Civil Enforcement Ltd (again!)

[letshelp]

Thanks for the update, newbies take note.

regards

[cirian75]

sticky post #1498

[RCHiggs]

Hello. wonder if Anyone can help me i recieved a ticket from Civil Enforcement and before finding this site and reading the threads i paid the £45 reduced from 90 and proceeded to recieve letters from Newlyn. I recently recieved a letter from CE saying basically they know i have payed but still want £90 but as it is a reduced charge i can only pay by cheque or postal order (and only have 7days). I then contacted newlyn and they said they have no record of the payment. I then sent a statement showing that it was paid and they insissted they have recived no payment they then used every excuse in the book including "the automated service used wasnt set up" oh how i laughed. When i mentioned trading standards they said we want nothing more to do with this and were passing the file back to civil enforcement. I am just stuck and have no idea what to do??? I dont want my car clamped or to goto court please HELP

[Conniff]

oh how i laughed

 

You continue in the vein above. If the cheque hasn't been cashed then stop it. If it was on-line and that didn't work, then you have £45 extra to spend in the pub so buy your mates a beer.

 

Other than the beer, you do nothing except get on with your life and let them waste theirs writing you a few more threats that you won't respond to.

 

They wont/can't clamp your car and it won't go to court.

[RCHiggs]

It was payed over the phone by an automated service using a debit card. My sister is very anxious about it all and doesnt want it to go further. I am so worried about it all even after readin all these posts on here. How do you know for sure it wont goto court and they wont clamp my car?

[Conniff]

Is this payment showing on your bank statement ?

 

They can't clamp your car for the reasons, I assume your car is no longer in the car park so it would be illegal to do so. If it was in the car park, they still couldn't clamp it unless there were signs in very prominent positions telling you that is what they will do.

 

It won't go to court for the simple reason this is contract law and the law of contract states that you cannot charge more than your losses.

If it was a free carpark then you have been conned and paid something you never had to because they have lost 'nothing'.

If it was a £1 per hour and you overstayed for 2 hours, they can charge you £2 no more.

It would go to court only if they think it will not be defended and they can get a judgement by default.

 

If, and only if it went to court and you were foolish enough not to defend it and they did get a judgement which you still refused to pay, then, and only then can they send a bailiff in to clamp your car but even then only if they can find your car. If it is in a locked garage, they cannot break into the garage to clamp it the same as they cannot break into your home to take other goods.

 

If you don't trust the other threads on here, then I suggest that you pay it and kick yourself for the rest of your life.

[RCHiggs]

Yes it was a free car park but i had over stayed the 2 hour limit . Its not that i dont trust them its just sods law it will end up going further with me but i guess everyone thinks that. Thank you so much for your help i really appreciate it. To be honest i am very doubtful they will recieve another penny off me . I really dont understand why they do it if so many people just ignore it its pathetic!

 

I shall keep you posted on what happens from now.

[Michael Browne]

I really dont understand why they do it if so many people just ignore it its pathetic!

 

It may seem that way from reading this and other forums, but there are millions of people who don't realise these invoices are unenforceable, more than enough for PPC's to make very nice living.....at the moment. Gradually though word is spreading and every ticket that isn't paid is eating into their bottom line.

[Cobra11]

When i mentioned trading standards they said we want nothing more to do with this and were passing the file back to civil enforcement.

 

Why would they (Newlyns) be sending it back if they were going to take any action, nobody is. I would read post #1498 of this thread a couple of times, I can confirm that nothing has happened to me and it has been two months since I received the last of Newlyns' letter. Actually I miss them, as all I get now are the utility bills and statements. Oh, I still have good credit rating after all their waffle.

[Conniff]

And listen to a lawyer in person - post #1488

[RCHiggs]

They are so frustrating! Thanks for your help. I havent recieved anything else so for but it has only been a week or so. I have found a way to get through to someone from civil enforcement without having to leave my name and number to wait for them but still they were "unavailable" at the time this is after about 7 attempts but i really want to keep on to anny them any letters i now recieve will be just posted straight back

[letshelp]

You wont get any sense, nor any refund out of them when you do eventually get through to someone.

regards

[RCHiggs]

Well i actually had a voicemail off them to phone them back from friday (dont use the house phone much) so when i tried to phone them back i didnt get through as in it didnt ring or anything just made a quick buzzing like it was engaged or something so thats it now they can get screwed!

[worriedofgodalming]

Hi, I have read a large number of the posts on this thread but it is hard to ignore these threatening letters. My husband parked my car at night at the Homebase car park in Godalming for 2½ hours. A week later on 11/11/10 I received a "Parking Contravention Enforcement Notice" requesting £150, reduced to £75 if paid in 14 days. After reading some of these threads I wrote a letter on 24th November saying I was not the driver on the day in question; pointed out that terms and conditions were not on the signage and specifically that it was not clear that the 2 hour restriction was for 24 hours a day (unlike all other car parks in the town where Council signs state when charges apply and when parking is free); asked that they provide proof (at their expense) that they were entitled to charge this "fine" and that my car was parked there when they said it was; and stating that the charge for a 30 minute overstay was disproportionate etc etc.

