Cabot/Restons Claimform - EE Mobile Debt.

[C78]

AOS is now done on the MCOL site following the info above. Defending all the claim, jurisdiction left unticked. As I say I'll print off the other form in the morning and post recorded to Restons.

[AndyOrch]

[C78]

Can I ask what the normal process would be now as I'm a little aware of these dates in the back of my mind

but haven't heard anything from anywhere since I sent those off.

 

 

Yet to hear from EE and up to now Restons haven't replied

but of course they probably should only have received my CPR 31.14 form last Wednesday so it hasn't been that long yet.

[AndyOrch]

Time to read other threads and familiarise yourself with the process..have a read in the Financial Legal Success Forum...threads there concluded take you from start to finish.

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?190-Legal-Successes

 

Andy

[C78]

I'll have a look through, thanks.

[C78]

Just found a letter posted today from Restons acknowledging my CPR 31.14 and basically saying they don't need to provide me anything...

 

[dx100uk]

as you've already seen on all the other reston threads you've been reading??

so you know what comes next and have done some self help.......ignore

just don't forget your defence filing date no matter what....

[C78]

I have looked through some,

just I'm finding it difficult to know fully what I'm doing and getting easily lost when reading through so much information.

When you're stressing and not in the best headspace it's easy to panic at doing something wrong

 

 

whilst I understand you need people to research too rather than request every little detail,

it's just that it's very easy to get completely baffled and lost when looking through so many pages and situations when you've had zero experience with this type of thing.

 

I was trying to post an image of the letter to show exactly what they said but it didn't work.

They're saying their original letter provided me enough details such as when the account was opened,

the account number, outstanding balance and the name of the original creditor

and also the fact the account has been assigned to the claimant and when it was assigned so that's all I need and they see no reason why I need an additional copy of my contractual terms and conditions as I would have been provided that when the original account was opened.

[dx100uk]

well its what restons send to everyone re a CPR

 

 

.......ignore

just don't forget your defence filing date no matter what....

 

 

don't forget our targeted search CAG box

in the top red top toolbar

 

 

its far better than the grey one below our logo

and we earn money too by you using it..

 

 

type in it

 

 

cabot reston claimform mobile

[C78]

Ah I see so it's a standard response from them.

 

I will search that way now thanks. Previously I was opening all kinds of threads from the main page but this search should narrow it down better.

[dx100uk]

[C78]

At the moment I don't see any coming up for mobile phone debts. Only credit cards and other things. I'm still looking through though. What bothers me most is not knowing where to begin on the whole filing a defense situation which I gather is my next move before the 20th if I remember rightly. I've seen a few on here but none that match my circumstances up to now so I don't know where to begin.

[dx100uk]

just use

 

reston claimform mobile

 

urm that's strange

no previous reston mobil claimforms ...urm

 

just use

mobile claimform

 

 

or

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?477123-Arrow-Drydens-claimform-old-02-account

[C78]

So I have until Friday to send my defence. I'm still pretty overwhelmed by all of this stuff at this stage but after looking through I'm hoping this is the wording that best fits my situation based on other threads...Please bare with me if I've missed anything or this needs much work.

 

Particulars of Claim.

 

The claimant claims payment of the overdue balance due from the Defendant(s) under a contract between the Defendant(s) and Everything Everywhere dated on or about Jun 23 2008 and assigned to the Claimant on Aug 26 2016

 

What is the value of the claim £758.05

 

Defence

 

1. Paragraph 1 is neither admitted or denied with regards to the defendant entering into an agreement referred to in the Particulars of Claim (‘the Agreement’) the Claimant has yet to disclose any such agreement.

 

2. Paragraph 1 is denied with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant the claimant has failed to provide any evidence of assignment/balance/breach as requested by CPR 31. 14 and the Claimant is put to strict proof to:

(a) show how the Defendant has entered into an agreement with the Claimant; and

(b) show how the Defendant has reached the amount claimed for; and

© show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim;

 

3. As per Civil Procedureicon Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed.

 

4. On the alternative, if the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of Section 136 of the Law of Property Act and Section 82A of the consumer crediticon Act 1974.

 

5. The amount claimed will likely to include an early termination charge(s) amounting to the entire balance of the remaining contract. OFCOM guidance states that any Early Termination Charge that is made up of the entire balance if the remaining contract is unlikely to be fair as it fails to take into account the fact that the provider no longer has to provide and pay for their service.

