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    • Welcome to the National Consumer Service Buying any goods or any services??? A used car? - Paying by cash or bank transfer??? - BIG Fail!Share the love – Tell a friend about the Consumer Action Group - your National Consumer ServiceAre you buying a used car...? Protect yourself – read our used car guideESSENTIAL:: Read our Customer Services Guide!!!Twitter - Why you should open a Twitter account ESSENTIAL:: Read our Customer Services Guide!!!Have we helped you today...? Please help the CAG Had a car accident? Been offered a courtesy car?Follow @Real_CAG Parcel Delivery Insurance is Unlawful - The TimesWhy don't you change your profile picture?? Problem with utilities company or phone/broadband? Begin by sending a statutory request for your personal data. It’s free    Parcel delivery insurance is prohibited under section 57 – Consumer Rights Act – Read about It Here and in The Times.× Financial Legal Issues Complete My Profile Dismiss Next Step: Profile Photo (Profile Photo and Cover Photo) Your profile is 0% complete! Twitter X - Include the @company's twitter name in your post title – here's why… The UK Stands With Ukraine - 'Slava Ukraini' Parcel delivery insurance is prohibited under section 57 – Consumer Rights Act – Read about It Here and in The Times.  You have received a Court Claim ISSUED IN ENGLAND & WALES What you need to do Rate this topic By citizenB March 4, 2014 in Financial Legal Issues style="text-align: center;">     Thread Locked because no one has posted on it for the last 3638 days. If you need to add something to this thread then   Please click the "Report " link   at the bottom of one of the posts.   If you want to post a new story then Please Start your own new thread That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help    Thanks   citizenB Posted March 4, 2014 #1   The questionnaires below provide important information which will allow us to help you. In order to use them, you will have to copy them into your own post and then give us the answers – preferably in red below each question. You can start by overwriting the prompt: "Give answer here" below each question – and your responses should automatically appear in red   Thank you +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++   You have received a claim form.   firstly - read all the posts in this thread FIRST...   then copy this first msg to your thread - and put your answer after each question   In order for us to help you we require the following information:- [if there are more than one defendant listed - tell us]     Which Court have you received the claim from ? Name County Court   MCOL Northampton N1 ? Manual Claim CCMCC (Salford) ? New beta WWW.MONEYCLAIMS.SERVICE.GOV.UK ?   If possible please scan redact and upload a full page copy of page 1 of the claim form. (not the response page or AOS)     Name of the Claimant ? Give answer here   How many defendant's  joint or self ? Give answer here   Date of issue – top right hand corner of the claim form – this in order to establish the time line you need to adhere to. Give answer here   ^^^^^ NOTE : WHEN CALCULATING THE TIMELINE - PLEASE REMEMBER THAT THE DATE ON THE CLAIMFORM IS ONE IN THE COUNT [example: Issue date 01.03.2014 + 19 days (5 days for service + 14 days to acknowledge) = 19.03.2014 + 14 days to submit defence = 02.04.2014] = 33 days in total   Date of issue XX + 19 days ( 5 day for service + 14 days to acknowledge) = XX + 14 days to submit defence = XX (33 days in total)  if your defence filing date falls on a W/End, you must file by friday @4PM     Particulars of Claim   What is the claim for – the reason they have issued the claim? Please type out their particulars of claim in full (verbatim) less any identifiable data and round the amounts up/down. state how many digits the account number has.. Give answer here   What is the total value of the claim? Give answer here   Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? Give answer here   Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? Give answer here   Did you inform the claimant of your change of address? Give answer here Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? Give answer here   When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? Give answer here   Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? Give answer here   Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Give answer here   Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Give answer here   Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? Give answer here   Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? Give answer here   Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? Give answer here   Why did you cease payments? Give answer here   What was the date of your last payment? Give answer here   Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? Give answer here   Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? Give answer here   What you need to do now.   Answer the questions above   If you have not already done so – send a CCA request to the claimant for a copy of your agreement (If Applicable) (except for Overdraft/ Mobile/Telephone accounts)   Send a CPR31.14 request to the solicitor named on the claim form for copies of documents mentioned/implied within the claim form. There are two different versions - one for Loans/Credit cards the other for Current accounts   Request 1 - Loans/Credit Cards     Request 2 - Current Accounts     You may use a CPR part 18 request for any other information (not request documents) that you might require in order to defend yourself. Please note that CPR 18 is specifically for Fast Track claims and although technically the claim has yet to be allocated to a track the claimant may refuse to comply for this reason.   