Parking on private land from October 2012 legislation

[Dublindel]

Another question.... The BPA and government require the PPC to pay £27 for the POPLA appeal. If the driver/RK decide not to pay if the appeal goes them. Can the PPC claim back the £27.

[Crocdoc]

I would'nt imagine so.

[afcwben]

Another question.... The BPA and government require the PPC to pay £27 for the POPLA appeal. If the driver/RK decide not to pay if the appeal goes them. Can the PPC claim back the £27.

 

I imagine the number of appeals may go through the roof costing these clowns lots of money

[Crocdoc]

In a previous post I questioned the BPA estimate relating to the number of appeals, I take the view that maths is not a strong point within the organisation.

In addition, I understand that the appeals board will take legal arguments into consideration. This being the case every successful appeal should be posted on this site to ensure to ensure consistency.

 

SO IT'S JUST A MATTER OF WHO IS GOING TO BE FIRST TO PUT IT TO THE TEST.

Edited September 10, 2012 by Crocdoc

[coyls]

 

I understand that the appeals board will take legal arguments into consideration.

 

SO IT'S JUST A MATTER OF WHO IS GOING TO BE FIRST TO PUT IT TO THE TEST.

 

Ahem, so my partner (RK) recieves a PPC "invoice" and appeals.

Denied, so off to POOPLA with weak defence (not naming driver) - (PPC pay £37.40 inc VAT).

Appeal denied of course (PPC cream pants coz won)

Aw shucks, names me as driver

I recieve begging letter so i appeal

Appeal denied, off to POOPLA with strong defence:whoo:

 

Next ticket, rinse and repeat !!!

[Crocdoc]

£27.00 + VAT per appeal, but I take your point, anyone else with an opinion on this one.

[benny46]

Would the appeal broke down in car park and had to await delivery of a new coil pack and then fit it not work in a court of law, yes I entered the car park in good faith only meaning to stay there two hours but due to unforseen circumstances was delayed in my departure.

Would a court allow them to charge you an excess amount of money for such a defense or would the case be thrown out?

[toplad]

just got a ticket from ppc - could i inform them that i forgot to get a ticket and that i am happy to pay there daily rate. i could also let them know i am dyslexic and part of my condition is very poor short term memory. Any further fine i would view as disability discrimination.

 

or

 

on the ppc notice, it states iam required to pay 75.00 pounds within 28 days. the charge will be reduced to £ if the payment is recieved within 14 days.

 

the reduction box is blank and could be filled in to £0, also no offence code was input.

 

which do you think is the best course of action.

[Crocdoc]

Ist point there is no offence, this is an invoice from a Private company IT IS NOT A PARKING TICKET, (IGNORE) If it uses the term offence please post it up as this type of information is currently being collated.

[labrat]

bets on them coming up with something new...

 

i.e. Anyone parking here agrees to have their wheel nuts removed...

[firstclassx]

Can I just clarify that my interpretation is correct in that an individual appealing does not have to pay anything for the appeal, but the car parking company has to pay around £30?

 

As for the clamping issue/ticketing, can't clamping outfits now just take the vehicle away under the newly amended S.99 Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 and state the vehicle was obstructively parked, dangerously parked, abandoned or broken down??

 

I would also be looking to Section 111 of the Protection of Freedoms Act for continued letters from private companies.... Section 111(3b)(3f), and, if they happen to be monitoring CAG, then perhaps also 3d.

Edited September 13, 2012 by firstclassx

[Crocdoc]

Correct, However they state that you will no longer be allowed the SO CALLED DISCOUNT if you appeal fails. But on the other hand the good news is that the decision is only binding on the PPC.

 

I MAKE IT £32.40 PER HIT.

 

CAN I JUST SAY THAT I AM EXTREMELY DISAPOINTED THAT I LIVE IN SCOTLAND AS I WON'T BE ALLOWED TO PLAY, IF YOU GET MY DRIFT.

Edited September 13, 2012 by Crocdoc

[DBC]

From the Department of Transport

 

Guidance on Section 56 and Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012: Recovery of Unpaid Parking Charges

 

http://assets.dft.gov.uk/publications/guidance-unpaid-parking-charges/guidance-unpaid-parking-charges.pdf

 

This is one of the most important sections:-

 

Charges for breaking a parking contract must be reasonable and a genuine preestimate of loss. This means charges must compensate the landholder only for the loss they are likely to suffer because the parking contract has been broken.

