CEL GYM Parking - entered wrong reg

[MeVsPPC]

Hello everyone,

 

On the 13th December 2019 I had visited my local gym and parked in the carpark as I usually do.

(The gym has a camera parking system set up so that only people that are using the facilities can park there otherwise you will be issued a fine by the Private Parking Company (Civil Enforcement Ltd)

 

This time, when visiting the gym I used my father's car instead of my own. 
When you enter the gym, you must type in your car registration number on the keypad inside the gym as you are not allowed to park at the gym unless you are using the facilities. 

Unfortunately for me, this time I had made a mistake and entered the registration details of the car I usually use rather than my father's registration number for his car.
(I had only used the facilities for 30 minutes as well!)

 

On the 19th December 2019 my father received a PCN stating that I must pay £100 or £60 within 14 days.  
I immediately visited my gym to let them know my mistake and to see if there was anything the owner could do. 

The owner of the gym & the car park told me that he can cancel PCN's but the PPC only let him cancel up to 5 per month and he had already used his 5 for the month already so he said to try and appeal it and then if that fails then he will cancel it the following month. 

 

I quickly appealed the parking charge letting them know what had happened and that I was the one using the car so that the PCN should be addressed to me and not my father.

 

On the 22nd February 2020 I received a letter sent to me this time instead of my father stating that my appeal had been unsuccessful
 

On the 25th February 2020 I received another PCN for the exact same offence but this time it was in my name rather than my father's name.

 

My next step was to make an appeal via POPLA.

I made the appeal explaining my situation and giving them the same information that I had given to Civil Enforcement LTD.

 

I understand that we are in the middle of a pandemic so that I expect things to move at a slow pace but I didn't receive an answer from POPLA about my appeal until the 24th April 2020 and they had denied my appeal.

 

In the appeal they stated that 
POPLA’s role is to assess if the PCN was issued correctly only.

POPLA cannot allow an appeal based on mitigating circumstances.

 

Even if the appellant provided evidence to show they are a gym member and to show the conversation with the gym owner, this would not invalidate the PCN. The appellant would be required to provide evidence that shows they did not breach the terms and conditions and the appellant has confirmed they entered the wrong vehicle registration.

 

When entering onto a private car park such as this one, any motorist forms a contract with the operator by remaining on the land for a reasonable period.

 

The signage in place sets out the terms and conditions of this contract.

 

 

Ultimately, it is the motorist’s responsibility to comply with the terms and conditions of the car park.

Upon consideration of the evidence, the appellant failed to register their vehicle details, and therefore did not comply with the terms and conditions.

As such, I conclude that the PCN has been issued correctly. Accordingly, I must refuse this appeal."

 

After this I could not contact the owner of the gym to see if he could help me out as he had closed the gym and I could not find another way of getting hold of him.

I did not hear anything else about the PCN until the 26th June 2020 when I received a letter from ZZPS Limited (A debt collection agency)

After I received this I managed to get hold of the gym/car park owner and explained to him the situation and he said he would contact the PPC to get it sorted for me.

Later on that day I received a message from him saying that the PCN had gone too far and he couldn't get it cancelled for me. 

His contact for the PPC sent him this message:

'We are unable to cancel this PCN as it was appealed to POPLA.

POPLA is the independent parking arbitrator and once a driver appeals to them we cannot intervene or override their decision.

POPLA have reviewed the case from both sides and made a judgement in our favour - this decision must be abided by both parties'.

The owner of the gym/car park said to me to just ignore it and don't pay it because he doesn't think they would do anything (probably not the best advice haha).

 

I tried contacting POPLA, Civil Enforcement LTD & ZZPS explaining my situation again, stating that the owner of the car park has said he is happy to cancel the PCN and that I can get him to contact to prove this but I received no response from any of the 3 companies.

 

I decided to ignore the letter from ZZPS, not the best idea but its what I was advised to do. 
I didn't hear anything more about this until the 12th August 2020 when I received a letter from a new company this time. - QDR Solicitors.
 

As you can see this cost has now risen to £182 and I am determined to not have to pay this.
I tried to contact QDR Solicitors explaining my situation yet again but received no response.

 

I continued to ignore this and didn't hear anything again until the 9th October 2020 when I received a letter this time from the original PCN company Civil Enforcement LTD.

This letter says it is a Claim for Debt letter. 

 

this is where I am at now with it.

I am stressing out a bit and I'm not sure what I can do going forward.

I have moved out of the house that I lived in with my father as I have no gone to university, however he still lives at the address.

I am also no longer included on the insurance for my father's car and he now owns it fully and is the only person insured on it now.

 

I don't want debt collectors turning up to my old house and taking my father's car away from him and/or other personal belongings when the debt is my issue.
 
There was quite a few bits of paper included in this letter - How can I upload pictures of all the letters I have received?

 

Thanks in advance!

[dx100uk]

1st it is not a fine 

2nd a DCA is NOT A BAILIFF

and have 

ZERO powers on any debt, regardless upon it's type.

 

until/unless you receive a letter of claim

pers i'd simply ignore everything now

for either speculative invoice (i believe there are two?)

 

 

[honeybee13]

Hello and welcome to CAG.

 

As dx100uk says, the only time you need to worry is if you receive a Letter Before Claim/Action and then we'll tell you what to say to them.

 

Don't get stressed about this, you're a long way from bailiffs turning up to seize the car, which could only happen if it ever got to court, you lost by for example not turning up at the court and then not paying what might be due. Debt collectors aren't bailiffs however scary they might sound.

 

Please talk to us more about why you're worred and we can reassure you.

 

Best, HB

[lookinforinfo]

Do not stress yourself-entering the wrong reg. number is fairly common. And whilst the parking companies never cancel them the Courts never allow them.

 

Second, CEL know it is you who they are pursuing so they cannot take anything of your father's.

Bailiffs [not debt collectors who are in the same category as dung beetles are nobodies and you perfectly right to ignore them.] Bailiffs can only get involved if 

1] your case goes to Court 

2] you lose-highly unlikely

3] you cannot pay the fine despite being allowed to pay it in instalments.

 

Do not worry about the payment, partly because I believe you won't have to pay it, and because they cannot charge you £182 since the maximum they can charge is the amount stipulated on their signage which is usually £100.

Please post up the last letter you received from CEL as it maybe a  letter of Claim which you do would need to respond to.

 

Can you please answer the questions below and  post up the PCN which was the first one sent to you-post the back of the PCN as well as the front.

 

Next time you go to the gym, please take photos of the signage at the entrance and around the area particularly any signs that differ from the others. 

[MeVsPPC]

Thats great to hear!
 

 

Thank you for all your help, you and the others that have posted on here have really reassured me.

When you receive all of these letters threatening court etc its quite scary!

 

Thank you so much for all the help!

 

[dx100uk]

3 hours ago, lookinforinfo said:

you cannot pay the fine despite being allowed to pay it in instalments.

 

a county court is a Civil Court - and cannot fine you

 

only a magistrate's court (criminal) can Fine you.

 

the gov't are just about to agree legislation that removes wrong reg as a reason to issue a speculative invoice too

 

[dx100uk]

please refrain from using image hosting sites

read our upload guide carefully and use only ONE multipage PDF for everything.

[MeVsPPC]

Oh sorry, I didn't realise I wasnt allowed to post Imgur links 
I will try and work out how to post a PDF now