If you require CPR Part 18 - this will need to be drafted specifically.   If you are not planning on defending for one reason or another – then you will need to complete an Income and Expenditure form and contact the Solicitor with your proposal. The N9a is already enclosed in the claim pack for Admittance which should be sent to the solicitor named on the claim form   If you are considering making a partial admittance N9b must be completed and returned to the court. Please note in most cases a partial admittance will result in an automatic CCJ for the amount admitted.   You have received a Claim - What you need to do.pdf1.33 MB · 242 downloads     Before Printing the PDF TIP   If you DO NOT wish to print Page 1 (Cover Page) of the PDF, please ensure to do the following:   Ensure you go to your Printer Settings and set it to 'Print from Page 2' (this way Page 1 (Cover Page) should not print out).   Note: This will save you Ink & Paper     Bookmark   Report 3 weeks later...   AndyOrch Posted March 20, 2014 #2   Once you receive a Court Summons N1   As a defendant in a small claims case it is important that you act quickly and do not ignore the claim form when it arrives. Remember, the claim will proceed anyway even if you don’t respond. If the claim goes against you, it will be very difficult to make a counter claim as you didn’t respond to the initial small claim.   You may be unaware that you are the defendant in a small claims case that a Creditor has bought against you. When the small claims form arrives follow these initial steps:   1: Read the Form Carefully   The detail about the claim that is being bought against you will be in the ‘particulars of claim’ section. If this section isn't completed, or has the words ‘particulars of claim to follow’ take no action now and wait until you are sent details of the claim against you. You may want to consult a lawyer at this stage.   2: Respond in Time   It’s vitally important that you respond to the claim for you have been sent. Remember that there is a 19 day (5 +14) time limit on this to acknowledge the claim.You must submit before the 19 days are up, so post your response with plenty of time.If your intention is to defend the claim in full you get a further 14 days to submit your response ...so 33 days in total.   3: Talk to the Claimant   Just because a small claim has been bought against you and a claim form issued, this doesn’t mean you are not allowed to contact the claimant directly. In fact the court encourages you to try and settle the claim without the need for a court appearance. So, try and resolve your dispute directly with the claimant if you can.   Not Responding to a Small Claim   If you ignore the small claims form when it arrives this can have an adverse impact on your financial status. The court will continue with the small claims lawsuit that is being bought against you even in your absence as this is a legal requirement. When the small claim is processed you will be sent a bill showing the amount you owe and any additional costs. The small claims against you is a legal process that will be recorded on the Register of Judgements, Orders and Fines. This information is used to check your credit, so could have a negative impact when you next apply for any credit. To avoid damaging your credit rating reply to your small claims docket as soon as you can.   How to Respond to Your Small Claims Form   When you received your form from the court you will also have been sent a response pack. In this pack you will see the option that are open to you. These include:   • A dispute claim form. You can use this form if you do not agree that you are liable for the small claim being bought against you and wish to submit a Defence. • Details about how to pay the amount being claimed from you. • Details about how to admit to part of the small claim against you, and how you can ask the claimant for more time to pay.   There are Two Types of Small Claims:   Fixed Amounts:   If the claim against you is for a fixed amount of money your response pack will contain three forms. Form N9 (acknowledgement of Service), form N9A (admission form) and N9B (defence and counterclaim form).   Unspecified Amounts:   If the amount being claimed is unspecified you will be sent forms N9 and N9C (admission form) and N9D (defence and counterclaim form). It is vital that you read the accompanying explanatory notes before choosing which form to send back.   Paying the Small Claim   If you want to make full payment of the amount being claimed against you this amount will be shown on the claim for you have been sent, and will also have details about where to send the money. Don’t forget, this must be done within the 14 day time limit or your case will proceed to the next stage.   In some instances you would like to pay, but need more time, you can give details about the delay you would like on form N9A, which should be in your response pack. It’s also a good idea to read leaflet EX309: The Defendant Admits by claim as this gives more details on this aspect of your case when fixed amounts of money are involved. Leaflet EX308 gives details of cases when unspecified amounts are being claimed against you.   