 

6. By reason of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm not sure if I need any details of the claim added in above this when I submit my defence and after looking through it's only really point 4 which I'm unsure if it fits my circumstances or not. I wanted to get this on now though so I have time to edit and tweak properly before leaving it until the last minute.

 

Overall I agree that I remember having a contract with EE in the past (so actually the wording on point 1 may be a little out, maybe it should state that I recall an agreement but not the default or figures?) but I can't agree with the default situation not knowing what happened and with not hearing anything about it for years afterwards until we got to this stage suddenly. I certainly dispute the figures as they have to be massively off with termination charges and charges added on by Cabot unknowingly to me. Seeing as Restons refuse to send me any of the original details or figure breakdowns to show me how they've arrived at the extortionate figure they have, I'm guessing this is outlined in points 3 and 5.

 

I've yet to hear from EE but they are still within the 40 day timeframe of course so I literally only have Restons letter that very briefly states the contract and termination dates and the overall figure which they claim I somehow owe. They seem to think that's all that needs to be provided but only a fool would pay some random huge figure without a breakdown of costs even if you admitted guilt, which under the circumstances I'm obviously not. I thought I'd break this down again here as I'm unsure if there is something I've missed out which should be on the defence or if I've got something in there which shouldn't be (as I say number 4 is the one that I'm most uncertain of)

 

Hopefully all this makes sense as this is the stage I was most nervous of being honest, knowing how to submit all this information in the correct manner to the court.

[AndyOrch]

We do not advocate using a " neither admit or deny ".. " Overall I agree that I remember having a contract with EE in the past " Then state so do not mislead the court..be truthful.

 

Edit to suit.......

 

The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are vague and generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.

 

1. Paragraph 1 is accepted. I have, in the past, entered into a contract with T Mobile then subsequently Orange , however I do not recall the exact details, nor do I recall any outstanding balance. I have requested the claimant verify the exact details of this claim by way of a CPR 31.14. The claimant has refused to provide me with a copy of the agreement, stating he is not obligated to do so by virtue of the consumer credit Act 1974. To date, no statement of the alleged account has been received.

 

2. Paragraph 2 is noted, again I do not recall any breach and I have never received the stated Default Notice. The Claimant has stated, by letter, that he is not obligated to provide a copy of the Default Notice, again by virtue of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

3. Paragraph 3 is denied.I do not recall having received a Notice of Assignment, as stated by the Claimant and despite my request for a copy of said document, under CPR 31.14, the Claimant has failed to provide me with such to date.

 

Therefore the Claimant is to provide strict proof to:

 

(a) show how the Defendant has entered into a Agreement/ Contract; and

(b) show how the Defendant has reached the amount claimed for; and

© show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim;

 

 

4. The Claimant has stated that he has made several requests for repayment, yet I do not acknowledge any debt to the Claimant.

 

5. As per Civil Procedure Rule 16.5(4), it is required that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed.

 

6. As the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim, due to contraventions of Section 136 of the Law of Property Act.

 

7. Subject to the above, should the alleged amount claimed include an early termination charge(s) amounting to the total balance of the remaining contract, OFCOM guidance clearly states that any Early Termination Charge, that is made up of the entire balance of the remaining contract, is unlikely to be fair, as it fails to take into account the fact that the provider no longer has to provide and pay for their service.

 

8. By reason of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed, or any relief.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[C78]

Thanks Andy that looks much better.

 

In regards to number 4,

can I say that with me getting letters from Cabot in the last month or so before I got the Restons court threat

can I really say that I had no contact from them before this claim?

It doesn't really fit but I don't know if I'm best just removing that altogether and going with the rest or not.

 

I had no contact for years

(although I have a feeling letters could have gone from EE and then Cabot before to an old address, just I have no way of knowing now) but did start getting letters about a debt of £758 from Cabot in August this year out of the blue and phone calls which I never answered too (kept getting recorded messages left on my voicemail)

 

as I say I wasn't about to

 

I can't really leave in that I've heard nothing until court (unless you advise me to) but at the same time did not personally ever hear anything from EE before this (unless as I say, that's because they were writing to an old address) so I'm not sure on that section. Everything else looks perfect.

[dx100uk]

leave it in its part of the std response

just look at any other mobile claimform thread

[AndyOrch]

Thanks Andy that looks much better.

