Cabot/Mortimer claimform - old 2003 Lloyds Loan -stayed - Now n244 to lift stay-Summary Judgment

[sxam]

I really don’t want this to go to the hearing. It’s a video hearing. Do I need to file anything before the hearing? 

[Badtimes123]

Hi sxam,

 

Just copying a previous comment from Andy Post #44 regarding this to help it move along - Andy is very busy

 

"Once you know the date of the hearing you can submit your own statement in response to their application which must be filed and served not les than 7 days pre hearing. "

[dx100uk]

i'd be making sure the judge has a copy of that letter and a wasted costs sheet from you.

 

its a VDO hearing? so no big deal. just like a meeting and its not till 22nd june

 

 

 

[sxam]

I have never dealt with court matters before so I am well confused. This VDO hearing on 28th June is the actual hearing of this case or it’s hearing for claimant N244 application? 

[dx100uk]

nor had 100's already here , it just a video conference like you see  on youtube almost every day..

 

its for the application.

 

read a good few N244 threads here as andy advised before

 

[sxam]

Gone through several N244 threads, some have settled with Tomlin order and in most cases you will need to do statement and defense, this is where I will struggle. I hope I will be able to get some help more nearer the time. Thank you.

[sxam]

Update- Received letter from their solicitor, they have now backtracked the letter saying it was sent in error. Hearing is on the 28 June. Need to submit statement by 21st. Appreciate any help. 

MCS.pdf

[dx100uk]

On 15/05/2022 at 20:54, Badtimes123 said:

Hi sxam,

Just copying a previous comment from Andy Post #44 regarding this to help it move along - Andy is very busy

"Once you know the date of the hearing you can submit your own statement in response to their application which must be filed and served not les than 7 days pre hearing. "

dx

 

On 19/01/2022 at 14:29, Andyorch said:

Default Note screenshot.....useless.

Statement of Account not original creditors been recreated.

Notice of assignment is a new template with the details added

None of the above are originals.

 

[sxam]

Thank you DX. Will I be able to get some help with the statement and any other document I might need to prepare? Since CCA seems to be enforceable, can they get judgement purely on that? Is it worth making Tomlin Order arrangement?

 

I am starting to panic as I cannot afford to get judgement against me on this case. Really appreciate your help.

 

Thank you.

[dx100uk]

On 19/01/2022 at 14:29, Andyorch said:

Default Note screenshot.....useless.

Statement of Account not original creditors been recreated.

Notice of assignment is a new template with the details added

 

None of the above are originals.

No default notice is a strong point for you 

 

There are numerous n244 lift of stay threads here with the kind of statement you need to make .

Use our enhanced Google search box 

 

Have a go and pop it up we will help refine it 

 

Dx

[sxam]

Working on statement. There is a mention of Loan added to previous debt (ON CCA and on WS) however, CCA they sent me is only for the second loan, should they have sent me CCA for the first Loan or should i have requested that separately? 

 

Can I mention this on my Statement?

Thank you.

Previous debt.pdf

[dx100uk]

It says previous debt, not loan?

 

so you had an  original loan with TSB but got into trouble paying and went back and lloyds allowed you to refinance to clear the old loan anð give you some cash to play with to your existing bank account you had with them?

 

dx

[sxam]

Correct, there was previous loan and it was topped up at later date.

[AndyOrch]

If the second agreement consolidated the first and repaid the initial then the second agreement takes preference. 

[sxam]

Thanks Andy, I will leave that part.

 

Hearing is on the 28th June, where do I send the statement? Is it just the statement I need to submit? Any other form/s need filling? Is it done online or by post? Sorry this is my first case and I am panicking a bit and don't know where to start.

[AndyOrch]

file (Court) and serve (Claimants Sol) the statement and any documents relied upon and referred to in the statement ( exhibits) hardcopies /email (if accepted) or both

[sxam]

Hi Andy, Have you got any specimen about how to file the defence please?

[AndyOrch]

I will have a look tomorrow and post you an example statement to oppose Summary Judgment...

[AndyOrch]

Here is an example of how a statement should be formatted in response to this type of application. You can replace the reference to strike out with oppose the lifting of the stay /summary Judgment and remove references to strike out.

 

Also the statement of truth as since been updated so replace that also with the updated version

 

WS (2) SJSO.pdf

 

 

Post your final draft here for checking

 

Andy

[sxam]

Hi Andy

I am really struggling to counter each paragraph from their statement. This is what I put together so far. Can you please have a quick look? Please add or remove where necessary. Thanks.

"IN THE xxx

Claim No. xxx

 

BETWEEN:

Claimant Cabot Financial (UK)

 

AND

Defendant

xxx

 

WITNESS STATEMENT OF Mr xxx

 

I Mr xxx, being the Defendant in this case will state as follows; I make this Witness Statement in objection and to oppose the claimant application to lifting of the stay / Summary Judgment in view of my defence submitted to the claim dated 12 May 2022 pursuant to CPR 24.5 (1) a/b.

 

I will respond to each paragraph of the same numbered as in the claimant’s statement.

 

Paragraphs 1/2/3

 

1. The claimants witness statement confirms that it mostly relies on hearsay evidence as confirmed by the drafts person in the opening paragraph. It is my understanding that they must serve notice to any hearsay evidence pursuant to CPR 33.2(1)(B) (notice of intention to rely on hearsay evidence) and Section 2 (1) (A) of the Civil Evidence Act.

 

2. It is my understanding that the claimant is an Assignee, a buyer of defunct disputed or bad debts, which are bought on mass portfolios at a much reduced cost to the amount claimed 10p to 15p in the £1 and which the original creditors have already wrote off as a capital loss and claimed against taxable income. They then issue claims to circumvent and claim the full amount of debt to maximise profit.