Also please read forms EX326 and EX160A   How to Defend a Claim Against You   Disputed claims are handled by filling in the appropriate form from your response pack. You have three choices: Form N9, N9B or N9D. Read the note accompanying each form carefully to ensure you completely correctly. Pay special attention to the allegations raised on the form. If you don’t respond to each the court will assume you are admitting guilt. Edited April 10, 2014 by stu007 Updated PDF added    1   Bookmark   Report 2 months later...   citizenB   Posted June 5, 2014 #3   PLEASE NOTE - WARNING   Once you have received your claim form - the Court timetable comes into force. Not that of the creditor or claimant. If you have requested information with them after the claim has been issued - or have entered into discussion with them and they say something like "We will put this on hold for a period of time". You cannot and must not ignore the timetable from the court.   This thread should serve as an example   http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?416202&p=4547677#post4547677   The OP in the case above was in communication with the CAG Vodafone rep. A claim was issued during this time. The Rep in good faith said he would ask the Claimant to put things on hold.... they did not.. the OP ignored advice from caggers to continue with the court timetable and did not submit a defence. The claimaint obtained a Judgment by default. Edited June 5, 2014 by citizenB     Bookmark   Report 3 yr AndyOrch changed the title to You have received a Court Claim ISSUED IN ENGLAND & WALES What you need to do   style="text-align: center;">     Thread Locked because no one has posted on it for the last 3638 days. If you need to add something to this thread then   Please click the "Report " link   at the bottom of one of the posts.   If you want to post a new story then Please Start your own new thread That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help    Thanks  This topic is now closed to further replies.  Share Follow3 Go to topic listing Next unread topic Recently Browsing   1 Cagger hugo1963 1,380 Members Viewed hugo1963 4 minutes ago   lolerz 4 hours ago   vicr76 8 hours ago   Moomoo11 Friday at 18:18   London1971 Friday at 11:26   AndyOrch Friday at 11:13   mollie5549 Thursday at 17:21   zyghom Thursday at 13:26   Magnusinfinity May 15   Newdogg06 May 14   Unique May 13   saberguy May 12   Mycathasfleas May 12   WantJustice May 9   Rain clouds May 8   MoltoModerato May 3   George2024 May 1   Badtimes123 April 30   LouLouDev79 April 29   northmonk April 29   mowbli April 29   WornOut55 April 27   paulhn757 April 24   UsedCarMan April 23   robertobaggio April 23   marksheff April 20   anotheruser0000 April 19   TT98 April 18   gatoradeqaz April 17   Murielme2 April 15   Frontera mixup April 11   BreadAndButter April 9   Karalius April 9   nurjeon03 April 9   Penglings April 8   Nick April 8   Edals April 5   thesixco April 1   lifttheveil March 30   dx100uk March 30   Stripeycat March 28   jon8214 March 27   sharkieuk March 25   HappyHolidays March 24   sandokan March 22   SimplyBeyondWords March 22   supernick90 March 20   iyam71 March 20   Nicky Boy March 18   StoryBoard March 18   Myth_007 March 15   kaze March 12   RodeMan March 8   eskimo123 March 7   JEDIKNIGHTS March 6   persha50 March 6   tobzas March 6   lancashirelad93 March 6   HappyDay2222 March 3   1penny March 3   nat8808 March 2   FTMDave March 1   lynzmeek February 25   Mike Mechanic February 25   Ethel Street February 24   Outoftoon February 23   anna may February 22   PJB5 February 22   iamgnome February 21   SweetCaroline February 20   EdinburghDude February 19   Grgw44 February 18   linbren03 February 15   whittymags February 9   flembo45 February 7   comebackjimmy February 6   MontyIsInnocent February 4   libra007 February 1   Eamonn77 January 31   xtonehari January 30   hlh49421 January 30   ceeferace January 29   catscratch January 29   Melbel January 25   Suggababe January 19   yorkshire_lufc January 17   ljrobinson69 January 16   makkyinuk January 15   yogii January 14   MadMat January 12   rocky_sharma January 4   mrskippy21 January 3   lookinforinfo December 29, 2023   europa16 December 28, 2023   MrsSl December 27, 2023   KP44UK December 23, 2023   Montego December 22, 2023   Worazz December 21, 2023   StopTheBullies December 21, 2023   hitman126 December 20, 2023   +1280 More   Have we helped you ...?                     Contact Us   Cookies Copyright Reclaim the Right Ltd - reg: 05783665Powered by Invision Community IPS spam blocked by CleanTalk.  
    • ITV News have got hold of an email and recording of a phone call between Vennells and Ron Warmington of Second Sight. People in the know are saying it's smoking gun everyone's been looking for. I love that this has come out the day before she appears at the inquiry. This should be interesting under oath. Paula Vennells' 'smoking gun' email reveals Post Office 'cover-up' | ITV News WWW.ITV.COM ITV News has acquired an email and recording of a phone call that suggests the former Post Office boss was aware of issues with the Horizon system...  
    • I think you may as well take the opportunity in your letter to tell them that if they won't take responsibility for it then you will see quotations for the repair, provide copies of the quotations to them and then proceed with your own repair and recover the money back from them in the courts if necessary. Separately, can I ask you whether this is the car that you then bought unseen and at some distance from you? Has it come with an MOT and if so what date was the MOT and who gave it the MOT? Have you read our used car guide
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      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