For example, to cover the unpaid charges and the administrative costs associated with issuing the ticket to recover the charges. Charges may not be set at higher levels than necessary to recover business losses and the intention should not be to penalise the driver.

 

Of course those "admin charges" cannot include the ordinary running costs of the office and staff wages. The PPC has to bear these costs even if no tickets are issued. So it looks as though they can claim very little in actual losses.

[coyls]

Correct, However they state that you will no longer be allowed the SO CALLED DISCOUNT if you appeal fails. But on the other hand the good news is that the decision is only binding on the PPC.

 

I MAKE IT £32.40 PER HIT.

 

 

oops, where did i get £37.40 !!!

[Crocdoc]

I wasn't aware of DOT Guidance on this subject, however this is one of the very long standing principals surrounding this entire issue. This raises many questions particularly how such charges can be claimed when for example a car park is empty or when the facility is closed at night. My personal view is that the BPA may well have shot themselves in the foot as it would appear that their determination to try an justify the existance of this industry by trying to influence legislation has simply highlighted a number of issues that they would have preffered to have left under the carpet.

[DBC]

Hopefully, when using the "independent" appeals service, those questions of pre-estimate of loss and other aspects of contract law can be used as part of the motorist's case.

 

I have also heard that the same point about actual loss is being included in the new BPA code of practice.

[Crocdoc]

Hopefully, when using the "independent" appeals service, those questions of pre-estimate of loss and other aspects of contract law can be used as part of the motorist's case.

 

I have also heard that the same point about actual loss is being included in the new BPA code of practice.

 

This is where it will become interesting, should one appeal succeed on this basis and the result is posted up it can then be used on every occasion as surely an independant appeal body must show consistency.

[DBC]

As the aspect of pre-estimate of loss is being incorporated into the BPA guidelines, then if it can be shown that the figures demanded by a PPC are just arbitrary and not an actual loss, then that would be a breach of the guidelines and puts the PPC in line for sanctions by the BPA.

[BARTS]

Received a parking charge notice on the 9th of September 2012, haven't received any letters yet as there are still a few days left before the 21 day period.

 

Does the October 2012 'Protection of Freedoms Act 2012: Recovery of unpaid parking charges' apply to me? Or does this new law only apply to those who receive a ppc after the 1st of October?

 

From my understanding I the law at the time of the offense committed applies, therefore they would need to prove who the driver was and cannot charge the registered keeper.

[SURFBOY]

Received a parking charge notice on the 9th of September 2012, haven't received any letters yet as there are still a few days left before the 21 day period.

 

Does the October 2012 'Protection of Freedoms Act 2012: Recovery of unpaid parking charges' apply to me? Or does this new law only apply to those who receive a ppc after the 1st of October?

 

From my understanding I the law at the time of the offense committed applies, therefore they would need to prove who the driver was and cannot charge the registered keeper.

Barts, can i just say no "offense" was committed.

However, you are right in your understanding. R/K Liability does not come into effect untill 1st Oct.

[Surfer01]

Received a parking charge notice on the 9th of September 2012, haven't received any letters yet as there are still a few days left before the 21 day period.

 

Does the October 2012 'Protection of Freedoms Act 2012: Recovery of unpaid parking charges' apply to me? Or does this new law only apply to those who receive a ppc after the 1st of October?

 

From my understanding I the law at the time of the offense committed applies, therefore they would need to prove who the driver was and cannot charge the registered keeper.

No offence was committed so you can safely ignore.

[greasmonkey]

Do the parking comp. have to put signs up stating what there actual losses

are or is it still down to contract law where they put there own charges on

if they go by the new law they have to charge actual losses

[DBC]

I would have thought that the actual loss would have to be taken on a case by case basis. This would depend on the time of day, whether the shops were open or closed , if the car park was full etc. So putting up any sign quoting a fixed amount would be misleading and would fall foul of the BPA guidelines.

Edited September 22, 2012 by DBC

[greasmonkey]

this is on car parks what about private land which the new law is about.

so what you are saying they can still put the signs that say if you park here you will

have to pay £80 or any charge they want the law says they can only charge

acual losses

[greasmonkey]

are these signs going to be ilegal