 

3. As an assignee or creditor as defined in section 189 of the CCA this applies to this new requirement on assignment of rights. This means that when an assignee purchases debts (or otherwise acquires rights under a credit agreement) it also acquires certain obligations to the borrower including the duty to comply with CCA requirements (such as the rules on statements and notices and other post-contractual information). The assignee becomes the creditor under the agreement. This ensures that essential consumer protections under the CCA cannot be circumvented by assigning the debt to a third party.

 

Background

 

4. It is admitted that I have had financial dealings with Lloyds Bank in the past but on receipt of this claim I was unsure of the agreement and any alleged balance or ever been contacted by Lloyds Banking in connection with any outstanding debt.

 

5. The claimants issued this claim through MCOL Northampton on 29 January 2021 to which I submitted my defence and the claim has remained stayed. The claimants made application dated 12 May 2022.

 

6. Paragraph 5. The claimant claims that the agreement was entered into on the 13 May 2003. On receipt of this claim I requested by way of a section 78 request dated 08/02/2021 a copy of the agreement and Terms and Conditions and statement. The claimant never responded, and the claim was stayed.

 

7. Paragraph 6 of the claimant’s statement confirms that they do not hold a copy of the Default Notice and wish to rely on a screen shot confirming the date it was allegedly issued. I will contend that this is neither sufficient nor pursuant to sections 87 and 88 of the CCA1974 and does not confirm service. The claimant is put to strict proof to validate the authenticity and source of the screen shot.

 

8. Paragraphs 7, Paragraph 8 confirms that payment received to the account however the statement of account is not original and creditors been recreated. Payment showing on the statement was payment made to Apex Credit Management. On 27/09/2017, I made a formal request to Apex and Lloyds to provide true copy of the credit agreement relating to the account. Both apex and Lloyds failed to comply my lawful request. 22 months later, account was subsequently sold to Cabot on 29 July 2019

 

9. Paragraph 9 is noted but not accepted. It is denied that I was ever served a Notice of Assignment pursuant to sec136 of the LoP and will contend that the exhibit marked 15 & 16  is a further mocked up template. The assignment must be in writing and signed under hand by the assignor. (check this bit please, signature is there on the exhibit)

 

10. Paragraph 10 is denied. I was not aware of any assignment nor ever requested to make payments by Cabot. This account was handled by Apex Credit Management and then PRA Group.

 

11. Paragraph 12 simply confirms my Defence which puts the claimant to strict proof. I will contend that after a period of 3 years of the claim being stayed it is disappointing that the claimant can only disclose templates and cut and pastes and screen shots that have no legal valid connection to any agreement.

 

12. Paragraph 13 is noted but irrelevant if a valid copy of the agreement/default notice cannot be disclosed on which the claimant claim relies upon.

 

13. Paragraphs 16, I strongly deny claimant statement that I made no response to their Pre- Action Protocol. I requested more document related to account on 6 January 2021.  

 

14. Paragraphs 16 is denied, I am not aware of any letters pre litigation from the claimant and again I would suggest that they are a form of template with dates added to pad out the claimants bundle.

 

15.Therefore paragraphs I respectfully request the court dismiss this application for Summary judgment, that there are compelling reasons as to why this claim should be disposed at trail and put the claimant to further strict proof to disclose the requested documents on which their claim relies upon.

 

Should the claimant fail to comply their claim be struck out under CPR 3.4 as having no basis.

 

I believe that the facts stated in this Witness Statement are true.

 

 

Signed ……………….

 

 

Dated on thid day ………………..2018

 

 

[dx100uk]

put your docx file up as text above as docx has all your pers details in file/properties.

 

dx

 

[sxam]

Thank you DX, looks like some one has now pasted in text form.
Appreciate feedback please as I don’t have much time. No default notice seems to be a big plus point as I just read a thread where case was dismissed recently on the basis of no Default Notice. 
 

 

[dx100uk]

PRA group?
you've never mentioned them before in relation to this debt?

 

you also need to inc this was a second loan from lloyds refinancing a previous loan they have yet to prove proof of.

 

dx

 

 

 

[sxam]

This was a real mess with reference number and total balance all messed up and not matching to all the documents I had in file.  I had to dig really hard to find all paperwork.

 

After gathering all the paperwork, I realised I was paying token payment to PRA group until 2017, was paying to Apex at some stage. Not sure if they are the same company.

 

I made CCA request to Apex in September 2017 to which they ask me to write to Lloyds quoting some reference.

I wrote to Lloyds quotation the reference, Lloyds came back saying they cannot locate the account with the reference number and my £1 was returned.

 

When Apex was collecting, balance was £12k, however when Cabot took over, it was 8900, looks like Apex were collecting in two accounts, Overdraft and Loan.

 

 After failing to supply CCA, and me making formal complaint, account was sent back to Lloyds. Lloyds never wrote to me and the Debt was sold to Cabot in July 2019. 
 

agreement shows debt was added to previous debt however Andy says if the money was used to pay the previous debt, the new agreement takes precedent. 

[dx100uk]

PRA are typically a debt buyer, amex do not buy debts only operate on behalf of their letters stated client, so you need to clarify all this to correctly tell the story. and with whatever you previously paid off when you took out this refinancing loan with lloyds.

 

1 hour ago, sxam said:

I made CCA request to Apex in September 2017 to which they ask me to write to Lloyds quoting some reference.

 

so it was still with the original creditor then.

 

i will guess at some point lloyds merged the OD and the loan and made you refinance to this loan and the £18k balance it stated out with then sold it too cabot?

 

so much confusion you need to make ref too.

 

the statements even if they are not from lloyds in cabots WS refer to an this £18k loan .