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Cap1 & CCA return


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What bank / CC provider / loan co. ?????

 

Dave

** We would not seek a battle as we are, yet as we are, we say we will not shun it. (Henry V) **

 

see you stand like greyhounds in the slips,

Straining upon the start. The game's afoot:

Follow your spirit; and, upon this charge

Cry 'God for Harry! England and Saint George!'

:D If you think I have helped, informed, or amused you do the clickey scaley thing !! :D

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Pford

 

You are quite correct - they are wrong.

 

Write back and ask them where exactly in the 2006 Act does it specifically relate to agreements prior to its implementation date. Then tell them that they have run out of time and have committed an offence and are in default under the Act. spell it out what they cannot do.

 

Z

 

Thanks for the reply any suggestions on the content of the letter

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Hi Guys!

 

Thought that you might enjoy seeing the two bright white shiny new pieces of paper that were sent to me by MS on 17 February 2007.

Please note the differing dates on the front, MA100040N9999 05/06 and at the bottom MS Bnk Cut 12/04

credit limit zero and on the reverse penalty charges are quoted at £12 as opposed to £20!

 

MSMailer006.jpg

 

and the reverse:-

MSMailer003.jpg

 

MS do not have an agreement...so it appears that they knocked this up

 

Incidentally, I do not have a MS cc Therefore obviously nothing, no card was attached.

 

 

AC

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Guest Battleaxe

Opps MS are playing the silly games Crap One played with us, gave us one with the £12.00 charges on it. hahahahaha

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Firstly, paulwlton...excellent news!! and good for you.

 

Secondly, yes Battleaxe...I thought that you would enjoy my photobucket pics.

 

MS are reliant upon 1983 Regs..regulation 3.

TS do not agree, due to regulation 7.

 

TS have insisted that MS write to me to explain their view!?

Nothing has arrived yet. However I will post the waffle if and when it arrives.

I am aware of what they said to davefirewalker...I guess that I will probably receive the same kind of explanation of the MS view.

 

Love AC

 

Love AC

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put this together any suggestions

 

Thank you for your letter dated the 3rd May 2007 and you comments are noted.

 

As advised in my last letter dated the 30th April 2007 you have a LEGAL OBLIGATION under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 section 78 to supply this information upon request which was made on the 11th July 2006. Failure to comply with a valid request within a period of 12 days (not including the date of receipt of the request) he may not enforce the agreement at all. This prevents enforcement with or without a court order. If a default lasts for a month (for example a calendar month) it constitutes an offence under the said ACT summarily punishable by a Level 4 fine on the standard scale.

 

Consequently I do not acknowledge any debt to the Halifax.

