sec 21(4) a notice because we called environmental health on landlord

[boggey1]

well arrived today notice from letting agent,because we called environmental health haresssment maybe, loged on the police 06 07 2011.

notice dated 08.07.2011 funny that.

police coming formally monday for statemnts have loads or evedence recordings , letters from old tenants and friends he abused for coming to see me .

help i dont want the coppers to not do any thing .

[rebel11]

Thread moved.

[boggey1]

When its moved how do I find it ,lol

[rebel11]

You found it:-)

 

In the meantime 10 and 11 might be of interest in my signature.

 

When its moved how do I find it ,lol

[cerberusalert]

You've already found it by replying.

[raydetinu]

section 21 notice must be filled out correctly and only the LL can issue this not agent.

is LL aware the agent has done this?

Notice is only the first step to eviction.

[Ed999]

My comments only apply if the premises are entirely within England and Wales, and you were granted a shorthold tenancy (under which you - and your spouse/partner/children, if any - have exclusive use of a seperate dwelling, which is not shared with another tenant nor with the landlord), and you were over 18 years of age when the tenancy was granted, and the rent is less than £2,083 per month.

 

This posting is supplemental to the information in this forum's "sticky" threads and is NOT to be read in isolation.

 

If you are a shorthold tenant, with a periodic tenancy, you can be evicted from the premises by simply being given 2 months notice, in writing, taking effect after the initial six months ends (expiring on the last day of a rent period). No reason has to be given. Where a dispute arises, concerning any matter, the landlord can simply end the tenancy in that way.

 

 

Notice to End a Tenancy

 

If no fixed term was agreed, or it has ended, a periodic tenancy arises (with a period of one week or one month, depending whether rent is paid weekly or monthly).

 

To end a periodic tenancy, the landlord must give 2 months notice in writing, expiring on the last day of a rent period (but if the tenancy agreement requires a longer period of notice, the landlord must give that longer period of notice). The notice CANNOT take effect during the first 6 months.

 

 

Where the tenant paid a rent deposit after 5th April 2007, if the deposit has not been protected (under the Tenancy Deposit Scheme) any section 21 notice given to the tenant is invalid, so cannot end the tenancy.

 

If a valid notice is given, and the tenant moves out (and returns all the keys) on or before the termination date in the notice, the tenancy - and the rent - ceases on that date.

 

If a valid notice is given, but the tenant does not move out by the termination date in the notice, the landlord must then apply for a court order (he cannot apply until AFTER the termination date in the notice), which usually takes a further month to obtain.

 

 

If there is a fixed term tenancy (e.g. a 12 month fixed duration, or a 6 month fixed duration) the landlord can't give notice to end a fixed term early, unless a provision in the agreement - called a "break clause" - allows that.

 

 

The landlord commits a criminal offence if he tries to evict the tenant without a court order, or harasses the tenant to try to force the tenant to leave, e.g. by cutting off the gas / water / electricity, etc.

[mariner51]

Why did OP contact Environ Health Dept? Also what has OP reported to the Police?

 

As Edd has said LL can seek a Court Order for re-possession after serving a 'no fault' s21Notice at any prescribed time after the end of the fixed period. No LL likes being reported to EH and this may have rel (troublesome T?) in the LL mind but cannot be assumed.

 

I feel there is a lot of T/LL history to OPs post.

[Ed999]

Calling in Environmental Health is the equivalent of "going nuclear", because it always sours the relationship between landlord and tenant. It'll do that even if the relationship was previously good.

 

A tenant who has a fixed term contract can, perhaps, cope with the fall out which this option is bound to produce. But it rarely makes sense with a periodic tenancy.

 

If there is only a periodic tenancy, this option is only really safe if the tenant's deposit has not been protected, thus the landlord can't serve a valid section 21 notice.

[Aequitas]

section 21 notice must be filled out correctly and only the LL can issue this not agent.

 

An agent can serve a section 21 notice.

[Aequitas]

If a valid notice is given, and the tenant moves out (and returns all the keys) on or before the termination date in the notice, the tenancy - and the rent - ceases on that date.

 

What is your authority for this proposition?

[Ed999]

Where the tenant paid a rent deposit after 5th April 2007, if the deposit has not been protected (under the Tenancy Deposit Scheme) any section 21 notice given to the tenant is invalid, so cannot end the tenancy.

 

If a valid notice is given, and the tenant moves out (and returns all the keys) on or before the termination date in the notice, the tenancy - and the rent - ceases on that date.

 

If a valid notice is given, but the tenant does not move out by the termination date in the notice, the landlord must then apply for a court order (he cannot apply until AFTER the termination date in the notice), which usually takes a further month to obtain.

 

 

The words I have highlighted in bold are the effect of the 1988 Housing Act.

 

Where the section 21 notice is valid, because the deposit has been protected by the landlord, if the tenant vacates by the date stated in the section 21 notice the tenancy ends.

 

This is pretty uncontraversial stuff. What's your problem with it?

 

 

Are you perhaps intending to refer me to section 5 (1A) -

 

 

(1A) Where an order of the court for possession of the dwelling-house is obtained, the tenancy ends when the order is executed

 

 

As is clear from that wording of that sub-section, it applies only where an order of the court for possession is obtained, not where one is unnecessary.

