have deducted another £300 from my benefit account, which then means they will owe me £1,536 , but it will not get that far as I made the claim on the 25 th June 2007, and as yet have had no response at all to my complaint, which is over the agreed limit of 8 weeks to sort a complaint out, but the FOS has the date noted as the 30th July 2007, so this gives the HSBC until 30th September to sort this complaint out, then I transfer the complaint over to the FOS, for their intervention towards my complaint.

The first letter came from a lady called Ms Shaleen Moore [customer relations officer].

 

The [2nd] letter dated the same day 29th August 2007, states within as follows :thank you for your recent query regarding your bank account. I am sorry that you have had cause to complThe provision of a high quality service to our customers is a key priority for the bank and I regret that on this occasion we did NOT meet the standards we aim to acheive. Whilst I understand that your faith in our service has been affected, I do hope you will allow us the oppotunity to restore your confidence in the future.

 

You will need to quantify any claim for the refund of charges applied to your account by providing full details of your claim, including the amounts and dates. This information can be found on the Internet banking.

The bank cannot quantify or prepare your claim.

 

I should advise you that on 27th July 2007, an investigation was commenced by the Office of Fair Trading into charges imposed by major financial institutions. This investigation is likely to last at least twelve months and during the investigation we will not consider a request to refund historically applied charges, until the outcome has been confirmed.

 

Thank you once again for taking the time to bring your concerns to the bank's attention. I am only sorry it was necessary for you to do so. I hope that metters have now been resolved to your satisfaction. However, should this not be the case, the attached guidances sheet explains the next steps available to you.

 

continued ....

 

Yours sincerly Mrs A A Phillips

Customer Services Officer.

 

this was attached to the letter;

 

FULL RESPONSE

 

We hope that you will be entirely happy with the attached response and as a consequence your complaint can now be considered resolved .

 

Should you wish to discuss your concerns further, please feel free to write to us at the address shown at the foot of this letter.

Alternatively

[JunkiMunki]

Hiya Jailbird,

Sorry my fingers are toooo fast for my brain [lol lol ]

[vandermerwe]

Please keep us posted Junki.

 

I'm having a go today as I have been ordered to return my cheque guarantee card, otherwise 'an agent' will collect it and no further cheques will be paid even though my pension, benefits (including carer's, attendance and disability allowance) will be credited tomorrow.

 

Frozen sausages for lunch today then. Suggestions for next week's graze welcomed.

 

My letter has been taken from the site (I'm deliberately not posting on my own thread as I suspect the swine have identified me).

 

One last word, I do not write to 'teams' - I address my comments to Commanding Officers officers only.

 

Teams remind me of squealing schoolgirls running up and down the gym bouncing balls from one to the other and.......er perhaps it is the appropriate word after all with the Team Leader having a whistle in her mouth and boobs reminiscent of two babies fighting under a blanket and a backside like the Titanic.

 

Keep it up (the postings I mean!) and good luck.

 

Van

[JunkiMunki]

Hi there VAN !!!!!

I will let you share my "NAUGHTY CORNER" as I have got to edit a posting I made which could be libellous towards the site, which I FULLY UNDERSTAND, BUT DO NOT WISH TO CAUSE THIS "WONDERFUL SITE" ANY PROBLEMS, SO WILL THINK BEFORE I POST IN FUTURE, and if I do want to have a rant and rave, a kick and spit, I will PM you personally, as I have added you to my buddy buddy list .[lol lol lol ]

 

Junkimunki xx;)

[JunkiMunki]

HI van..

Have just CANCELLED ALL BENEFIT PAYMENTS INTO MY ACCOUNT UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE........ DWP HAVE AGREED TO SEND GIROS FOR A SHORT WHILE, BUT I am seriously considering opening a Girobank ACCOUNT at my local post office just for my benefits to be paid into then I shall withdraw enough money to cover my direct debits and standing orders in my bank account, they will not get a penny more than what my bills are for.

If EVERYONE THAT IS ON BENEFITS DID THE SAME, This would surely have SOME EFFECT on the Banks Profits , and would then make sure that we have ACTED in accordance to the legislation, as we would be appropriating our benefits as to where we want them to go, as for the charges that might be accruing in the meantime up until the outcome of the test case, well I would tell them to wait until a precedent has been set, and that what is " good for the goose is good for the gander" . I am making sure that they do not make any more greedy profits from myself while the test case is being considered and finalised.

 

SO ALL YOU BENEFIT CLAIMANTS OUT THERE , START PUTTING UNFAIR OBSTACLES IN THIER WAY , AND LETS SEE HOW THEY LIKE THAT. THEN WHEN AT LAST THE PRECEDENT HAS BEEN SET FAIRLY AND LEGALLY, WE CAN DEDUCT THE ACCRUING CHARGES FROM OUR CLAIMS , BUT WILL ONLY DEDUCT THE PRECEDENT FIGURE FROM THE OUTSTANDING DEBT, SO WILL HAVE SET OUR OWN WAIVER ..... BUT WHEN WE APPLY THE INTEREST TO OUR CLAIMS THE HSBC WILL BE THE ONES TO SUFFER AND NOT US ........... NO MORE PROFITS, NO MORE CHARGES ... TAKEN FROM ME ,.....................................

[JunkiMunki]

HI van.

SORRY ABOUT THE DUPLICATE , BUT AM IN THE "Naughty Corner" again move over [lol lol ]

[lateralus]

good move junki, everyone should move all benefits away from their sticky fingers - including state pensions, child benefit, etc.