You have had more than enough time to comply with my request. Yet you believe that you are under no such legal obligation to supply the documentation in question under the new terms of the Consumer Credit Act section 15, where exactly in the Consumer Credit Act 2006 does it specifically relate to alleged agreements entered into prior to its implementation date of the said ACT?

 

In any event, I shall expect a written confirmation from you acknowledging the contents of this letter within 5 working days, as per the requirements of section 15.3 of the Banking Code.

 

Yours faithfully

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The Halifax have sent me a copy of an application form, no prescribed terms etc.

They then sent me a set of terms and conditions. I have read the application form, the terms and conditions and the banks standard current account terms and conditions, and nowhere does it state that they can transmit my personal data to third parties, other than insurance companies with regard to PPI or card protection.

Please note: I give advice, in good faith, based on my reading and experience. Please satisfy yourself, that any advice given is accurate in content before acting upon it.

A to Z index

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/site-questions-suggestions/53182-cant-find-what-youre.html

 

...........................................................................

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My Letter

Date 19/03/07

Dear Madame

In response to your letter dated 13 March 2007.

I dispute the debt on two grounds. You state in your letter that you have complied with sec 78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. I contend that you have failed in your obligation has your response does not comply with the requirements under the SI 1983 The Regs No 1557 2 (1). You also state in the above letter that my Credit Card has never been renewed; this statement appears to be incorrect. I would like to draw your attention to sec 85 of the said Act, sec 85 is clear and unambiguous it clearly states that one of the required documents i.e. a copy of the executed Agreement is to be supplied when a Credit Card is renewed and by not supplying one you fail in your obligation under the Act.

On the first of May 2005 my Credit card was renewed. I contend that the Agreement has been unenforceable from this date due to a state of default and has subsequently led to an unjust enrichment. To remedy this I require the refunding of monies taken, I have calculated this to be £224.57.

I will not be making any more payments towards this debt until the dispute has been resolved I hope we can reach an amicable agreement and settle our differences without the need for court action. However, if need be I will vigorously contest any court action you decide to take.

Yours Faithfully

 

 

 

The response

 

I write further to your letter of 19th March 2007 the contents of which have been noted.

 

Hwever, following our telephone conversation today, i am very pleased that we were able to reach an agreement to settle this enquiry for the amount outlined in your letter.

 

Please, therefore, find enclosed a cheque for £224.57 in full and final settlement. In addition to this payment, i have refunded the two charges of £12.00, which wereapplied to your acount whilst this account continued to be in dispute.

 

Paul

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. <br />

Winston Churchill

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hi sorry to jump in but could anyone have a look at a agrement in my thread and comment on letter i have written thanks

voyager

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/other-institutions/87130-voyager9-littlewoods.html

nationwide settled in full 7/06/2007

 

yorkshire bank settled in full 15/06/2007

 

capital one filed at court 06/06/2007 acknowledged 15/6 defence received 30/6 AQ sent 2/7 with application for summary judgement--hearing date 18 sept foe defence to be struck out

 

cahoot filed at court 25/06/2007 to acknowledge default judgement granted 27/06###won###settled in full

 

HBOS filed at court acknowledged 20/06/2007 default judgement granted 16th july so won

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Hi

Regarding earlier comments on this thread about how a document could be enforced if it had the sigs and prescribed terms.

Just to add, of course anything could be enforced the court has the power, no more section127(3) on contracts dated on or after 6th April so all bets are off. No more unenforceable agrements they could enforce a bus ticket.

The question is, is it likely.

I would say as likely as a judge confusing an application form for an aggreement.

 

Lets hope i am right

 

Peter

 

Peter

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

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Hi

Regarding earlier comments on this thread about how a document could be enforced if it had the sigs and prescribed terms.

Just to add, of course anything could be enforced the court has the power, no more section127(3) on contracts dated on or after 6th April so all bets are off. No more unenforceable agrements they could enforce a bus ticket.

The question is, is it likely.

I would say as likely as a judge confusing an application form for an aggreement.

 

Lets hope i am right

 

Peter

 

Peter

 

Just to add to this very interesting post about the implications of the cca 2006 s.15 aspect by Richard Spud

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collectors-debt-collection/87159-balir-oliver-scott-2.html#post797483

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Hi Guys!

