CEL ANPR PCN Claimform - Hawley Retail Park Hinckley **WON using 3 line def..+COSTS**

[honeybee13]

Hi.

 

Could you resave your document as a pdf please? That way we'll be able to enlarge it.

 

HB

[dx100uk]

don't worry about converting that

we don't need to see a court claimform.

 

can you complete this please:

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?465231-Received-a-Court-Claim-From-A-Private-parking-Speculative-invoice-How-To-Deal-With-It-HERE***Updated-Aug-2016***

[ericsbrother]

you shoulod have acknowledged the claim a fortnight ago so you need to create an account on moneyclaimonline NOW and both acknowledge and submit a skeleton defence. this should be as follows.

 

1. the claimant has failed to show a cause for action against the defendant as they have not stated in what capacity they are suing him, as driver fo the vehicle who ebtered a contract with them or as keeper under the protocols of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. the defendant denies being the driver at the time.

 

2 the claimants has failed to provide a breakdonw of the claim as required under CPR 16.4. the claim for brach of contract totaks £100 and there is no explanationas to why this has now been inflated to £236 as the POFA limits anty clim to the sum set out in the Notice to Keeper.

 

3. In any case, the defendant denies that any contract exists between the claimant and himself.

 

get this submitted NOW and you may be OK but in reality you are already subject to a default judgement.

Why on earth didnt you post this up when you got it

Edited April 5, 2018 by honeybee13
Paras

[Poor-Paulus]

Name of the Claimant ? CIVIL ENFORCEMENT LIMITED

claimants Solicitors: It looks like it’s straight from CEL, no solicitors.

 

Date of issue – 14 Mar 2018

 

Date to submit defence – 16 Apr 2018

 

What is the claim for –

 

Claim for monies relating to a Parking Charge for parking in a private car park managed by the Claimant in breach of the terms + conditions (T+Cs).

Drivers are allowed to part in accordance with T+Cs of use.

ANPR cameras and/or manual patrols are used to monitor vehicles entering + exiting the side.

 

Debt + damages claimed the sum of 236.00.

Violation date: 21/04/2017.

Time in: 16:00. Time out: 19:06.

PCN ref: XXXXXXXXXX

Car registration: XXXXXXXXXX

Car park: Hawley Retail Park

 

Total due- 236.00

 

The Claimant claims the sum of 252.86 for monies relating to a parking charge per above including 16.86 interest pursuant to S.69 of the County Court Act 1984.

Rate 8.00% pa from dates above to- 13/03/18

Same rate to Judgement or (sooner) payment.

Daily rate to Judgement- 0.05.

Total debt and interest due- 252.86

 

 

What is the value of the claim? £327.86 including fees

 

Has the claim been issued by the Private parking Company or was the PCN assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim ? Issued by the Private Parking Company.

 

Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? ---

 

Ericsbrother, I work away a lot, so I don't get to see my post on a daily basis. I have made the required online acknowledgement within the time limit stated.

 

The text in red for the “particulars”, is word-for-word of the Claim Form.

[dx100uk]

Now go back and file the defence in post 28

[dx100uk]

you need to send this to CEL

 

to the solicitors

 

[Your address]

.

 

[Their address [solicitors]

.

[Date]

.

 

Dear Sir or Madam,

.

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

.

CPR 31.14 Request

.

On (date) I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the (Name) county court.

.

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

.

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of [each of the following / the] document(s) mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

.

1. the contract between [parking company name] and the landowner that assigns the right to enter into contracts with the public and make claims in their own name,.

.

2.proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and Country Planning Act 2007

.

3.copies of the notice to driver, notice to keeper and any other correspondence from [insert Claimant Name] & [insert Solicitors Name} to the defendant that they intend to rely upon in court.

.

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are disclosed at your earliest convenience..

.

Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy.

.

Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

.

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

.

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

.

If you are unable to comply with this request within 14 days and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request please confirm in your response.

.

You are reminded that as this case is yet to be allocated to a track, CPR31:14 does apply, a refusal to comply because you 'think' at this stage you dont have too will be used against you in any filed defence.

.

 

Yours faithfully

.

TYPE YOUR NAME DO NOT SIGN IT

[Poor-Paulus]

Thanks everyone...I'm on it.

[Poor-Paulus]

Hi everyone,

I have done as recommended and things are progressing.

 

I have received a letter from he County Court requesting that I complete a N180 form.

 

It looks simple enough, but is there anything specfic that I should or shouldn't be saying on the form?