They replied on 2nd December 2010 saying I was required to provide them with the name and address of the driver within 7 days otherwise they would issue court proceedings compelling me to disclose the name of the driver. The letter states that it is wrong to believe that registered keepers could not be compelled to disclose this information and say they are entitled to obtain a "Norwich Pharmaceutical Order" against me unless I have reasonable grounds for witholding this information. The letter goes on to state that they cannot provide me with photographic evidence unless I pay them £10. They also said that the parking charge levied falls within the British Parking Association's recommended guidelines for car park enforcement.

Two days later I received a pink parking contravention notice endorsed "Notice before Legal Action" requesting £150. I ignored this and the letter.

On 24th December I received a notice from Newlyn endorsed "Do not ignore this letter" and stating the total outstanding was now £238.13 but this figure is unsubstantiated. It states that further action may be taken at considerale cost to me if the debt is not cleared.

On 4th January 2011 I received another notice from Newlyn saying they were disappointed that I had not contacted them to arrange payment of my debt but that they would give me the opportunity to pay before commencing County Court proceedings.

On 14th January 2011 I received another notice from Newlyn endorsed "Notice prior to County Court proceedings" and stating that this action would allow bailiffs to remove household effects and cars from my property and may affect my credit rating.

I have taken the advice of this thread and ignored all these notices - how many more letters am I going to get?! I am worried about my credit rating and wonder if they have a right to do anything that will affect my rating?

I am a bit nervous of ignoring these letters - are they going to go away?!

[DBC]

They can't do anything to affect your credit rating. It's as simple as that.

[honeybee13]

Hello worried. I can imagine how scary the letters must be, but the guys on here [with the exception of me, a mere onlooker] know what they're doing. Maybe a way to look at it is that the parking people are so desperate that they have to raise the stakes by inuendo, because they have no legal basis for what they're saying.

 

Follow the guys' advice and you'll be fine.

 

My best, HB

[worriedofgodalming]

Thanks for your reassurance. I have looked at the Norwich Pharmacal Order case and also the British Parking Association website. CEL are members of BPA / AOS and it seems they are entitled to obtain registered keeper details from the DVLA. It also seems that CEL have followed the guidelines on the BPA website. The only thing they don't seem to have done is follow the guidance for the information they should put on their signage. Having looked at the code of practice on the BPA website I am still uncertain as to why CEL cannot take enforcement action, or why we are able to get away with ignoring their letters!! I am still not going to pay though!

[Michael Browne]

 

On 14th January 2011 I received another notice from Newlyn endorsed "Notice prior to County Court proceedings" and stating that this action would allow bailiffs to remove household effects and cars from my property and may affect my credit rating.

They're being economical with the truth here. What they are conveniently failing to mention is that between a threat of issuing a court claim and baliffs is this:

1st: They actually have to issue a claim

2nd: You defend the claim

3rd: They win

4th: You fail to pay the judgement within 28 days

 

Only then would a CCJ be recorded on your credit record and the possibility of bailiffs visiting

[DBC]

Having looked at the code of practice on the BPA website I am still uncertain as to why CEL cannot take enforcement action, or why we are able to get away with ignoring their letters!! I am still not going to pay though!

 

The BPA is not some sort of official regulator like OFCOM or OFGEM. It's a trade association for the parking "industry", nothing more.

[Conniff]

The reason that it is unenforceable is because this comes under contract law. You cannot profit or levy a 'penalty' for breach of contract, you can only claim losses.

Also (and it has been shown in court) the charges for overstaying 'must' be shown on the boards prominently displayed at the entrance.

 

Don't take any notice of anything said by the British Parking Association, it has NO backing in law and it is made up of the bosses of the very companies that are trying to rip you off.

[Conniff]

I am still not going to pay though!

 

That doesn't really worry them as some poor pensioner who has no access to information like this will fall for the con.

[DBC]

That doesn't really worry them as some poor pensioner who has no access to information like this will fall for the con.

 

Yes, just like a phishing [problem], if they send out enough letters and emails, enough people will fall for it.

[SURFBOY]

Look at the letters you have received,

2 Dec - issue court procedings in 7 days,

4 Dec - Notice of Intended Legal Action,

24 Dec - Letter warning of further action,

4 Jan - May commence court procedings,

14 Jan - Notice prior to court procedings.

Can you see what is happening?

They are only threats, they can only commence procedings against the driver at the time.

If they were so sure of their legal position dont you think they would have taken you to court on the 9th Dec?

Stop contacting them and ignore them.

[letshelp]

I've had 33 of these 'parking invoices', never paid one, never contacted any of them and never been taken to court. I wonder why that is if they have such a strong case?

regards

[cabbagebike]

Latest update.... well... not much of one really: Still silent

 

To anyone who's still thinking of paying, just have a look at my past posts on here (and all the others as well ).

 

I took a bit of persuading at first but there's only one word of advice you'll need: Ignore

 

Can't believe another year's gone by! Not a sausage. Can I torch all the letters I received back then yet?