 

 

Have you come across a reported decision in which the landlord has succeeded in a claim for rent arising after a tenancy has been terminated, by the tenant vacating on the date required by the section 21 notice?

[raydetinu]

Ok agents can serve a notice, but it must be signed by the LL or stating that it is signed on his behalf.

[Ed999]

Ok agents can serve a notice, but it must be signed by the LL or stating that it is signed on his behalf.

 

 

Oh dear. I thought I'd ducked this particular controversy.

 

I can certainly see where you're coming from. And what you say is a good practical rule of thumb.

 

But if the Letting Agent was involved in the granting of the tenancy, and/or has been receiving the rent or managing the property during the tenancy, then you'd have a real thin time trying to convince a Court that the tenant didn't know the Letting Agent was the landlord's agent, which is what you'd have to prove if you allege that the section 21 notice of termination is invalid.

[raydetinu]

agree, I cant realy see an agent doing it of his own back; should say in notice that he is acting on behalf of LL;

after all contract is withh LL.

[mariner51]

If there is an existing contract agreememt between LL and LA or other specialist company to act as agent for LL, I would think the 'agent' could sign documents and Notices, with verbal permission & without requirement for LL sig. on the actual Notice ( ASTs excepted in most cases) Hell, most Ts don't seem to know who their LL is! T has contract with LL Agreed, but I think a Court would accept LA signature 'if lawfully acting on behalf of the LL'. I think many LLs paying for a full management servicewould hope so esp if LL/LA management contract specifies issue of required Notices on T, or if acting for LL in a specific T dispute. The Court may wish to see the actual LL/LA agreement.

Just my opinion.

[read]

like you I called the Env Dept on Landlord but Section 21 was served prior to his calling the letting agent. Apparently they thought I was complaining about repairs. Funny that, my consumer box was so unsafe that even the electrician couldn't finish his electric safety report. Storage heaters were working at 1/3 capacity and had sewage-like smells in kitchen and bathroom. So, when they go for possession order on what grounds could they possibly use? I don't have any rent arrears and I haven't damaged the property.

[MrShed]

They dont need grounds, S21 is notice for possession that requires no grounding, other than they wish to evict.

[boggey1]

ok lt started to be as soon as we moved in feb 09 ,said dog messed in next doors garden within 24 hours , may of done this as next door had similiar issues of abuse with him .He may have hoped i would of gone round there all guns blazing . ,they have since become very good friends and are willing to go to court ,to back up his poor service an abusive behavior .log in note book LL abusiveness from that moment ,we were fobbed off for the first 6 months after the STT TURNED INTO A PERIODIC TENANCY went to police and told he was abusive, guy on the desk said its a civil matter between LL and T ,great took leagle november 2010 advice she said was basicly dont rock the boat as he can throw you out sec 21 a ,sitll abused us bangs on door at the latest 9.20 pm telling us hes going to keep our deposit as he has kept next doors for the state of there garden. then pops up telling our deposit is in aholding company ere the letter ,he is right ,so helps towards valid notice .

in the end we were so dihearted went to our mp he worte to council housing had meeting , they wrote to LL telling him the way he was acting was not exceptable Quiet enjoyment he sent him the housing act 50 pages ofit , that was on jan 11 2011 .

[boggey1]

17 may inpection En /Health .27 of may got letter from housing stating housing act 2004 three catagory two hazards were found an formal action will be taken, then we get notice

police been still wanted the civil side but made em see it as harrassment issued him a notice today ,but didnt want to do anything under the 1977 eviction act said different as civil side i explained surly that is harrassment issueing sec 21 after he had been told he was harrassing us. much love to all .home less in seven weeks and she wonders why iwas a bit emotional

[boggey1]

Sorry for long bits only just seen all extra bits on here ,cheers all,oh leagalaid solicitor varified leagality of the notice check date s and paper work and it was in a holding company

[MrShed]

This is a weakness in the law unfortunately, but I'm sorry I totally disagree with you that a landlord enforcing what is an absolute legal right of his constitutes harrassment, continuing or otherwise.

[boggey1]

ok but he has only issued this because we called enviro because of his failing as a landord .isnt 1977 act there to prevent eviction ? much love

[MrShed]

It is there to prevent unlawful eviction. Eviction via the S21 notice is not unlawful. But I agree that it is a weakness that this is allowed following EH calls.

[boggey1]

bummer ,lol ,my main gripe in all this is that if the government wants to have the private sector make up for lack of housing , give our money in the form of Housing benefit more than a mortgage in many cases ,then when LL behave like this its them and us as tax payers sorting out the mess out .

I going politics as fed up with daft systems pay the mortgage on property's at least then you have a asset that can be returned as a type council house ?

Can do much else lungs are knackered after chemo but cured now ,

recon we are just going to except that if your don't do anything wrong no one give two ****s,

really sad as gave my land to mum when had cancer, saved enough now for planning for eco house ,plus as im not one to do nothing started a property clearance business even if i do spit blood up if over do it lol