 

In regards to number 4,

can I say that with me getting letters from Cabot in the last month or so before I got the Restons court threat

can I really say that I had no contact from them before this claim?

It doesn't really fit but I don't know if I'm best just removing that altogether and going with the rest or not.

 

I had no contact for years

(although I have a feeling letters could have gone from EE and then Cabot before to an old address, just I have no way of knowing now) but did start getting letters about a debt of £758 from Cabot in August this year out of the blue and phone calls which I never answered too (kept getting recorded messages left on my voicemail)

 

as I say I wasn't about to

 

I can't really leave in that I've heard nothing until court (unless you advise me to) but at the same time did not personally ever hear anything from EE before this (unless as I say, that's because they were writing to an old address) so I'm not sure on that section. Everything else looks perfect.

 

As stated ...edited to suit your particulars..if its not applicable..remove it.....but try to keep to that layout

[C78]

I'm going to submit this today before the deadline tomorrow.

 

It's the 4th point I'm still struggling with, I'm happy with the rest.

 

See I want to leave the a, b and c points in as they still fit

but I'm unsure seeing as I had that brief spell of letters and calls from Cabot in August.

 

I feel like I can't say they didn't try to contact me at all before going for a CCJ with that happening,

even though I didn't hear anything for years up until then and all the rest is hazy.

 

Thinking back, it wasn't even EE that I first started with as it was T-Mobile at first I think, then Orange.

It was EE at the end probably but it's all very hazy now.

 

I'm wondering do I go with what dx said and just leave it in or do I have to change the 4th statement some so that I can still leave in the 3 points underneath it which definitely do apply.

 

I have no knowledge of how this got to the figure it did for certain so that has to be in there.

[AndyOrch]

Well in your particulars of claim they do no plead contacting you...in fact they plead very little......so it should be edited to suit as already advised...remove it.

[dx100uk]

there you go..remove it.

[C78]

I can see where it's been worded removing that part now, thankyou.

[C78]

I have filed my defence now. Will wait to see what happens next. Thankyou both for all your help up to now. Keeping my fingers crossed they get cold feet before it gets any further but we'll see I guess.

[C78]

Just to update you on what's happening.

 

I received a letter from the court days after submitting my defence acknowledging that my defence has been filed.

It says they will let Restons know and await their response which is the standard routine here no doubt.

 

The only thing I will add is that I've also received a phone book sized package from EE with all the details in that I requested, old bills etc.

It now seems as though in 2014 they were sending bills which my girlfriend at the time was obviously intercepting as I've never seen these with the figures going up and up and up before.

 

As I said at the beginning,

she took charge of dealing with the account when I lived there and had 2 extra sims added onto the account which I had been using with EE for years before (and never had missed a payment with)

 

I can see now itemised bills for calls and texts outside of the free minutes and bills racking up.

I can't make much sense of it as there's huge lists of calls for seconds and callbacks within a minute or two etc loads of times I suppose that's besides the point.

 

Overall I'm now nervous that seeing as EE have provided me with proof of an account in my name that has run into huge debts, does this mean I'm screwed if this ends up going to court as I can see a few people on these threads have?

 

I didn't see these bills and once I left her in December 2014 I never heard anything at all no doubt they were sending them to hers (she still lives at the same address) and she's just binned the letters as she still maintains she never had any.

 

Now I'm worried that EE providing me all this information

(it also says how they wrote it off but then sold it onto Cabot in August 2016 like they have claimed themselves)

means I'll be stuffed in court as Restons/Cabot are correct in what they say it would seem.

 

Regardless of me not knowing about the debt or hearing about it,

to all intents it has been run up in my name

 

even though I didn't know, there is now proof there from EE which would stop me from saying there is no debt.

Even the figure is massive because it seems to be a lot of calls that were paid in part then stopped

 

it's a combination of the unpaid calls then a couple of months of large line rental fees added on.

 

Getting all that has totally deflated me as I now worry that I've been completely shafted by my ex and I'm going to end up swallowing the whole lot.

It seems like all I can hope for is Restons giving up before it reaches court then going off other threads I now have barely any hope that they will.

 

Someone please tell me I may be wrong

[dx100uk]

what you hold and know you keep quiet about.

 

its ONLY what the fleecers produce that they can rely upon