 

Thought that you might enjoy seeing the two bright white shiny new pieces of paper that were sent to me by MS on 17 February 2007.

Please note the differing dates on the front, MA100040N9999 05/06 and at the bottom MS Bnk Cut 12/04

credit limit zero and on the reverse penalty charges are quoted at £12 as opposed to £20!

 

 

MS do not have an agreement...so it appears that they knocked this up

 

Incidentally, I do not have a MS cc Therefore obviously nothing, no card was attached.

 

 

AC

 

Hi AC

 

they sent me the exact same thing....... and a few fob off letters since

 

but the have picked on the wrong guy if the want an easy ride......

 

I am so having a go at them :)

 

Dave

** We would not seek a battle as we are, yet as we are, we say we will not shun it. (Henry V) **

 

see you stand like greyhounds in the slips,

Straining upon the start. The game's afoot:

Follow your spirit; and, upon this charge

Cry 'God for Harry! England and Saint George!'

:D If you think I have helped, informed, or amused you do the clickey scaley thing !! :D

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Sorry - wrong thread!

VITAL - IF YOU HAVE AN ISSUE ABOUT THE INCREASED BAILIFFS' POWERS TO BREAK INTO YOUR HOME AND USE FORCE IN ORDER TO GET YOUR GOODS THEN JOIN THE PETITION HERE:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.c o....l#post53879 9

 

Anyone seeing this who wants to help by copying it to their signature please do.

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Hi AC

 

they sent me the exact same thing....... and a few fob off letters since

 

but the have picked on the wrong guy if the want an easy ride......

 

I am so having a go at them :)

 

Dave

 

Hi Dave...I take comfort in the fact that I am obviously not alone!

 

As you know I have reported the Offence to my local TS who in turn reported it to the Tower Hamlets TS.

MS are reliant upon 1983 Regs. regulation 3 and because of that reg., state that they have complied.

TS do not agree due to 1983 Regs. regulation 7.

 

To date MS have not put into writing to me regarding their regulation 3 argument. However, TS have insisted that MS write to me setting out their view and apparently I should receive their letter shortly...Hmmm!?

I am sure that if I receive the aforementioned correspondence, it will be jargon and waffle.

Perhaps a similar letter to yours:-

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/84285-ccas-dave-against-world.html?highlight=davefirewalker#post760385

 

Morgan Stanley have picked on the wrong person if they think that they can get away with this blatant deception, I will fight them to the bitter end.

 

AC

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Hi Dave...I take comfort in the fact that I am obviously not alone!

 

As you know I have reported the Offence to my local TS who in turn reported it to the Tower Hamlets TS.

MS are reliant upon 1983 Regs. regulation 3 and because of that reg., state that they have complied.

TS do not agree due to 1983 Regs. regulation 7.

 

To date MS have not put into writing to me regarding their regulation 3 argument. However, TS have insisted that MS write to me setting out their view and apparently I should receive their letter shortly...Hmmm!?

I am sure that if I receive the aforementioned correspondence, it will be jargon and waffle.

Perhaps a similar letter to yours:-

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/84285-ccas-dave-against-world.html?highlight=davefirewalker#post760385

 

Morgan Stanley have picked on the wrong person if they think that they can get away with this blatant deception, I will fight them to the bitter end.

 

AC

 

Hi

 

If all that MS has sent you is this new generic version of

'an agreement' (complete with the new default charge of £12!) then they definitely have not complied, because this is not the agreement that was executed. A copy of the agreement that you signed would show the original default charge amounts for a start! It also would not have quoted a Total Charge for Credit, as this is a new requirement under the 2006 CCA amendments.

 

But I am very confused as to why TS are referring to section 7 of the 'copies and Notices' regs:

 

7.--(1) Where an agreement has been varied in accordance with section 82(1) of the Act, every copy of the executed agreement given to a debtor, hirer or surety under any provision of the Act other than section 85(1) shall include either-

(a) an easily legible copy of the latest notice of variation given in accordance with section 82(1) of the Act relating to each discrete term of the agreement which has been varied; or

(b) an easily legible statement of the terms of the agreement as varied in accordance with section 82( 1) of the Act.