 

...further update, I haven't received anything back from CEL in respect to the requests made in the above template.

[ericsbrother]

good, that means you can put in your defence that you do not believe they have the authorisations as they have failed to produce them as a response to your CPR 31.14.

 

 

Also means that you can argue later that their actions are unreasonable and thus claim a full costs recovery which will include money for your research time.

 

 

Once CEL see this in your defence they tend to try and badger you into settling for a lesser amount and then either drop the claim or just fail to turn up

Edited June 8, 2018 by honeybee13
Paras

[Poor-Paulus]

...another update.

Yes, you were right again. They did badger me to settle this at a reduced cost, which I have ignored and they haven't replied to my previous correspondence (template by dx100uk, above). I have now received a Small Claims Hearing.

 

I would appreciate some advice on preparing for this as I've never been in to a Small Claims Court before (I'm a good boy).

[ericsbrother]

this means you do nothing,

their bluff has been called by the court process and they now have to either pay up the allocation fee or the claim is dead.

This is not a hearing, it is an instruction to them to put up or shut up.

 

Even if they pay htis I would happily take a bet that they will drop the matter before it gets to a hearing. So prepare your defence so you can exchange documents a fortnight before the january date.

 

Also take down this attachment as it has your name and the court left on it.

they identify you and may convince CEL to try and apply pressure on you by telling you they know you are taking advice on a forum and that is somehow wrong.

 

It isnt but they will use anything to get you to waver and settle before the hearing because they know they dont have a case.

Edited September 14, 2018 by dx100uk
spacing

[ericsbrother]

so make a note on your calendar and as soon as they fail to pay the fee you get on to the court.

 

If they do pay the fee them you work on your witness statement and other evidence and show us what you intend to go with.

 

This is still a long way away but get your pictures and other evidence prepared, they will produce false images of signage and claim that is what is there.

[Poor-Paulus]

Thanks again. I have my photos prepared, ready and waiting. Fingers crossed that they do the right thing and back-down.

[Poor-Paulus]

I have finally had a response from CEL.

 

They have provided the information that I was recommended to request (photos/all correspondance etc) in April/May.

 

As well as this, I haven't received any more concerning the court action and the deadline of 21 Dec has passed.

 

How do I find out if they paid the fees?

Edited January 12, 2019 by dx100uk
spacing

[ericsbrother]

check on your moneyclaim online console or phone the court.

If you quote the case ref any court can tell you but as your local court will have the paperwork best ask them and then you can request they ask the judge to stay the claim.

 

Court officers can do quite a lot on their own initiative and some are good at helping people making enquiries and some are obstructive and may demand you use a N244 and pay £255 for what should be an automatic thing.

 

you will find out soon enough when you ask about the stay.

Edited January 7, 2019 by dx100uk
space/spell

[Poor-Paulus]

Thanks for the speedy reply. I'll give them a call in the morning.

[Poor-Paulus]

After what must be over 100 attempts, spread over several days, I have finally got through - CEL DID pay the fees, so the case is on.

 

Being that I'm not the most organised person in the world,

I did not submit my witness statement prior to the required 14 days (the case is to be heard on the 18th Jan).

This was because the deadline for paying the court fees was just a few days before Christmas, so I had other things on my mind.

So, What can I do?

 

On 4th Jan, I received the CEL's pack with all of their evidence,

but haven't put together a pack of my open because I completely forgot about it until theirs arrived;

 

I appreciate that this is no defence.

 

That’s exactly 14 days before the hearing.

I wasn’t home, s

assume that the postman signed for it.

Is this legal?

 

When I checked the Royal Mail website, there’s a scrawl that obviously isn’t mine, so can this be considered inadmissible?

 

Without going in to too much detail,

from what I can see,

in my opinion their witness statement is flawed

- the sign I saw stating that there was 3 hours parking belonged to another parking company, not CEL.

 

Their signs state 2 hours,

but I did not pass one on the way to my parking space.

 

How was I supposed to know the difference?

I know that I was parked for 3h 7m, but isn't that within the 10min grace period that parking attendants give (or have I imagined that?).

Edited January 12, 2019 by dx100uk
spacing

[honeybee13]

Hi.

 

I think you need to start working on your papers together now. Did you submit a defence?

 

HB

[dx100uk]

you mean you've received their witness statement but you've yet to do yours?

[ericsbrother]

you had better learn to read properly and byn that I mean read things thoroughly. CEL havent submitted a DEFENCE, that is for you to do.