(2) Where a security provided in relation to a regulated agreement has been varied, every copy of the security instrument relating to it given to a debtor, hirer or surety under any provision of the Act shall include either-

(a) an easily legible copy of any document varying the security; or (b) an easily legible statement of the terms of the security as varied.

As far as I can see, this section applies where an agreement has been varied (where this is allowed in the agreement) and requires that in addition to the copy of the executed agreement, the creditor must send a copy of any notice of variation that might have been previously sent to you, or a statement of the varied terms.

 

The rest of this section applies to agreements where security has been provided.

 

I don't see how this relates in any way to the core requirement for the creditor to send a copy of the original executed agreement (with or without signatures, as is permitted)? :???:

 

Regards, Pam

VITAL - IF YOU HAVE AN ISSUE ABOUT THE INCREASED BAILIFFS' POWERS TO BREAK INTO YOUR HOME AND USE FORCE IN ORDER TO GET YOUR GOODS THEN JOIN THE PETITION HERE:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.c o....l#post53879 9

 

Anyone seeing this who wants to help by copying it to their signature please do.

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Hi Pam

 

I am also confused now....

 

in my letter they ARE relying on reg 7

 

--------------

 

True Copy

 

Section 78(1) of the Act states that, amongst other things, the creditor shall give the debtor a copy of the executed agreement. The Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983 (“the Regulations”) provide that any copy of the agreement supplied to a debtor should be a ‘true’ copy. Regulation 3(2) provides that a copy may omit certain information, including the signature box, signature and date of signature.

 

The copy provided by us to you is a ‘true’ copy even if the signature box and/or signatures are not included.

 

An agreement which has been varied

 

As the terms of your Agreement have varied since you originally applied for a credit card, Regulation 7 of the Regulations allows us to provide you with a “true copy” which sets out the terms and conditions current at the time of provision of the copy.

 

As the copy of the agreement sent to you on 27 March 2007 represents the present terms of your agreement, we have provided you with a copy of the executed agreement as prescribed by section 78 of the Act.

 

----------------------

 

they are so wrong

 

Dave

** We would not seek a battle as we are, yet as we are, we say we will not shun it. (Henry V) **

 

see you stand like greyhounds in the slips,

Straining upon the start. The game's afoot:

Follow your spirit; and, upon this charge

Cry 'God for Harry! England and Saint George!'

:D If you think I have helped, informed, or amused you do the clickey scaley thing !! :D

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I am also confused now....

 

in my letter they ARE relying on reg 7

 

--------------

 

 

Well, I am EVEN MORE confused now!

 

AC has stated that TS are relying on section 7 to show that MS have not complied, but you are now saying that MS are relying on section 7 to show that they have!! :???: :???:

 

Regards, Pam

VITAL - IF YOU HAVE AN ISSUE ABOUT THE INCREASED BAILIFFS' POWERS TO BREAK INTO YOUR HOME AND USE FORCE IN ORDER TO GET YOUR GOODS THEN JOIN THE PETITION HERE:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.c o....l#post53879 9

 

Anyone seeing this who wants to help by copying it to their signature please do.

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:confused: HELP PLEASE.......

 

NatWest are in breach of a CCA 1974 Section 77/78 request. They have written to me saying that they cannot provide a properly executed copy of my credit card agreement. However they have passed the debt to Triton Credit Services who have written to me about settlement.

 

Am I right in thinking that whilst they are in breach of a CCA request they cannot pass the debt to a DCA?

 

Coincidentally Capital One have just done the same - different DCA though - no copy of card agreement but pursuing the debt.

I requested advice in a seperate thread - see below - but none was forthcomming

 

"NatWest in breach of CCA 1974 what now?"

 

Any advice will be gratefully received, Cheers ROS :confused:

RiPoFfStOpPeR

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Natwest has said that? In writing? Perfect. Write to the DCA include a copy of the letter. Tell them you do not recognise this debt and that without a properly executed agreement (in this case any agreement) it is unenforceable in court. Any attempts to pursue this will be vigorously defended. Also check if they have any defaults against you and you must insist they remove them within five days. If they don't send a letter before action and take out an N1 against whoever is registering your personal data. You would also be entitled to complain to Trading Standards and the Information Commissioner and I would do so.

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you are correct in that whilst in default they can no longer take any action regarding the debt. this includes passing it on to third parties.

 

I would write them a letter telling them that they are in default of your s78 request and until they produce the docs they cannot take any further action. however as they are in default and have comitted an offence you will be reporting them to the regulatory bodies concerned. cc this to the dca and sit back and wait for the fun to start.

 

rgds

 

Dave

 

send something like this, suitably edited of course

 

---------------------------

 

I refer to my letters dated XXXXXXXX which was delivered via recorded delivery to your offices on XXXXXXXX, and my follow up letter dated XXXXXXXX.

 

In my letter xxxxxxI made a formal request for a copy of the signed, executed credit agreement for the above numbered XXXXXXXX account under section 77(1) and section 78(1) of the Consumer Credit Act. In addition a statement of my account should have been sent along with any other document mentioned in the credit agreement.

 

The Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for this request to be carried out before your company enter into a default situation. If the request is not satisfied after a further 30 calendar days, Your company commit an offence. These time limits expired on XXXXXXXX and XXXXXXXX respectively.

 

As you are no doubt aware subsection (6) states:

 

If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

 

(a) He is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement; and

(b) If the default continues for one month he commits an offence.

 

Therefore as at XXXXXXXX this account became unenforceable at law and it is now my intention to refer this matter to the enforcement authorities.

 

Any default notices or adverse comments your company have recorded on my credit reference file should be immediately removed.

 

Failure to respond favourably to this letter within seven (7) days of receipt will result in immediate litigation being commenced against your company without further notice.

 

I await your rapid response.

** We would not seek a battle as we are, yet as we are, we say we will not shun it. (Henry V) **

 

see you stand like greyhounds in the slips,

Straining upon the start. The game's afoot:

Follow your spirit; and, upon this charge

Cry 'God for Harry! England and Saint George!'

:D If you think I have helped, informed, or amused you do the clickey scaley thing !! :D

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Thank you Rhia and davefirewalker for your replies. Dave, I did send a letter along the lines of your suggested draft on the 23rd April and I copied the OFT and FSA informing them of the breach of the CCA.

 

The OFT have not responded and the FSA replied that they are unable to intervene in individual cases. They go on to say that CCs do not come under their remit.

 

In the meantime NatWest have done what they will always do and that is to carry on sublimely ignoring anything that they choose to regardless of the law or public opinion.

 

So they have sold the debt whilst being in breach of the CCA1974 S77/S78 for failing to provide a copy of the properly executed document and I quote..."It is not that I am refusing to send you a copy of the original agreement, the reason I am not able to send this to you is because I have not been able to locate it. After a number of extensive searches, it has not been possible to find the original agreement for this account" ... and this was signed by a senior customer advisor.

 

So Rhia in the light of this info is it OK to write to the DCA along the lines you've suggested? Cheers ROS

RiPoFfStOpPeR

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Yes. Most definitely and the DCA should refer it back to Natwest. I wouldn't let up on either party though as it may come back to bite you. Lay it to rest once and for all and use all the statutory bodies you can.

I would send it in writing to your local Trading Standards office. I and others have amixed experience of TS but I think this is so obvious they must act.

What you want is for Natwest to say officially that because they cannot find this agreement the debt will have to be written off. If they really don;t respond there is nothing to stop you taking out a civil action. If you have written as Dave suggests alter it slightly with a clear heading LETTER BEFORE ACTION. Tell them that they have failed to reply to your letter dated XXX.Unless they produce the agreement you will have no option but to start court action. Give them a get out and say if they have no agreement they will be unable to pursue you, process your personal data or assign this debt to a DCA so you would like a letter saying that they agree not to do any of that and give them a reasonable amount of time to reply - say 14 days and warn them you will issue an N1 and mean it. It may concnetrate their minds. Also justa thought I would find out the name of their legal person and not bother with customer services. they have no legal training and will be unable to appreciate just how much trouble Natwest is in. Illegally processing your personal data alone can attract a prison sentence. Hope this helps

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