 

As for NOT writing an submitting your defence you should have read the court paperwork and other threads so you would know that you stick to the timetable regardless of what the other side does. If they say tey are drodping their claim you still attend court unless the COURT has told you otherwise.

 

Get your defnce writtne tonight, post it here for peopel to comment on and then get it sent to court by both letter mail and email attachment.

 

You neerd pictures of the signs, you need pland of the car park suitably anotated, you need to tell us whether they have planning and if they dont you use the document linked in the parking pranksters blogspot of dec 2017 to show why they need it and wehy thier signs are ILLEGAL and thus no contract can be formed.

 

You have had over a year to get a grip of this and still you havent doen a thing about it that can be said to be decisive so time to put it all together and produce soemthing that will knock them over.

 

Are the images in their WS the same as at the actual site or just computer mock ups? Thye usually use the latter so compare whrit evidence with the reality.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

post up what they have sent so we can pick holes in it

Edited January 10, 2019 by honeybee13
Paras

[Poor-Paulus]

@dx100uk

 

I'm afraid so.

 

@ericsbrother

Having not been through anything like this before;

I admit that I have been a little ignorant to what is required.

 

I have had parking tickets before that I have contested successfully,

but they have never got this far and I was expecting this to be the same.

My bad.

 

They've sent a massive pack of info.

I'll scan it all and get it up on here ASAP.

Is it acceptable to copies of their defence as my defence?

 

Attached is the CEL pack of information.

I have broken it up in to 5 sections because it was over 22mb.

I will post that up if that is prefered.

 

I will work on my pack and upload it as soon as I have completed it.

claimants WS .pdf

Edited January 11, 2019 by dx100uk
merge

[dx100uk]

stop using the word defence...they are WITNESS STATEMENTS.

 

get yours done and in.

there are numerous examples here already.

 

you are a LiP litigant in person.

and are given certain leeway.

 

to day should be well ok to submit.

[dx100uk]

claimant WS in post 46 sorted.

 

the court cases they mention are not applicable

there is already a WS here that blows them apart.

 

have you gone and got and CHECKED:

 

the planning permission for the signs

 

the planning permission for the cameras.

 

 

the ORIGINAL parking specs in the planning permission when the estate was granted permission...typically free parking is 3 hours, no-one can change that.

 

have they sent a copy of the current and PAID UP contract with the land owner?

 

 

whomever turns up for cohen

you check they are a registered solicitor or they cant say a word!!

[brassnecked]

Those cases have been rebutted before as DX indicates, and Beavis is only relevant to it;s own facts, so not applicable here,

 

Amazed they didn't trot out some other old discredited chestnuts with no relevance like Elliott v Loake and CPS v AJH Films. as Belt & Braces

[ericsbrother]

well, their sign is as said a computer mock up so you had bertter takle some pictures of th real signs with you.

 

no mention of any futher costs beinmg claimed as part of that cpontract so they cant and in any case when they are claiming from the keeper under the POFA the amount is limited to what is demanded on the invoice so there usurious debt decovery fees and admin arent legal. Drive this point home so that if for some reason you do lose then they will only get the £100.

 

The plan isnt a plan so use a grab from google earth to show what it really looks like from above. Even small differences will make the rest of their evidence unrelaible. Their signs arent compliant with their Accredited Trade Association and therefore the signs dont comply with para 12 of the POFA

 

the signage piccy on page 16 of their WS clearly cant be read from a passing car and there is no evidence that the core terms they rely on are visible and as they say 2 hours maximum feee parking this indicates there is an offer to park for longer than 2 hours under other conditions. No offer for an extended period appears or any explanation as to how you pay for stopping beyond 2 hours is indicated so it isnt a fair contract.

 

clearly the actual 3 hours permitted parking period renders their contract void. The terms on that sign are totally different to the other signs so there is confusionas to what is being offered. This means that s62 of the consumer rights act applies and the whole lot are not binding. Same goes with the sign at entrance, different so the others arent a binding contract but at best an invitation to treat

 

you take copies of the POFA and the CRA 2015 with you as the judge wont be digging them out just to make you happy

 

I am not happy that you still refer to their defence when it is a plaintiff's witness statement. This is what I mena about reading things properly, you still arent doing this so you may well miss a lot of important things because you answer what you think has beed said rather than what is actually there. Pay attention and you wont drop yourself in it.

Edited January 12, 2019 by honeybee13
Paras